Smart meter

skeets

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sheepfarmer

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Yeah the pricks are forcing us to have one installed. How can the UN agenda 21 ( http://www.chattanoogan.com/2012/2/6/218862/Smart-Meters-Are-Part-Of-Agenda-21--.aspx ) control our power companies like they are? These things are dangerous , health reasons and fires and the power companies say nawww everything's cool pay no attention to the man behind the curtain Whats next do we have to be LoJacked?
Well I didnt succeed in getting rid of their digital meter but after a ridiculous double the normal amount bill last January I made them take off their fancy reporting mechanism off. I have to pay extra for a meter reader. I suspect the wireless reporting is error prone and hackable. Heck half the time I can't get a decent cell signal in my back yard, why should they?

I have heard that you can get an analog meter if you buy and install with them, but if you opt out after it's installed they claim you can't.

Best thing refuse to allow them to install the new meter and bit the bullet and pay the extra monthly fee. The January bill extra would have paid the fee for a couple of years..
 

North Idaho Wolfman

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Please tell me you're not buy the BS she's selling.
Plain and simple she is trying to use scare tactics.
This is not Big brother trying to hold back the man... it's a power grid trying to keep up with tecnology and the demand for cleaner power.

Digital meters do not work the way she states at all.

They do not transmit a signal across the air, the signal is transmitted on the electric line, no radiation emissions other than the normal EMF signals.

There is no hacking the meter for information as it only has amount used information.

It does not know anything more than the amount of electric used, most companies don't even use the time of use information that the meter is capable of.

There is a special meter that they install on houses /businesses that have a repeated failure to pay, it has the ability to be prepaid and or remotely shut off, these are not normal meters and they are only used in special cases.

Mechanical meters fail and readers can read them wrong, they both have downfalls.

Ask your utility what information they get and I'll bet they say amount of use and maybe when you used it. ;)
 
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Fordtech86

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Been on a smart meter for about 5 years,going on 2 years at our current house in the sticks,never an issue, I agree with wolfman its thru the electric line,won’t get a cell signal at my house
 

skeets

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We shall see, but I do know these use a micro wave transmitter, and its powered on my dime, they are also as sheepfarmer said screw up. I read several reports of people receiving bills for several thousand dollars. And having worked around microwave transmitters in a former life I understand what they can do ,even at very low power if they are not shielded right. I guess what izzes me off more than anything is the fact the UN agenda 21 is the base for this. What does the UN have any right tell us what AMERICANS can and cannot do! Oh yeah I am upset about them just coming in and pulling the meter today no notice nothing,, and I did go batshyt crazy on them. They put the old meter back in and left,, most likely will be back with the PoPo or more BS.
OK Im done for now, maybe
 

sheepfarmer

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lugbolt

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I have one of those fancy digital wirelessly read water meters. They just drive by the house slowly on reading day and "read" the meter without getting out of the truck. I've lived in the house for 4 years oct 31st. In that 4 years, they've mistakenly read the meter wrong 5 or 6 times. That or the meter is incorrect. Once, I got a water bill for $970. Needless to say I ran right down to the water office and pitched a fit, told their meter reader to come out the house with me and pinpoint my leak. Says that's not what they do...I said it's your meter, you come find the fault. They agreed, sent the mayor of all people out to the house, actually followed me and read the meter manually. It was WAY off of what their electronic device "read"-and we agreed that the next 3 months' bill was on them. Their cost was likely half of what mine is but nonetheless, I liked his professionalism in the matter vs the meter reader dude-who was a belligerent dip wad millennial that you couldn't talk to; might as well have tried to talk to a cat-and if any of you have ever tried that, you know it don't work, they just talk back with the same words every time and don't obey one bit. Well I pet that cat backwards and they understood then.

Neighbor lady was over the other day griping about her water bill too; said their water usage was all over the map. She showed me the last 12 months of bills and their water usage was not less than 9500 gal/month. Mine is under 1500 every month, but I don't have anyone else here other than the pet, and the neighbor's got 2 kids and a husband. Understandable. According to their usage reports, it's 9500 one month, 18,000 next, 10,200 the next, so on and so forth. I think it's their problem. She'a blaming the water company. Maybe they have a leak, though I have not seen any sign of it (standing water, wet ditches etc).

They want digital meters here too and I told them I wanted to opt out of them. So far I still have a mechanical. But who knows how long it'll be until they force them on us too. They forced them on us at work. Noticed today. Both of them were mechanical now both are digital, but different PoCo than I have at the house.

While on the subject, how hard is it to get them to put up a larger transformer? I don't know the KvA on the current one, but in the summer time, when all the A/C's are running, neighbor's a/c comes on, shop's a/c is on, and then my house a/c comes on, I can watch the lights barely dim for a split second. When I was restringing the weed eater under the transformer the other day (pole mounted), I could hear it (the transformer) buzz when the a/c came on in my shop. I'd imagine they'll try to charge me for that, too.
 

sheepfarmer

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:(Further, there are really two separate issues with the new meters,

1. the power use sensing device and the digital meter,
2. The instantaneous read and upload of usage by the homeowner into a network using radio frequency transmission.

Here is a report that the reading devices might not be accurate

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...giving-readings-seven-times-high-study-finds/

Not all utilities are using the same meters and protocols for data collection, so it is hard to tell what information applies to your particular setup.

The article that skeets links to, does seem to include a lot of bs along with a few facts....:rolleyes:
 
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North Idaho Wolfman

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Well it sounds like you all are getting fancier meters than we get, I live way to far out and in the woods for any radio transmitter to work! ;)

Skeets... "I do know these use a micro wave transmitter, and its powered on my dime"

But you would rather pay them $10 a month to drive over to your place to point a electronic reader at it?
Yes that's right, they read them electronically... they don't bother reading them by eyesight as that's even more of a chance for an error! :D
 

mickeyd

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I have one of those fancy digital wirelessly read water meters. They just drive by the house slowly on reading day and "read" the meter without getting out of the truck. I've lived in the house for 4 years oct 31st. In that 4 years, they've mistakenly read the meter wrong 5 or 6 times. That or the meter is incorrect. Once, I got a water bill for $970. Needless to say I ran right down to the water office and pitched a fit, told their meter reader to come out the house with me and pinpoint my leak. Says that's not what they do...I said it's your meter, you come find the fault. They agreed, sent the mayor of all people out to the house, actually followed me and read the meter manually. It was WAY off of what their electronic device "read"-and we agreed that the next 3 months' bill was on them. Their cost was likely half of what mine is but nonetheless, I liked his professionalism in the matter vs the meter reader dude-who was a belligerent dip wad millennial that you couldn't talk to; might as well have tried to talk to a cat-and if any of you have ever tried that, you know it don't work, they just talk back with the same words every time and don't obey one bit. Well I pet that cat backwards and they understood then.

Neighbor lady was over the other day griping about her water bill too; said their water usage was all over the map. She showed me the last 12 months of bills and their water usage was not less than 9500 gal/month. Mine is under 1500 every month, but I don't have anyone else here other than the pet, and the neighbor's got 2 kids and a husband. Understandable. According to their usage reports, it's 9500 one month, 18,000 next, 10,200 the next, so on and so forth. I think it's their problem. She'a blaming the water company. Maybe they have a leak, though I have not seen any sign of it (standing water, wet ditches etc).

They want digital meters here too and I told them I wanted to opt out of them. So far I still have a mechanical. But who knows how long it'll be until they force them on us too. They forced them on us at work. Noticed today. Both of them were mechanical now both are digital, but different PoCo than I have at the house.

While on the subject, how hard is it to get them to put up a larger transformer? I don't know the KvA on the current one, but in the summer time, when all the A/C's are running, neighbor's a/c comes on, shop's a/c is on, and then my house a/c comes on, I can watch the lights barely dim for a split second. When I was restringing the weed eater under the transformer the other day (pole mounted), I could hear it (the transformer) buzz when the a/c came on in my shop. I'd imagine they'll try to charge me for that, too.
I remember back when I lived up North and they came and put one of those smart readers on the water meter. There it got so cold in the winter that the meters where in the house to keep them from freezing. They only came into the house once every 3 months to read them so we only got a bill once every 3 months. When they started using the smart readers by riding down the street to read them, we started getting a bill every month.

After 6 months of getting the same bill each month, they came out to the house to find out why our readings were showing that we were putting water back into their pipes. I.E. the meter was going backwards. When they inspected the meter, they discovered that the wiring from the meter to their smart reader was backwards. Instead of just fixing THEIR mistake, they said that WE messed with the wiring and that now they were going to prosecute us for theft and hit us with a $5,000.00 fine.

They sent a crew out to fix the wiring the next day, but I refused to let them into the house. I had contacted the local TV station about the problem and the fine and they agreed to send someone out to cover it. The TV crew brought a registered electrician with them and documented that the wiring was actually protected in and sealed box that still had the water company's seal on it.

After that hit the airways with video of what they had discovered, the company said that they were sorry for the mistake and to forget the fine. I told them that I was not having any of that and threatened to sue them for defamation. Then they said that water would be free for the next six months if I agreed to settle out of court.
 

mickeyd

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Well it sounds like you all are getting fancier meters than we get, I live way to far out and in the woods for any radio transmitter to work! ;)

Skeets... "I do know these use a micro wave transmitter, and its powered on my dime"

But you would rather pay them $10 a month to drive over to your place to point a electronic reader at it?
Yes that's right, they read them electronically... they don't bother reading them by eyesight as that's even more of a chance for an error! :D
Where I live now, they still come out every month and actually read the water meter but the gas company has the ones where they drive by and read them.

Alabama power has the smart meters where they can tell how much you are using at any moment and their computers are constantly storing the information. They say if you don't want to use their meters then fine, they'll disconnect their power lines.
 

skeets

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Oct 2, 2009
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I think that for the extra couple bucks I wouldnt mind, also it might save a meter readers job.
Last one I talked to said the PoCo was getting rid of the meter readers because of the smart meters, and of course the union was trying to fight it.
There is just to many unknowns with these meters, out in Ca there has been a ton of fires that have been proven to have started at the meter. OH yeah that was the OLD DAYS, I know if searched you can find ones in Canada, in the UK France and the US that have been traced back to the smart meters. OK I dont like change, but I will change if it can be proven to be beneficial, and I dont think these are. But we shall see what happens
 

sheepfarmer

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If the radio is actually turned off they would have to read the meter visually. Of course they could be lying about that. When I complained about my triple normal bill and wanted it off, the display changed really fast, no evidence that they had to come out to change it.

Last time they came to "read" the meter I saw the guy drive in my driveway and pull up to the meter on my garage, but I can't be sure he used his eyeballs. He could have. At least I can go read the meter and see if my bill says the same thing. I think the technology is buggy, not that the previous method couldn't be a problem too.
 

shootem604

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We've had the "smart meters" for several years now. My gripe is there seems to have been no quality control in the production - they had to replace the new meter 3 times in the first year because they failed each time. As a result the utility estimated my consumption and over billed me, and as they had no proof of actual consumption I complained to the regulator until they gave me a substantial credit. No issues more recently here now that the initial province wide install is complete and the quality issues have been sorted out.
 

D2Cat

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I can kind of feel your smart meter pain. I have a dumb meter (water) in a rental unit where I pay the water bill. I got a bill for 53,000 gallons. This was in the summer with no rain. There was no wet spots anywhere visible.

I complained but got the response the water went through the meter, you pay the bill! After a couple of months of this I got the city water dept mgr. to go by and read the meter 3-4 times a day. (this is a small town of 1100)

I asked them to pull the meter and have it checked. They told me it would cost $300 and I had to pay it if it didn't prove it was wrong. I found out through another source who check meter function and called them. Cost----$<50, takes 15 minutes, and they can do it in a few days lead time.

When I told the city the info I found I learned they didn't pull the meter because they didn't have one to replace it with. I told them they didn't need to replace it, it only takes 15-20 minutes to do the test. And the line is just plugged when they are there for that time. Then I found out the city crews did not know where the shut off was for that line because they and resurfaced the road and didn't record where the shut off was.

But it got them to doing more checking.

The city employee discovered one day the meter was showing a great amount of water going through. He went to the door and the lady there said she wasn't using any water.

He finally pulled the meter and had it checked. It was reading too fast. (They told me at city council meetings water meters only read slow when they go bad.) He cleaned the meter and discovered it was a 1962 meter! They're suppose to replace the meters like every 20 years.

Oh, they did refund my over payment, but never apologized.

So all meters can be problems.