Fixing hole in side of block

[joesmith123]

The valves in the head are super easy, push the spring down with the valve held up and remove the two keepers, then the valve will come out.

yes, I watched a video last night, the guy had a huge clamp going around the block, pushed onto the spring, took out the keepers with needle nose

I dont have a clamp big enough to wrap around the head

I want to do exactly what this guy does in this video, what is called "valve job"

Polish the valves, especially where they sit, and polish the head to make sure they sit tight in their seat

2 main tasks this week:

1. refurbish the head

2. Remove all pistons, polish everything

Rig it back up enough to do compression test

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

You don't need a spring compression tool for Kubota heads, the springs are super light!
Just push down on the sides of the spring.
If your feeling you can't push then down you can normally rent a spring compressor at a auto parts store.
There is a much smaller version available.

https://www.harborfreight.com/overhead-valve-spring-compressor-59343.html?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=17889101751&campaignid=17889101751&utm_content=168028627848&adsetid=168028627848&product=59343&store=3145&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjwsPCyBhD4ARIsAPaaRf0STeDd9rVQVYwYcTDP-uAI5uOXALURFlNjH71_upLqP0V6C6b3lTYaAiQAEALw_wcB

 

[joesmith123]

Brushed everything with diesel

Removed shaft that goes to front axle

Removed entire front axle in one piece

Picked up axle assembly using 3 point hitch on bx1500

June 2, 2024

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Moved axle assembly away from work area

Hit the block with brush on drill, dipping in diesel often



Hit the top of the block with 6 inch soft wire wheel on variable polisher, 800 rpm, rotated crankshaft using oil filter tool to get the piston to the top point, hit it softly with 800 rpm wire wheel, did each piston twice

Hit the block with parts cleaner

Removed tons of sludge

Other side

Summary of all tasks: scrubbed with brush entire engine, hit the entire thing with air, removed steering, had to cut the bolt because rusted/welded, removed bottom propeller, moved support blocks from axle to transmission areas, removed water pump, fan, removed front axle, moved axle using chains and 3 point hitch, hit the block with nylon brush on drill, hit the top of the block with low speed 6 inch soft wire wheel applying diesel often with brush, hit all nooks and crannies with compressed air, hit the entire block with parts cleaner using airless sprayer

Need: 3 inch abrasive ball to strip interior of cylinders (600 grit), 3 inch foam ball to polish inside of cylinders, a way to put these attachments on the variable speed polisher, I ordered a chuck kit that might make that possible, dremel for when cleaning all the crannies on the head and the short block

Next steps: drain and remove oil pan, carefully remove each piston, paying attention to which way they are pointed, keep track of the bolts and exactly how it is fastened, label it using cardboard and sharpies

 

[joesmith123]

Rebuilding the head

Built a table out of a pallet to work on the head, raked all the rocks off of the shop floor

Hit the flat surface of the head with: stripping disc 4.5 inch on variable speed polisher, 800 rpm

Best trick to take out valve springs: put the head on a table vice, get a ball joint separator, leverage it to push the spring back, then go in there with pic and get the holder out

zoomed out picture

Thick sludge dried on valve stems, none of them bent

Took out valves, hit the sludge with combination of: brass wire wheel on drill, dremel with rock attachment for the areas where the valve sits, apply diesel with the brush, hit it with the abrasives, then hit it with compressed air, did that 6-7 times, also with smaller drill: hit all the holes with pipe cleaner attachment

Picture after I spent 2 hours with 3 or different tools with different attachments

Another picture inside where the valves sit, I still have to hit with buffing wheel and 3m foam polisher

Valves before cleaning

Valves after cleaning: spend 2 hours going one by one, polisher on table rotating with 4.5 inch stripping disc running on 1500 rpm, then I go through each one, hitting all angles, stripping the dried sludge, finish much smoother than before

 

[dragfan66]

Those valves and seats need professional attention.
I would load all the valve components and head and take it to a machine shop.

They can check the flatness of the head for you too.

 

[joesmith123]

Hit all the head parts with high speed keystone buffer, 7 inch

Hitting the top of the block with 4.5 inch nylon stripping disc, 2000 rpm, high force

Getting ready to hit top of block and top of pistons with 7 inch keystone buffing pad, 2800 rpm

Up close after I hit cylinder liner with wire wheel on drill

Top of piston very smooth

Hit the inside of the piston liner with 3 inch foam ball on drill

Picture after hitting it hard with wire wheel, stripping disc, keystone buffing pad, and 3 inch ball on drill for the piston liners, also hit all the smaller holes with wire wheel pipe cleaner on small drill

took out the oil pan, oil pan filled with sludge, oil pan suction also filled with sludge

This is the progress so far, next step:

setup an area for where you are marking all the bolts and pistons using cardboard, when removing each bolt (or anything), instantly put it in the cardboard and label it using sharpie

My understanding: how that piston assembly connects to the rod journal on the crankshaft, keep that same orientation

June 6, 2024

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Video of the engine spinning, connected it to battery, spun the engine without the head attached. Critique the sound. Does it maybe sound like there is a knock? That top piston, notice the pitting. I hit it as hard as you can imagine with everything possible, I could not get the pitting to to get better than that

That is the piston where I showed pitting in the head, and that there was head damage

 

[joesmith123]

Took out pistons

Two of the pistons had damage to the top part, in between the rings, there is damage to the piston head

Those are the parts of the pistons that come out with them once piston popped out of the block

June 7, 2024

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After removing pistons, I rotated crank by hand, listen to the sound, do you hear that grinding/rattling? Something is loose in there

Decided to keep taking parts off, got area ready to remove front block cover

Removed the springs, removed all the bolts, hit the edges with air chisel, very light, separated it

Piston lined up with broken pieces next to them, only front piston did not have damage

Sprayed diesel on the gears, then hit them with wire wheel on drill

Hit it with diesel and then compressed air

Stopped here, need to go watch videos closely of how to proceed

 

[TECH101]

Time for new engine

 

[joesmith123]

Ok yes, I am fixing to go start taking gears out, but let me know if this statement is true:

With the pistons removed and the the transmission in neutral, spinning the main crank should produce ZERO sound

Any sound produced when spinning the crank, is bad news

Are these statements correct?

Another convincing detail it needs new crank bearings:

When spinning it, it does not spin smoothly, some parts spin freely with less resistance, the parts where there is grinding sound, it is harder to spin

 

[MountainMeadows]

I commend your efforts! Where there's a Will there's a Way!

You could get some valve lapping compound and a lapping stick to lap the valves yourself. That will show you how much of the area on the valve is sealing and also the sealing area on the valve seat in the head. By the looks of things, and as mentioned above, you're most likely looking at a trip to the machine shop.

Any grinding sounds while spinning is not good. There's a problem.

 

[joesmith123]

I cannot get the timing gears to line up

none of the gears match

how do I take out that collar in the picture?

What I have already tried: hit the entire area with torch, then then the top of the collar with air chisel, I tried slightly tapping on it with hammer

The video I watched, they do not have this collar

I just watched this video, it looks like I need to start with top right gear, I'll keep trying to figure it out

 

[fried1765]

I cannot get the timing gears to line up

View attachment 130323

none of the gears match

View attachment 130325

how do I take out that collar in the picture?

What I have already tried: hit the entire area with torch, then then the top of the collar with air chisel, I tried slightly tapping on it with hammer

The video I watched, they do not have this collar

I just watched this video, it looks like I need to start with top right gear, I'll keep trying to figure it out

See post #68!

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

The gears only match up every 268 revolutions, and it doesn't matter what position they are in when you remove them, they will just need to be set when you reassemble it, which is very easy.

You're too the point where you need to remove the motor from the rest of the tractor.
You're got gaining anything with it in there.

You need to pull the key way to remove the seal race, it will just be snug to the crank.

You need to remove the rods from the pistons and see if they are all exactly the same length.

You are going to need a complete rebuild kit with pistons, but you will not know which pistons to get till you mic the cylinder bores.

 

[joesmith123]

ok yes I'll get ready to separate tractor from engine

took off injection pump/hydraulic gears, separated hydraulics

I need to: build support structure under block, move other support structure (its blocking some bolts of the bell housing)

Later on I'll figure out how to remove the front collar that is being blocked

Now I'll focus on separating engine from tractor

 

[joesmith123]

Separated block from tractor

This is where I am stuck

You need to pull the key way to remove the seal race, it will just be snug to the crank.

I need to understand this statement, I'm looking for a video to help visualize

Then once that collar and what is blocking it is removed, in this picture, he is using a gear puller

I do not have a gear puller, do I need a gear puller?

Ok i'll go watch videos and try to figure it out, and organize the garage

In this clip, he is hammering on the crankshaft, and the gear pops out without gear puller, but he doesnt have that object blocking the collar from exiting

 

[Russell King]

To answer some of the questions you have posed.

Turning a crankshaft in the block should be a fairly quiet process. Yours sounds bad. Not sure but probably the bearings are failing or failed already.

The thing you have labeled as “OBJECT” is a key that is half in the shaft and the other half is sticking out to drive the pulley that you previously removed.

I believe that @North Idaho Wolfman meant to state something like this: The key must be removed from the shaft keyway and then the collar and gear will slide off (in the direction of your yellow arrow).

That key might be difficult to get out but I am sure it will come out of the shaft. I also assume you have removed some sorts of keys from shafts before. This one appears to be a reactangular key with the ends rounded and sits into a flat bottom slot in the shaft. Do not try to hammer on one end to get it out like you can with the Woodruff style keys that are kind of half circles.

If you don’t mind having to replace it then try grabbing it with pliers and pull up (outwards) on one end and see if it moves. Then progress up in pliers and damage until it is out. I guess you could spray penetrating oil around it and let it sit overnight, then clean the half you need to grab so it is less slippery.

 

[joesmith123]

To answer some of the questions you have posed.

Turning a crankshaft in the block should be a fairly quiet process. Yours sounds bad. Not sure but probably the bearings are failing or failed already.

The thing you have labeled as “OBJECT” is a key that is half in the shaft and the other half is sticking out to drive the pulley that you previously removed.

I believe that @North Idaho Wolfman meant to state something like this: The key must be removed from the shaft keyway and then the collar and gear will slide off (in the direction of your yellow arrow).

That key might be difficult to get out but I am sure it will come out of the shaft. I also assume you have removed some sorts of keys from shafts before. This one appears to be a reactangular key with the ends rounded and sits into a flat bottom slot in the shaft. Do not try to hammer on one end to get it out like you can with the Woodruff style keys that are kind of half circles.

If you don’t mind having to replace it then try grabbing it with pliers and pull up (outwards) on one end and see if it moves. Then progress up in pliers and damage until it is out. I guess you could spray penetrating oil around it and let it sit overnight, then clean the half you need to grab so it is less slippery.

ok yes I think I understand

I will try: place the chisel facing it parallel to crankshaft, then strike trying to uplift it from the crankshaft

I’ll draw visualization next time I’m around computer

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

ok yes I think I understand

I will try: place the chisel facing it parallel to crankshaft, then strike trying to uplift it from the crankshaft

I’ll draw visualization next time I’m around computer

Much easier way, clamp a pair of voice grips to the key then 2 pry bars on either side under the vice grips and it will pop right out.

 

[joesmith123]

took out the key

Setup for how I hammered out the crankshaft. I put the towel to not let gear dig into the block, bad idea, next time, I will put metal in between block and gear before hammering down on crankshaft

Hammer on the crankshaft let it fall until the collar and the gear were touching. Then I go in with air chisel pushing collar up, notice I destroyed the washer in between them. This was the best way I found without gear puller.

removed crankshaft assembly

Indentation of gear into block

I'm pointing to center piston liner, it is a bit shifted down

12 mm wrench for reference, few mm gap in piston liner and engine block



Got crankshaft on the table, hit wire wheel on drill to reveal the markings so I can understand how to reassemble

Pretty much all the parts that came out to get the crank out. The gear that runs the injection/hydraulic, I noticed loose spinning on the front gear, making some noise. I'll go through and rebuild that one.

Crankshaft with main bearings removed. I noticed the front two bearings did not have the extra shims, the third bearing, had the shims, in the picture, they are next to the gloves

Front two bearings had back and forth movement, 3rd bearing: no back and forth movement

I dont know if it is supposed to be that way, I will study diagram and see if there are parts missing, here is a video demonstrating, first two bearings are more loose, last one, still a bit of a rattle, but less loose

June 9, 2024

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I'll go study diagrams and see if there are parts missing

Ok yes, the diagram shows those parts are correct, bearings on all 3, but rear bearing has additional parts labeled as "metal side"

 

[joesmith123]

Here's a list so far of what parts to get:

All new japanese main bearings, connecting rod bearings, new piston rings for all 3 cylinders, and also 2 new japanese pistons for $150 a piece

I did ask messick specifically about engine balancing if I put in the new pistons, they said:

"Kubota makes the piston heads exactly the same size/spec. Putting in new pistons and keeping the same connecting rods will NOT cause the engine to be unbalanced"

Just this little list alone is $1000 plus shipping

Then, I'm fixing to get a gasket kit from amazon/china/low cost

https://www.amazon.com/OCTOT-D1301-Overhaul-15313-03310-1531303310/dp/B0CP28YLYC?th=1

Please critique my plan, I have not ordered anything yet

I do see entire kits for $500 with new pistons etc, but they are Chinese replicas, I trust them less than Japanese parts

My list will be $1200 so far...

Ok yes I go back and keep wire wheeling/cleaning/scrubbing