Tandem Axle Trailer Tongue and Tractor Drawbar At Different Heights

[UpNorthMI]

I'm looking at a tandem axle dump trailer and wondering what I should do when the drawbar height is not in line with the height of the tongue on the tandem trailer. Take a look at this video:

It looks like the tongue on the trailer may be as much as 6" or more above the drawbar height of the tractor and that the drawbar has been fitted with a vertical extension post. Is this a solution or should I be towing from a receiver frame attached to my 3pt hitch? I've always been advised that any heavy tow load should be done using the drawbar.

One thought was to weld a height adjustable ball mount to the top of the drawbar to get the trailer connected level, I assume there must be something available that solves this problem?

I'm evaluating buying a single axle 2T version or this heavier twin axle trailer shown in the video to use with my L3901 and my MX5800 for hauling firewood and occasionally sand and gravel up to the capacity of the trailer. My land is flat and I'm looking to take things steady, I sometimes have to do a 2 mile round trip to get to the far corners. These trailers come with just the dump cylinder and hoses to fit to the rear hydraulic remotes, nice and simple.

I'm sure I'm not the first to consider this issue and look forward to any input.

 

[sheepfarmer]

I vote for draw bar modification. That’s a lot of weight and torque to put on 3 pt hitch. Since you have a couple of big tractors, an adjustable height mod would be useful.

 

[UpNorthMI]

I think the tandem axles are carrying the weight of the load my tractor is just pulling it, l pull a large heavy 6’ wide angled disc attachment with ground contact with my MX 3 pt hitch, is a trailer any different?

l could buy the single axle 2 ton version which will connect straight to the drawbar with no issue, I’m concerned that the load will be larger from a single axle trailer due to increased tongue load on the drawbar.

 

[NCL4701]

Have pulled trailers and wagons off 3 pt quite a bit. There are some issues with that, as you probably know, which can be avoided by using the drawbar. Obviously you can pull with the 3 pt; if you can pull a plow you can pull a trailer.

Problem pulling is when you have the hitch point above the centerline of the rear axle which tends to pull the front wheels off the ground. That problem would be the same whether you’re pulling from the drawbar with a riser above the rear axle centerline or the three point set too high. The 3 pt connection to the trailer is generally further away from the rear axle than the drawbar which increases the amount of torque applied by the trailer by the tongue weight and by pulling above the rear axle (if you’re doing that).

Problem with stopping with 3 pt is it floats unless you have some method to lock it in place. The surge brakes would be great but they have to have something to push against. If you’re going downhill and the hitch gets above center of the lift arm pins on the tractor, the trailer can push the hitch up, and worst case if it pops off a ball hitch it can hit you in the back. You can solve that problem with a stay strap that attaches to the top link on one end and lift pin or drawbar on the other like the photo. Have seen some that are slotted to allow adjustment. If you’re on flat ground maybe not a problem.

You can pull a trailer with the 3 point, you just have to consider the force vectors involved and set it up to make sure the trailer doesn’t hit you in the back and the front of the tractor stays on the ground.

 

[i7win7]

One thought was to weld a height adjustable ball mount to the top of the drawbar to get the trailer connected level, I assume there must be something available that solves this problem?

I think the problem is dumping, all material weight is transferred to rear axle. If you can weld or take parts to weld shop, why not add 2" receiver to drawbar.

Class III 12 in. x 2 in. Standard Receiver Tube

Amazing deals on this Class Iii 12In X 2In Standard Receiver Tube at Harbor Freight. Quality tools & low prices.

www.harborfreight.com

 

[huey]

Build or buy one of thease

 

[i7win7]

As a proud owner of a 3pt trailer mover, I have reservations of dumping a loaded trailer.

 

[nbryan]

I'm looking at a tandem axle dump trailer and wondering what I should do when the drawbar height is not in line with the height of the tongue on the tandem trailer. Take a look at this video:

It looks like the tongue on the trailer may be as much as 6" or more above the drawbar height of the tractor and that the drawbar has been fitted with a vertical extension post. Is this a solution or should I be towing from a receiver frame attached to my 3pt hitch? I've always been advised that any heavy tow load should be done using the drawbar.

One thought was to weld a height adjustable ball mount to the top of the drawbar to get the trailer connected level, I assume there must be something available that solves this problem?

I'm evaluating buying a single axle 2T version or this heavier twin axle trailer shown in the video to use with my L3901 and my MX5800 for hauling firewood and occasionally sand and gravel up to the capacity of the trailer. My land is flat and I'm looking to take things steady, I sometimes have to do a 2 mile round trip to get to the far corners. These trailers come with just the dump cylinder and hoses to fit to the rear hydraulic remotes, nice and simple.

I'm sure I'm not the first to consider this issue and look forward to any input.

This is my setup for my B2650 and 5K single axle dumper. Love it. I will be adding a chain to hold the 3-point receiver hitch down when dumping heavier loads. With this 5000lb. gvw fully loaded trailer properly balanced there will be around 500 lbs at the hitch (10%), and the tractor 3-point is rated at over 2100 lbs capacity at lift point. That's more than the standard drawbar's capacity. I fill it with firewood, or wood chips, or compost, and it hauls like a dream. Compost loads pretty much maxed out the trailer, it's almost as dense as regular topsoil.

 

[UpNorthMI]

This is my setup for my B2650 and 5K single axle dumper. Love it. I will be adding a chain to hold the 3-point receiver hitch down when dumping heavier loads. With this 5000lb. gvw fully loaded trailer properly balanced there will be around 500 lbs at the hitch (10%), and the tractor 3-point is rated at over 2100 lbs capacity at lift point. That's more than the standard drawbar's capacity. I fill it with firewood, or wood chips, or compost, and it hauls like a dream. Compost loads pretty much maxed out the trailer, it's almost as dense as regular topsoil.
View attachment 52832
View attachment 52831

That's a pretty big trailer and must have some weight when loaded. Where are you planning to chain it to? Top of receiver frame to drawbar?

 

[Thunder chicken]

I’ve used the 3pt trailer movers like shown above, wirh my double axle (7k) dump trailer. As an experiment, I didn’t chain the 3pt down and dumped a load, on slightly I level ground. The 3pt came up and gave everything quite a shake and could have been bad.
I chained it down to the drawbar for a while but forgetting it’s chained could have bad endings for something. Plus i tow On the public roads at speed.
so I had a drawbar receiver made up. The trailer has an adjustable height coupler, I guess the one you are looking at does not. But you can get those ‘drop’ receivers, use it backwards to get the height?

 

[Henro]

I pulled my 5x8 single-axle dump trailer with my BX2200 A LOT a couple summers ago, using an attachment similar to what Huey posted the picture of above. 200 or 300 loads, did not keep track. Up some grades where I about lost traction sometimes, depending on soil dampness. Generally carried about a ton of dirt in the trailer, or a bit more.

One advantage I found using the 3PH was when dumping I could raise the 3PH full up, before raising the dump bed, and increase the dump angle a bit, which was desirable in my case.

The risk of using the 3PH when pulling the trailer is that there is no down pressure, and if things shift, the hitch could suddenly raise to the full up position, unexpectedly. I did not run into this, but tried to make sure when loading the trailer I had ample tongue weight.

Pulling from the draw bar is probably the safest way. But if you keep in mind the difference with the 3PH, it can work pretty reliably too, in my experience anyway...

 

[nbryan]

That's a pretty big trailer and must have some weight when loaded. Where are you planning to chain it to? Top of receiver frame to drawbar?

Yes. The comment about raising the 3-point hydraulically while chained is a good point, and I'll have to experiment carefully a bit to be certain that there won't be damage caused by that, for sure!

 

[GreensvilleJay]

Modify the trailer tongue to lower the ball coupler! That way you can USE the drawbar. 3 sections of 2by2 tubing,staggered an inch will give you a 6" drop. You've probably seen trailers with this setup , though usually only 2 or 4 ". Going 6" is not a big deal.

 

[Lil Foot]

Modify the trailer tongue to lower the ball coupler! That way you can USE the drawbar.

Like this:

 

[bcp]

Add a channel bracket to the trailer or drawbar.

https://www.etrailer.com/s.aspx?qry=Channel+Bracket+For+Adjustable+Coupler&furl=-pg-Accessories_and_Parts

Then lots of things can fit, at whatever height needed.

https://www.etrailer.com/s.aspx?qry=adjustable+channel+mount

Bruce

 

[UpNorthMI]

I’ve used the 3pt trailer movers like shown above, wirh my double axle (7k) dump trailer. As an experiment, I didn’t chain the 3pt down and dumped a load, on slightly I level ground. The 3pt came up and gave everything quite a shake and could have been bad.
I chained it down to the drawbar for a while but forgetting it’s chained could have bad endings for something. Plus i tow On the public roads at speed.
so I had a drawbar receiver made up. The trailer has an adjustable height coupler, I guess the one you are looking at does not. But you can get those ‘drop’ receivers, use it backwards to get the height?
View attachment 52848

Thanks, this was also the best solution that I came up with for the double axle dump farm trailer. also good suggestion to modify trailer tongue height from other members.

I’m leaning towards buying the 2 ton single axle version for simplicity and cost. The single axle version is also half the weight at only 700lbs and I can use either my L3901 or my MX5800 to tow it without any drawbar modifications, both have rear remotes to operate the trailer dump feature. I will buy the 6’ length trailer box as I need to get into tight woodland areas, to load cut tree logs or rounds. Most loading will be by grapple, plan to put my order in next week.

 

[BA76]

I’ve used the 3pt trailer movers like shown above, wirh my double axle (7k) dump trailer. As an experiment, I didn’t chain the 3pt down and dumped a load, on slightly I level ground. The 3pt came up and gave everything quite a shake and could have been bad.
I chained it down to the drawbar for a while but forgetting it’s chained could have bad endings for something. Plus i tow On the public roads at speed.
so I had a drawbar receiver made up. The trailer has an adjustable height coupler, I guess the one you are looking at does not. But you can get those ‘drop’ receivers, use it backwards to get the height?
View attachment 52848

Thats exactly what I’ve been picturing for my tractor drawbar. I thought I put the receiver on top tho so the trailer weight would be directly down on the drawbar instead of underneath, pulling down on the adapter frame. I want to be able to transport my e35 Bobcat mini-excavator around the farm. I have a 14,000lb tilt top trailer. When positioned correctly the trailer axels support most of the excavator weight.

 

[UpNorthMI]

Thats exactly what I’ve been picturing for my tractor drawbar. I thought I put the receiver on top tho so the trailer weight would be directly down on the drawbar instead of underneath, pulling down on the adapter frame. I want to be able to transport my e35 Bobcat mini-excavator around the farm. I have a 14,000lb tilt top trailer. When positioned correctly the trailer axels support most of the excavator weight.

The MX has a much greater capacity at the drawbar, I looked up the maximum recommended trailer weight for my tractors:

L series - 2,000lbs
MX 5800 - 7,700 lbs

Be careful with your trailer and mini ex, the combined weight will be over 10,000 lbs, slow and steady!

 

[GeoHorn]

Modify the trailer tongue to lower the ball coupler! That way you can USE the drawbar. 3 sections of 2by2 tubing,staggered an inch will give you a 6" drop. You've probably seen trailers with this setup , though usually only 2 or 4 ". Going 6" is not a big deal.

Pardon the disagreement...but that is one of the last things to do, IMO.

Most dump trailers already incorporate an adjustable ball-height and that option should be used before anything else. The next option would be as Thunder Chicken suggested above. The worst solutions will be to weld on the draw-bar (when bolting is almost always better using correct hardware such as grade-8) and the alteration of the trailer tongue and using the 3-pt without hold-downs are outright hazardous. YMMV

 

[GreensvilleJay]

My comments were based on this being an 'offroad' only trailer so It only has to attach to the OPs tractor. I did a quiklook in Ontario at SA NHS dumpers and none up here have adjustable tongue heights,even the TA minidumpers are fixed height. Both of my highway used dumpers are fixed height. If the OP wants to use on the road,he'll have to ask IF the bearings/hubs are rated for highway use. Usually the MFR will use low cost(cheaper) 'low speed' hubs for offroad trailers..saves them money,higher profit.
TC's idea works fine when you add a 6" riser sleeve. I do that when I haul dumper with pickup. Fun part is trying to remember WHERE the 6" riser/2-5/16 ball got dropped last time I used it.....