Fixing hole in side of block

[Shadetree605]

I was surprised also to see the results of removing the liners in that fashion with the OP being ok with it.

And for my own knowledge. The old liners should have been PULLED with a liner puller and can not be pressed out thru the bottom of the block , correct ? , due to interference with the block casting ?

you can't pull or press the liners out the bottom, the way the block is made ?, there is no room to remove them from the bottom. they have to be pulled or pressed out through the top. just like any piston has to go in ?, same goes for a sleave or liner, they must go in from the top of the block.

 

[joesmith123]

The shop has to set up on each cylinder, and would be little effort to press out the old ones at that time.

i'm listening

Thousands will make the difference if the new liner will even not spin in the block

What does this statement mean? Are you saying that the liner will not sit tight in that bore, and it will move, because of the chisel marks?

I do have metal files coming from amazon, gonna level out the bore

they think they are saving time and money would be my guess

Exactly, I dont have friends that have a machine shop. Any shop I talk to has major overhead and bills, and if I make them do more work, They would need to charge hundreds of extra $$ to take the liners out, I would be bankrupt and not be able to finish this job

The old liners should have been PULLED with a liner puller and can not be pressed out thru the bottom of the block , correct ? , due to interference with the block casting ?

Correct

I did put together the crankshaft assembly

closeup of thrust bearings, the little gap in the bearing facing the crankshaft

Another closeup of gap on bearing facing crankshaft

New crankshaft bearings

Assembled crankshaft

I do have a torque wrench coming, I do know all bolts need tightened to spec

I'll file that bore before taking to machine shop and smooth it out

In the meantime, finish cleaning all bolts, organize all bolts for reassembly, and start cleaning the parts from the other tractor with the hole in the block

 

[Ktrim]

i'm listening



What does this statement mean? Are you saying that the liner will not sit tight in that bore, and it will move, because of the chisel marks?

I do have metal files coming from amazon, gonna level out the bore



Exactly, I dont have friends that have a machine shop. Any shop I talk to has major overhead and bills, and if I make them do more work, They would need to charge hundreds of extra $$ to take the liners out, I would be bankrupt and not be able to finish this job




Correct

I did put together the crankshaft assembly

View attachment 131722

closeup of thrust bearings, the little gap in the bearing facing the crankshaft

View attachment 131723

Another closeup of gap on bearing facing crankshaft

View attachment 131724

New crankshaft bearings View attachment 131725

Assembled crankshaft

I do have a torque wrench coming, I do know all bolts need tightened to spec

I'll file that bore before taking to machine shop and smooth it out

In the meantime, finish cleaning all bolts, organize all bolts for reassembly, and start cleaning the parts from the other tractor with the hole in the block

The problem is when you start removing metal you make things smaller. Tolerances are now larger. The sleeve is made to be pressed in to fit those Tolerances. You are now making the hole larger which will create larger than designed block bore. The sleeves will not be as tight as they should be.

 

[joesmith123]

The problem is when you start removing metal you make things smaller. Tolerances are now larger. The sleeve is made to be pressed in to fit those Tolerances. You are now making the hole larger which will create larger than designed block bore. The sleeves will not be as tight as they should be.

I completely agree and am listening, my rebuttal:

Once that liner get installed into the bore, it is not honed and has extra metal

If metal is missing from the bore of the block, then less metal will be honed from the liner to match the factory spec

Also, that block is THICK metal, those nicks did probably nothing to affect the diameter and how the liner is going to sit

I reached out to the machine shop, closed until monday

the only thing I can think of doing: keep cleaning, brushing and organizing parts

Also I decided: do not disassemble the block with the hole in it any more, use it as a guide to put together the engine without the hole in it

I already used it once to match all serials on connecting rods and main bearing cases

Also, I did have to grind down a gasket on one end of the main bearings (I forget which one), I need to look at the diagram and get that gasket ready/figure it out, I'll pull up the diagram on kubota website

#40 and #60 in the diagram, I think one of them is rubber #60 (which I still have), and #40 is the fabric that I had to wire wheel,

Another thing I can do: start to rebuild the pistons, I do have a new piston, new rings, and new hardware

I do have a piston (that put a hole in the block) and I can emulate how they put the rings on using that one as a guide...

basically: figure out the gasket situation for reinstalling crankshaft assembly, level out the damage I did to the center bore on the block, put together pistons using assembled piston from other engine, finish cleaning all the parts for tractor I am rebuilding

I'll figure it out

 

[Ktrim]

I completely agree and am listening, my rebuttal:

Once that liner get installed into the bore, it is not honed and has extra metal

If metal is missing from the bore of the block, then less metal will be honed from the liner to match the factory spec

Also, that block is THICK metal, those nicks did probably nothing to affect the diameter and how the liner is going to sit

I reached out to the machine shop, closed until monday

the only thing I can think of doing: keep cleaning, brushing and organizing parts

Also I decided: do not disassemble the block with the hole in it any more, use it as a guide to put together the engine without the hole in it

I already used it once to match all serials on connecting rods and main bearing cases

Also, I did have to grind down a gasket on one end of the main bearings (I forget which one), I need to look at the diagram and get that gasket ready/figure it out, I'll pull up the diagram on kubota website

View attachment 131730

#40 and #60 in the diagram, I think one of them is rubber #60 (which I still have), and #40 is the fabric that I had to wire wheel,

Another thing I can do: start to rebuild the pistons, I do have a new piston, new rings, and new hardware

I do have a piston (that put a hole in the block) and I can emulate how they put the rings on using that one as a guide...

I'll figure it out

Outside diameter on the sleeve is the issue.
You're gonna need piston ring pliers and ring compressor

 

[joesmith123]

Outside diameter on the sleeve is the issue.

I'm with you, I guess we'll see what happens

You're gonna need piston ring pliers and ring compressor

I've seen it done using basic tools, I'm fixing to move the vice closer to the work area, put the piston on the vice while I wrestle the rings on

 

[Ktrim]

I'm with you, I guess we'll see what happens



I've seen it done using basic tools, I'm fixing to move the vice closer to the work area, put the piston on the vice while I wrestle the rings on

You can't wrestle rings on. They will break. If they are not made to the proper gap,which I highly doubt they are you will need a ring grinder as well

 

[Jim L.]

Let me offer a suggestion, because I don't know the answer.

The digs in the cylinder walls are discontinuities that provide a starting point for cracks given temperature variations while running.

Filling by welding introduces its own problems in this situation, due to heating and material differences. Of course, an additional step of boring would be required.

At this point, I would stop and research what impact if any the digs might have.

 

[joesmith123]

Hit the bores with hard wire wheels

Figured out that gasket

This is where that gasket goes

top, 40 year old piston I hit with different wire wheels, bottom, new piston

Put new piston on vice, installed new rings with "N" facing up

Installed new piston rings on 40 year old piston

On connecting rod, there is this part here, do you see the gash in the metal? Next to it: brand new part that replaces it, I am trying to replace it

Put connecting rod on vice, put 18 mm socket, tried hammering down

Did damage to the part, I stopped

What is the proper way to get these out? There should be a tool or a way to get it out properly and install new one. I'll look into it.

 

[Ktrim]

That would again be called a press. They also need to be machined to fit the wrist pins.

 

[whitetiger]

That would again be called a press. They also need to be machined to fit the wrist pins.

He has files coming from Amazon, soooo.

 

[joesmith123]

That would again be called a press. They also need to be machined to fit the wrist pins.

here is one used someone is selling close by

Do yall think it is worth me getting this press? Already there are few instances where I need it: piston pin bushings for the connecting rod, I think there are other bearings that will also need pressing (fuel camshaft bearing)

With this press, I can also turn it into a puller, correct? Where one can secure the part onto it, then latch onto it using contraptions, then raise the press and separate things without damaging them?

I know if I had pressing and pulling capabilities, I would not have damaged those components when removing crankshaft, etc

In the past fixing other machines: I did need this to press in and press out bearings (on older vehicles)

It seems that all shops have these presses, especially if they are engine rebuilding or doing any kind of moderate mechanical work

With this machine press, I can push out and push in the new piston pin bushings?

its called "piston pin bushing"

With that press, if the engine block can fit it, then I can also press in the liners, I am guessing...

I will not hammer on the connecting rod until I figure it out, in the meantime, keep cleaning the rest of the parts

 

[Ktrim]

He has files coming from Amazon, soooo.

 

[Ktrim]

View attachment 131759

here is one used someone is selling close by

With this machine press, I can push out and push in the new wrist pins?

"That part I am putting in is called wrist pin" ?

With that press, if the engine block can fit it, then I can also press in the liners, I am guessing...

I will not hammer on the connecting rod until I figure it out, in the meantime, keep cleaning the rest of the parts

NOOO. Engine building is precision work. Let the machine shop do it. You cock them when pressing, they twist out of round, then you have more junk.
Your not getting any of the concepts here. Your crank needs to be cut and oversize bearings put in.
You'll be lucky if new sleeves don't spin in the bore.
New sleeves need to be pressed in straight and machined.
Wrist pin bushings need to be pressed in straight and machined to size.
Head should have had a professional valve job done. Compression is the whole concept of diesel engines. When your valves leak it will not fire.
We are trying to help you get several thousand hours out of this after all your work. You put this engine together like you are and you'll be lucky to a couple hundred hours.
He

 

[fried1765]

That would again be called a press. They also need to be machined to fit the wrist pins.

If press is not available,..... maybe use a sledge?

 

[Ktrim]

If press is not available,..... maybe use a sledge?

Bfh always gets the job done.

 

[joesmith123]

If press is not available,..... maybe use a sledge?

the sledge hammer is what damaged that wrist pin bushing and the bore on the block, I gotta be careful with that thing

All of the parts cleaned wire wheels, then pressurized parts cleaner

The most recent parts cleaned, glow plugs, inectors, phaser, all the head bolts, took off the stuck on gasket on that cover, etc

another look at the bores, the liner should work out fine

plan: figure out whether to get the machine press, get the liners installed and honed professionally

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

the sledge hammer is what damaged that wrist pin bushing and the bore on the block, I gotta be careful with that thing

View attachment 131788

All of the parts cleaned wire wheels, then pressurized parts cleaner

View attachment 131789

The most recent parts cleaned, glow plugs, inectors, phaser, all the head bolts, took off the stuck on gasket on that cover, etc

View attachment 131790

another look at the bores, the liner should work out fine

plan: figure out whether to get the machine press, get the liners installed and honed professionally

I get that you are trying to do this on the cheap, BUT.
You've already done a ton of damage to the block and I'll be really surprised if the liners will even go in.
With as rough as those bores are, you'll never get liners in them, they need to be honed to size if they are not oversized already.
If you attempt to drive the liners in you are going to damage them!

 

[jaxs]

Some K-Y Jelly in bores might make liners easier to pound in after block has been smoothed with files.

 

[DustyRusty]

Some K-Y Jelly in bores might make liners easier to pound in after block has been smoothed with files.

Personally, I prefer grape.