Steering Box Rebuild Problem

[rick sheltra]

Both of the races are pressed in place. You can do it with an arbor press, hydraulic press or if you don't have one the hammer and drift method works well. Get something bigger than the race and a long chunk of metal ( I believe I used the back of a socket and a chunk of round stock) and while keeping it as square as you can whack in on in there. If it binds up beat on the high side til it squares ups and drive it home.

Then the cage is dropped into the race and the shaft inserted. The top bearing is done similarly. Part two of Vic Steering Box Article

hey there Stumpy thanks for that advice. and I was looking everywhere for part two of that video..really appreciate it.
Now to show how unknowledgeable I really am I have found the problem of why it wont go down.....the previous race is still in there and I cant get it out yet. I have been pulling on it for an hour with one tool or another and cant get it out. It moved enough for me to get a small edge of it but i just cant get it out. I thought at first just leave it there but got a really good look at it and it is also tore up and needs replaced. I didnt relize they had to be pressed in. I will try the method you suggested to put them in. Ive done that before on small bearing sets...ill see it in the video probably

I have a few pullers but all are too big. And tricks on getting it out would be great...thanks

 

[Orange Tractors]

Rick,

Welcome to the world of fixing Kubota steering boxes. The lower bearing race is a pain to remove, here is an exceprt from a post I made about it back in 2010:

To get the lower race out of mine I used 1/4 and 5/16" carriage head bolts as a prying tool, with a deepwell socket and 1/4" extension over the bolt for a handle. There isn't much room to work. Carraige head bolts are softer than bubble gum, so be sure to have a few on hand if you try this. I used a lot of penetrating oil and heated the case with a propane torch. The safety nazi's will not like this, but I got the oil hot enough to boil; if you have to do that make sure you have a way to put the fire out.

I was going to replace the case, (it had about 5-6" of cracks caused by freezing water)until I started pricing them. The least expensive one I could find was right at $200.00, with no garantee that my parts would fit in it, so I decided to try to fix the cracks in mine. JB weld to the rescue.

Don't get mad and beat on the steering box, cast iron can break awfully easy.

Robert

 

[rick sheltra]

Hey Robert that idea worked great. I modified a bit had to use a long bolt with thin washer and was able to pry like a paint can lid
i got it out and now I am looking at the instruction part two and noticing I never took it out of the upper flange either. So that is where I am now. I think the instruction is a different model because mine dosent come apart like that at the bottom of the steering shaft plate.
In between all this as I am waiting for parts I forgot to order I am doing a "rattle can paint job" to as many parts as I can!.

I sure appreciate all the help from you all I think I have a few days of work ahead of me. I will keep posting my results. Determined to get this thing running again....
Im sure I will need more help Rick

 

[rick sheltra]

Is there a sleeve mounted inside the shaft that pushes the race out of the sterring shaft flange? In fixing your steering part 2 at orange tractor it shows a sleeve half way out. I feel a sleeve in there and I have hit on it with a socket as the ramming device. but it wont budge. Am i just not hitting it hard enough? thanks

 

[Stumpy]

What you're feeling is the inside lip of the back of the bearing race more accurately the race through the rubber seal which has a steel band molded into it. If you're doing it like he does in this picture then you're just not whacking it hard enough. Mine was in there pretty good. I eventually found a socket that slid down the tube but caught the race and wailed on that.

 

[Kytim]

The difference on my B7100 box rebuild is that my "column" tube is welded to the lower casting making it accessible from the rear next to impossible. I found a inner seal puller that had a slide hammer design at harbor freight that made short work of it. 2 or 3 raps and it was out. it also worked for the lower race as well. I dont know if there was a design change or not but my serial number places it at late '76 to early '77. But if I remember correctly, I read a note from SDVic that there may have been an even earlier box design entirely.

 

[rick sheltra]

Hey Kytim,
I am trying to take pics as I go so I can document this better. At this point today I am going to tr and bang out the race agan today. I have to go to harbor next week so I will check out that tool. I cant find any way to pull it. Ive tried just about everything.
It is all one piece and I am starting to wonder if what I am pulling on is indeed the race!!!it looks like it and the bearings fit in it perfectly so guess thats it and it is just stobborn. Stumpy told me to hit it harder so I am going to try that today.
I will post my serial # as soon as I figure out how to post pics...
thanks for sharing your info. I am determined to get this thing running
Rick

 

[Kytim]

<<<I am determined to get this thing running. Rick>>>

You will, and we're gonna help!!

 

[rick sheltra]

Good Morning to my orange tractor friends from unseasonably warm Maryland..
Good for me to work on the tractor.
I was thinking about trying to use the same race that is so hard to get out. At first I thought it will be scarred from the vice grips and every other tool I used to try and get it out, however it seems to have survived my attacks. The new bearings fit in there fine and there dosent seem to be any resistance from any micro size nicks. So....I think I am going to try and just put it together and see if it works. What I am worried about is the oil seal is not in good shape however where is the oil gonna go if it leaks through there? up in the shaft? since there is no high pressure there maybe it will work. The weep hole obviously dosent seem to stay unclogged for long so I dont think it will come out there.
Does anybody have any thoughts on trying it this way?
My shaft that holds the steering rod is about 12" long so it dosent look like the one in the pics. The serial number on my tractor is 7001-47556
Anxious to hear what you all think about it.
Brother Tim and Stumpy and Orange tractor... I appreciate you all being so willing to help someone with limited knowledge like me.
Have a great day I am back to getting this thing running....as I am waiting for advice I have been painting the parts one by one...
Rick

 

[Orange Tractors]

I really do not like the idea of running new bearings in an old race. If there is any space at all behind the race, soak it in a good penetrating oil for a few days and try again.

The seal not only keeps the oil in the gearbox, it also keeps water that drips down the steering shaft out of the box; this is probably what happened to your original bearings in the first place. The rubber bushing at the top of the steering shaft also helps keep water out, but it does wear and doesn't provide much of a seal.

When I rebuilt my steering box, I drilled the weep hole out to about 1/8", the tiny hole that was stock would clog way to easily, i thought. I also keep the tractor in the barn to keep as much moisture off of it as I can.

Robert

 

[rick sheltra]

Robert I agree with you on all things you pointed out. It is how the box apparently got water in it from the get go.
I was wondering if I could go ahead and make that weep hole bigger! I will do that.
I am still having difficulty getting that thing out of there it is almost like it is part of the flange.
Here is how I am trying to do it...I am using a long 1/2" extension with socket at the end and beating it with a 4lb hammer.
I think the rubber seal is preventing me from getting a good hit on it..not sure but it feels like I am not hitting metal to metal. And then there is piece of split steel tubing in the end right before the rubber seal
Does that sleeve move? is it there just too push the race out? if so it would seem I have to get rid of the rubber seal first so it will hit against the race...
Sorry I am learning so might not have all the facts right I will attempt to attach some pics on here with this post.
Dont know how to thank you all for the great advice
It is really helping me understand. I have some other friends I have met and talked to on tractorbynet and they gave me some good advice also.
I havent had any replies to my posts there recently so thats when I joined orange tractor..the orangetractortalks.com videos were all suggested by tractorbynet forum users.
rick

 

[Stumpy]

Oh jeese you still have the tube in there no wonder you can't get a grip on it. That has to come off leaving the bare flange. The lip of the race doesn't stick out far enough without that over of there. Lock the tube tightly in a vice (don't crush it though!) and then using two large screw drivers (or whatever you've got) to pry up on the flange. Mine was a little rusty and in there good but some patience and penetrating oil got it out without incident.

In the pic you posted it looks like there's something at the mating between the tube and flange. I'm hoping that's just RTV and not a weld bead.

 

[Orange Tractors]

Go back and read Vic's articles again, he had a description of how to get the tube off without destroying it. I think it was in part two. It should make it easier to get the race and seal out.

With all that said, I got mine out without taking the tube off; but my top race came out really easy, so easy I wondered if the new one would fit tight enough. The lower one was bad enough to more than make up for it though.

I would also clean all the rust out of the tube that you can; either by electrolysis or using a choreboy pot scrubber on a rod, then painting it the best you can.

Robert

 

[rick sheltra]

Stumpy and Robert...here are some better pics of the tube and race. I will go back and read Vics articles again. the tube is welded at the flange. On one of the pics you can see on the inside first the flange then the oil seal then this sleeve which if I could hit it squarly I bet it would hit the bottom of the race and knock it out. Now it is hitting the rubber first.
I wonder if thats how it came from the factory? Now I will go back and read some more and see what else I can try. I guess I could cut the tube and then get it re welded after I get that race out...back to vics article and stumpy the pics you attached are exactly what I was expecting to see after I beat it from the inside.. but I just cant get it to move....Ill post the progress.
Here are some hopefully better pics of the culprit...

 

[Kytim]

As i said before, mine was welded too. This is what i used. Time meant more than a few bucks did at the time i did my rebuild. plus it was still cheaper than buying a questionable "good" replacement. My Dad told me many times that the right tool for the job will pay for itself over again. I have used it several times over for myself and other friends and family. Steering boxes, ford "n" distributors, etc.

Myself, it would be the right tool before cutting the tube.

 

[rick sheltra]

After re reading several posts I forgot kytim had a similar problem and found a tool at harbor freight. I think I might take a trip to the cheap tool store....
Also need to figure out if that bead around the flange holding the tube in place is welded or epoxy sure would be nice if its epoxy or something like that...

 

[Stumpy]

Agreed Kytim, if that's welded and your's certainly looks that way Rick, I'd leave it alone. I do like the look of the bearing puller tool.

 

[Orange Tractors]

Well it doesn't look like you are taking the tube off the flange.

Like I said, mine came out easily, so easily I don't remember just how I got it out.

Here are a few ideas, they may work, you may have tried them already:

A long drift/ punch/ screwdriver (the most misused tool in existence) held at an angle inside the tube.

Put a slight bend 10-15* in the end of a punch, so you can catch the edge of the seal or race and tap it out. You may have to go around it a few times; but once it moves even a little bit, you are home free.

I used to have a slide hammer with external hooks that was used to pull pilot bearings from crankshafts. If yoiu had something similar and could get it behind the race, while the flange was solidly in a vise???

If these ideas don't work, I can come up with some more drastic measures, I am sure.

Robert

 

[rick sheltra]

Thanks for the advice from you all. I am headin for the store in the morning after dc rush hour and try and find the tool...
I also need to replace the pitman arm seal I think. It wasnt leaking but it dosent look good either.picture attached. From what I have read it seems that will come off easy. Its in the part 2 of steering rebuild so i have a guide.
I will post the progress

 

[Kytim]

When I used the slide hammer I posted earlier about it was almost anti-climatic. A couple good hits and it was out. Same for the one in the bottom of the case.