2001 BX2200 won't turn over... relay (re-)wiring question

[#40Fan]

For some reason it wasn't showing up for me at first, but is now. If you still can't see it, the last picture that I posted that has the two green lines, and asking if you connect those two....

It is the wire on the bottom left of the picture, behind the yellow and behind the frame.

 

[martinlaurentide]

For some reason it wasn't showing up for me at first, but is now. If you still can't see it, the last picture that I posted that has the two green lines, and asking if you connect those two....

It is the wire on the bottom left of the picture, behind the yellow and behind the frame.

yup delayed but yes a ground wire from something I think unrelated. It's that other black mystery wire I wonder about. I bet these threads will help a ton of BX guys with the relay issue after I'm dead and gone. ;-)...

 

[#40Fan]

Picture showed up late... oddly enough. That's a ground. I had wondered and reached behind and it goes to that bolt on the frame. It's the other black wire that I plugged into the starter that I don't really know much about.

Assuming this is how you have it wired still, move the yellow wire to the starter where you have the black plugged into.

Disconnect and touch the red wire to the starter's battery terminal.

Does it crank over?

 

[Henro]

I keep trying to give my “expert” opinion (LOL) as someone with decades of troubleshooting and designing control systems in an industrial environment, but I am ready to give up.

Anyway, you can shotgun the solution, or proceed logically. Your choice.

4 wires gives you between 16 and 20 combinations. keep trying and you may reach the solution. ( Should have paid more attention to combinations and permutations in college).

BUT if you identify the operating coil and the relay contacts, you have only one way that hook up matters.

Operating coil terminals can be reversed, and contacts can be reversed. You already know that the contacts are hooked between the power lead supplying the starter and the solenoid terminal.

The other two wires connect to the relay coil…between the wire coming from the tractor safety circuit and the tractor frame or engine block.

how difficult is this to understand?

Without identifying what pins on the relay do what, 16 or 20 chances to get it right. (Actually more since the relay likely has more than one set of contacts, but that should not be an issue since as hooked up it did work previously ).

Take your pick.

 

[martinlaurentide]

Assuming this is how you have it wired still, move the yellow wire to the starter where you have the black plugged into.

Disconnect and touch the red wire to the starter's battery terminal.

Does it crank over?

Yes!!!

 

[#40Fan]

Yes!!!

Now you need to find which wire is supposed to be coming from the ignition switch to supply 12 volts to your red wire!

Does that black wire you unplugged lead back to the ignition switch?

Does it have any voltage when the key is in the crank position?

Did someone add a push button start?

ETA: Connect the two white connectors back together and see what happens.

 

[martinlaurentide]

Now you need to find which wire is supposed to be coming from the ignition switch to supply 12 volts to your red wire!
- I believe it's the White one with the white connector on the left but although there is continuity, when I turn the key I do not get 12 volts out of it.

Does that black wire you unplugged lead back to the ignition switch?
- I need to recheck but I don't think so. - Checked below and no I don't think so from my continuity testing of all 4 pins from ignition switch to that wire.

Does it have any voltage when the key is in the crank position?
- No it did not.

Did someone add a push button start?
- No.

ETA: Connect the two white connectors back together and see what happens.
- Okay will go back and do that. Thank you so much. Your assistance is very much appreciated. - Per note below, it did not start after those 2 white ended wires were reconnected.

 

[martinlaurentide]

With the 2 white connectors connected, it does not start. I will check continuity from the 4 switch to that black wire.

 

[martinlaurentide]

With the 2 white connectors connected, it does not start. I will check continuity from the 4 switch to that black wire.

... and there is no continuity from any of the 4 pins in the ignition switch to that mysterious black wire.

 

[martinlaurentide]

I keep trying to give my “expert” opinion (LOL) as someone with decades of troubleshooting and designing control systems in an industrial environment, but I am ready to give up.

Anyway, you can shotgun the solution, or proceed logically. Your choice.

4 wires gives you between 16 and 20 combinations. keep trying and you may reach the solution. ( Should have paid more attention to combinations and permutations in college).

BUT if you identify the operating coil and the relay contacts, you have only one way that hook up matters.

Operating coil terminals can be reversed, and contacts can be reversed. You already know that the contacts are hooked between the power lead supplying the starter and the solenoid terminal.

The other two wires connect to the relay coil…between the wire coming from the tractor safety circuit and the tractor frame or engine block.

how difficult is this to understand?

Without identifying what pins on the relay do what, 16 or 20 chances to get it right. (Actually more since the relay likely has more than one set of contacts, but that should not be an issue since as hooked up it did work previously ).

Take your pick.

I don't quite know what you are advising here, have said from the start that I'm not good at this, but am doing what I can. I review and try my best to understand the docs, take the advice of those who provide it and respond as best I can, test what I can, learn as I go and with the help of everyone, some more than others, am making progress, I think... my suspicion has been and is still the ignition switch so I think that needs to be tested next but not sure.

 

[#40Fan]

We'll get it figured out some way or another. You've got the relay hooked up correctly, now you just need to find the key/start wire. I'll look over the pictures you posted and try to help in a bit.

 

[#40Fan]

Do these wires and plugs go to your ignition switch?

If so, can you clean them up and take a better picture showing all of the colors on both sides of the plug?

 

[#40Fan]

If I were Kubota, I would have ran the "start" wire along with the main cable.

Can you pull back the plastic split loom and see if there is a wire hiden in there?

 

[martinlaurentide]

If I were Kubota, I would have ran the "start" wire along with the main cable.

Can you pull back the plastic split loom and see if there is a wire hiden in there?

I will double check but I don't think there is more than one wire in it.

 

[martinlaurentide]

Do these wires and plugs go to your ignition switch?

If so, can you clean them up and take a better picture showing all of the colors on both sides of the plug?

Yes that is under the dash disconnected from the ignition switch. The green one comes out easily but by feel I reconnect it when I reassemble. I will go take a picture to show all colours more clearly of all 4 wires.

 

[martinlaurentide]

I will double check but I don't think there is more than one wire in it.

 

[#40Fan]

If you can't get a clear picture of those wires, see if you can tell what colors they are. According to the wiring diagram you posted, you should have a:

Red
Red w/ White Stripe
Black w/ Red Stripe
Black w/ White Stripe

 

[#40Fan]

Not the connector, but the black ribbed plastic piece that goes around the battery wire going to the starter.

 

[martinlaurentide]

Yes that is under the dash disconnected from the ignition switch. The green one comes out easily but by feel I reconnect it when I reassemble. I will go take a picture to show all colours more clearly of all 4 wires.

Under dash all 4 wires from both side of that connector.

The additional pic is how we left the relay wiring but should I not revert back to the previous permutation which I hopefully remember or can find from notes here. ;-)

 

[#40Fan]

Under dash all 4 wires from both side of that connector.

The additional pic is how we left the relay wiring but should I not revert back to the previous permutation which I hopefully remember or can find from notes here. ;-)

It is hard to tell, but it looks like the Black wire with a white stripe is across the plug from the green wire. Is that correct?

Don't change anything on the relay wiring yet.