I've been sicker ....

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Jchonline

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This is one of the most thoughtful, insightful, cogent, pragmatic, honest, sincere, and forthright posts on this whole fiasco we are all going through right now that I have ever read. Too bad it's all going to get erased when the moderator shows up. I screen-grabbed it so I could rob your eloquent words!
Did you see the title of his other thread? Eloquent indeed.

 
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hagrid

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This is one of the most thoughtful, insightful, cogent, pragmatic, honest, sincere, and forthright posts on this whole fiasco we are all going through right now that I have ever read.
+1
 

aaluck

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it seems strange those same state governments are fine with you choosing to kill yourself however you are not allowed to NOT take a vaccine.
Please tell us in what state you must take a vaccine.
 

troverman

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Please tell us in what state you must take a vaccine.
Every single one where you work in a company that employs >100 people. And some states, like NY and CA, for example, have ordered all state workers to take it.

Of course you don't have to, you'll just lose your job. Some people have worked their entire careers in the same job, with pensions on the line, only to lose it because they can't take the shot in good conscience.
 

Bmyers

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Every single one where you work in a company that employs >100 people. And some states, like NY and CA, for example, have ordered all state workers to take it.

Of course you don't have to, you'll just lose your job. Some people have worked their entire careers in the same job, with pensions on the line, only to lose it because they can't take the shot in good conscience.
Just a little clarification, the OSHA ETS (Emergency Temporary Standard) has not been released yet. Currently, still in development. OSHA doesn't have a good track record with ETS, most end up in court and do not go into effect or stripped to the point that they are nothing like they originally were stated.

Plus, ETS is only in effect for six months the expires and a permanent standard has to be issued. Yet OSHA takes 3-7 years to develop most standards. So, there is a good chance that the 100 or more employee vaccination standard will not go into effect.

Yet, the Federal employee and contractor vaccine requirement has/will go into effect unless a court steps in.
 

aaluck

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Of course you don't have to, you'll just lose your job. Some people have worked their entire careers in the same job, with pensions on the line, only to lose it because they can't take the shot in good conscience.
So the answer is none. We all have our choices to make in life. Seems you believe the same from your other thread....

I'm firmly in the camp of a free people that gets to make their own decisions.

I agree that no one should have to make this decision but an employer also has the right to make decisions for his/her company.
 
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troverman

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Yes, very clever for the current admin to not rush this through OSHA. They were quick to publish that this was coming, knowing many companies would begin adjusting employee handbook policies. They could potentially accomplish what they wanted without being the villain.

Yes, we do all have choices to make. But it is wrong to make someone put something in their body as a condition of employment outside of healthcare. That is unprecedented.
 
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bmblank

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So the answer is none. We all have our choices to make in life. Seems you believe the same from your other thread....

I'm firmly in the camp of a free people that gets to make their own decisions.

I agree that no one should have to make this decision but an employer also has the right to make decisions for his/her company.
It's arguable that a private employer may or may not have the right to mandate something like this for terms of employment.
But that's not what's going on. The choice is being taken away from the employer as well. I suppose they technically have a choice between mandating the vaccine and paying thousands upon thousands of dollars in fines every week.
 

aaluck

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Yes, we do all have choices to make. But it is wrong to make someone put something in their body as a condition of employment outside of healthcare. That is unprecedented.
I absolutely agree with this statement. 100%

The choice is being taken away from the employer as well. I suppose they technically have a choice between mandating the vaccine and paying thousands upon thousands of dollars in fines every week.
You are also correct.
 

jimh406

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As far as business vaccine mandates goes, it’s going to get real once the first person dies, misses a lot of work, or is seriously ill due to the vaccine and they or their survivors sues. It’s just a matter of time, unfortunately.
 

Henro

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Each year, about 650,000 people in the US die from heart disease. Each year, and additional 600,000 die from cancer in the US. Even though this has been going on for years, I still don't see mandated fruits and vegetables, nor do I see fast food or tobacco banned. That "700,000" number is for 18 months, not 12, and there are numerous reports of people being listed as "Covid" when in fact their cause of death was something else.
Do I get in under the wire before thread closure?

This is true, but the one difference is that people that suffer heart disease or cancer or old age, or other things along those lines do not pass that on to others. So it’s not apples and apples, it’s apples and oranges when you make that comparison.

There are a number of illnesses that are passed on from one person to another, and common vaccinations are available for them. What makes this one any different? Beats me….
 

troverman

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Do I get in under the wire before thread closure?

This is true, but the one difference is that people that suffer heart disease or cancer or old age, or other things along those lines do not pass that on to others. So it’s not apples and apples, it’s apples and oranges when you make that comparison.

There are a number of illnesses that are passed on from one person to another, and common vaccinations are available for them. What makes this one any different? Beats me….
The flu kills a lot of old people every year. But we don’t mandate the flu vaccine nor do we prevent people from working or visiting nursing homes. This is no difference.
 

Nicfin36

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The flu kills a lot of old people every year. But we don’t mandate the flu vaccine nor do we prevent people from working or visiting nursing homes. This is no difference.
I've wondered about that myself. But, don't give them any ideas.

I guess it is a non-issue now though since the flu has been eradicated.
 

Jchonline

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I got COVID and survived it. EASILY.

If I hadn't tested for it, I wouldn't have known I had it. I've had worse URI's and problems from the dust and mold in my yard after picking up leaves or mowing grass. Once I figured out what was causing that, I got in the habit of waiting until after rain to cut grass. Made a huge difference in my sinus problems.

Had a little diarrhea on Tuesday (two weeks ago). Nothing real unusual for old people like me with aging nerves and innards, nor did it last more than a day. Had what MIGHT have been some extra aches and pains on Wednesday, but the most particular symptom that I think I had was a dull headache. Barely noticeable, but it stayed with me all day. I normally take a couple acetaminophen in the morning anyway because of neuropathy in both arms and legs, so figuring out if I have new pain is a bit of a challenge. Didn't wanna wake up Thursday. Didn't feel bad, just didn't sleep well the night before (because of the headache), so was pretty sleepy. Asked the missus to get some Quick-Vue home tests. Sure enough, popped positive, but I was the only one in the house that did. The missus and the granddaughters all had the lemming juice (Pfizer), and their 2nd boosters the same day I think I got sick. But I ain't for one minute convinced that the shots prevented anything, except maybe one of the people that came to my house that had the shot was asymptomatic and had a very false sense of security about the miracle drug that actually does very little unless you actually contract the disease. Neither me nor my doctor are convinced of the benefit of a drug that does nothing to stop the spread of disease. At least I know he's not brainwashed by left-wing media.

Went to the PCP on Friday, and yep, he confirmed I indeed had COVID. He was very pleasantly surprised at how mild my symptoms were after 3-4 days. In fact, he kept asking if I was actually having any. Gave me info about monoclonal antibody infusion and prescribed the treatment for me because I qualified (heart problems, high cholesterol, some blockage, over 60, etc, etc. etc.) Scheduled the treatment for Sunday morning. Barely got hooked up to the IV when another dude comes in about my age, and showing symptoms more than I was. Turns out, he'd had the Lemming juice back in February. Lotta good that did for him, because here he was, just like me, getting an IV. Did it prevent him from going to the hospital? Well, at this point, we'll never know, because now he's had monoclonal antibody infusion.

My smeller quit last Monday. I could taste sugar or salt, and that's about it. The advantage to that was not having to smell all the stink bugs Skeets was complaining about in another thread. (silver lining, etc). Otherwise, I still had no fever, still no cough, still no congestion. But for the benefit of the missus and the girls, I slept on the sofa, used only one bathroom, touched NOTHING in the kitchen (except my coffee cup that was about to have water boiled in it) and masked up whenever any of them were in the room. The missus got me an O2 saturation monitor and I was taking my temp every 4 hours. I hit 100.5 on Monday after getting the treatment on Sunday, but was told to expect higher, and be ready to head for the hospital if my temperature went up and stayed up. Didn't happen. Dropped back down to 96.5 that evening, and never broke 99 again, even after taking naps under my knitted blanket.

The worst part was not being able to smell my food or taste it. That'll kill your appetite quick. But I forced the grub (which I knew was actually quite tasty) down my neck just to keep nourishment in me. I added a regimen of 1000 mg Vitamin C, 1000 mg Vitamin D, and 100 mg Zinc to my usually neglectful health habits. I've been working outside all summer on my shop, so got more than my normal share of Vitamin D from the sun. I absolutely love orange juice, and several of my home brew ales have some citrus in them as well, so I probably had my vitamin C levels pegged out too. Which I'm sure contributes to occasional irregularity of the digestive system.

So, two weeks past first symptoms, and I got NADA for symptoms. Tested again Sunday night, and got a negative test. Now all I gotta do is figure out where to get my get-outta-jail-free card that says I don't need no steenking shot because I've recovered from having COVID and now have natural immunity. That's a lot harder to find than all the propaganda about the vaccine that does nothing to prevent the disease.
Ok so let me get this straight.
1. You regularly take a drug that causes over 50,000 Emergency room visits a year Acetaminophen - don't take my word for it here is the data https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15239078/

2. You won't get a vaccine that has been studied/scrutinized by more medical experts than any in history. Don't take my word for it, look here for yourself (over 11,000 publications). https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=covid-19+vaccine

3. Then when you do get COVID (which I am very glad you didn't have severe illness), you are ok with getting REGEN-COV (the monoclonal antibody) that only has 13 publications in one of the most comprehensive resources for medical literature in the world. Again don't take my word for it here is the data. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=regen-cov

Speechless.
 
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Old_Paint

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Ok so let me get this straight.
1. You regularly take a drug that causes over 50,000 Emergency room visits a year Acetaminophen - don't take my word for it here is the data https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15239078/

2. You won't get a vaccine that has been studied/scrutinized by more medical experts than any in history. Don't take my word for it, look here for yourself (over 11,000 publications). https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=covid-19+vaccine

3. Then when you do get COVID (which I am very glad you didn't have severe illness), you are ok with getting REGEN-COV (the monoclonal antibody) that only has 13 publications in one of the most comprehensive resources for medical literature in the world. Again don't take my word for it here is the data. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=regen-cov

Speechless.
More publications makes something better? Or is that more effort to cover something up? If that stuff is so great, how come every doctor on the planet isn't touting it? Maybe REGEN-COV didn't need as many publications to explain how it works, because it actually does work and doesn't need subterfuge and confusion to brainwash the masses? Sometimes, 'nuff said' is the right answer, and more documents that spew the same government propaganda and agenda won't make it any better or worse.

There is but ONE treatment for folks over 55, with heart problems and other immune system deficiencies. It's what it is, as there is NO OTHER TREATMENT for the disease after it is contracted. FACT: NONE of the so-called vaccines actually immunizes anyone from anything. FACT: With no immunization, it will do nothing to stop the spread of the disease. So, please explain it to me again since you like throwing NIH document references around that support big pharma, insurance, and the most corrupt medical system on the planet, WHY would I get a vaccine that does nothing for me? How many of the injections have been nothing but saline? I didn't feel bad before I got the disease, ergo, no reason to seek treatment for something I didn't have yet. There is NO guarantee that the drug will work for everyone, but there have been deaths caused by it. Very nearly covered up, and I'm not convinced that more deaths can be attributed to the 'vaccines' that do nothing except try to trick the immune system into responding to a disease that hasn't yet infected the person. Maybe my immune system didn't need any trickery? If I knew of a place to go to provide blood samples that would help study the disease in reduced symptom cases like I had, I'd let 'em have as much as I could live without. I'd do my part to stop this if my part will indeed help. But getting a shot that does nothing isn't very high on my priority list.

I'm not saying you're wrong or your wonderful sources are. If getting a booster every other day is what you think you need to do for yourself, then by all means, go get 'em and have your false sense of security that you've done something to help mitigate COVID. These drugs simply do not do that, by admission of the companies that made them, and the very government that wants to force me to take it, especially with the new variants. That's all I needed to know. Why do I need more information other than it won't do anything to actually protect me to justify my decision to not get it? THAT is solely what I based my decision on. You can try to bury me with papers and experts if you like. But they've already told me as much as I need to know about a useless drug that now seems to need a 6 month booster cycle. It ain't that I don't want to get a vaccine, it's that I want the damn vaccine to work if I'm going to bother taking it.
 
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