L3710 hst grinding sound no forward or reverse

[Lightning Truck]

Hi, My name is Mike and I live in tallahassee florida. I have a lot of mechanical knowledge but I don't know where to start on this tractor.

It is an L3710 Not sure of the year. I need to find a WSM. Kubota dealer told me they think the countershaft is broken. (from my description)
Tractor starts and runs. Will not move in either direction. Oil(hyd) in sight glass looks clear and correct level, but there is a greasy looking butter like residue on glass too. Water?
I was driving in high on my dirt road with no load and it made a whirring/grinding sound and came to a stop, Then no F or R. Loader and box blade work. When you push in clutch it makes a loud grinding/hyd pump whine noise and offers resistance back through the pedal. Like the pedal throws itself back at your foot.
I just would like some advice on where to start. And ideas of possible problem. I'm wondering if i should drain hyd fluid and cut open filters to look for signs of water or metal. I searched a lot on the site but cant come up with good info on this exact model and WSM for this model.
Thanks, Mike

 

[kckndrgn]

Welcome,
Afraid I can't help much, but look at the sticky on this forum for links to the WSM's

Good luck with your repair.

 

[Lightning Truck]

I read the sticky before i posted and can't figure out if i have a gst or an hst.
I downloaded the pdf with all the diagrams but can't conclude much from it.
I can't find a data plate anywhere on tractor either.
Thanks, Mike

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Ok first you need tell if it an HST or a GST!

HST: Push pedal and go!
High,(maybe med), low shifter, either a rocker pedal for forward and reverse or two separate pedals for forward and reverse.

GST: Shift into gear, shuttle in forward or reverse then go!
Shifter for 1-8 ranges, shuttle shifter on the column for forward and reverse.

 

[1970cs]

Uhm NIW it's in the tag title HST.

You going to have split the tractor! I would speculate something with dampner disc? Won't know for sure until split the unit.

Pat

 

[D2Cat]

In post #3 the owner does not know what it, gst or hst.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

I read the sticky before i posted and can't figure out if i have a gst or an hst.

Uhm NIW it's in the tag title HST.

I'm slow sometimes, but this one I did get right!
Or at least I think I did.

 

[lugbolt]

Sounds clutch related to me. In low gear, does it even attempt to move at all? Sometimes when the clutch dies, you can put it in the lowest gear that it's got, and it'll try to move a little....that's usually (but not always) a dead giveaway that it's clutch related. If you want to know for sure, pull the drain bolt out of the bottom of the clutch housing, it usually has a little piece of metal in teh middle of it that's kind of loose. Remove the whole thing, IIRC 27mm. Might be 24. Then run a magnet up inside as best you can, if the magnet comes out with metal on it, and a lot of it, then it's a good bet that the splines on the clutch disk are done.

 

[Lightning Truck]

Thank you for replies.
The tractor has a rocker pedal for forward and reverse and Hi, Med, Lo. So I think it is a HST.

I removed the drain plug for hydraulic fluid and fluid looks fine. I cant get off the hyd filter. I will get them off at some point.

I will look into the bolt in the clutch housing. No movement in any gear or direction. I think it moved a little when it first happened, but no more.
I just have a hard time wrapping my mind around hyd drive and a clutch.
I also thought a stripped input shaft or disc center but this setup is not familiar to me.

I think i need a WSM for sure.
Thanks, Mike

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Ok HST, Yep standard clutch setup on that model.
So yea it could very likely just have a fried clutch or maybe a stripped clutch housing or the input shaft.
The pedal pushing back at you tells me you have a fried clutch.
You are looking at a tractor split!

 

[1970cs]

Well I see my tea leaves and tarot cards were working properly!

Pat

 

[rbargeron]

To me, the most telling clue is that the clutch pedal pushes back against your foot. Definitely points to a bad clutch center problem.

If the clutch center fails the engine can run (including hydraulics for loader & 3-point) but the HST pumps don't make pressure so it stops driving the tractor - no motion forward or back.

There's likely no oil contamination or need to look for debris inside hydraulic filters. The L3710 is one of the Grand Lxx10 series (1998-2002) They also share many chassis parts with the L48 including the HST unit.

For servicing the clutch split it at the back of the engine - front of clutch housing. Minimum new parts likely to be clutch disk, release bearing, & pilot bearing. The clutch cover (pressure plate) might be damaged too. With a flat floor and a couple rolling floor jacks its a straight forward job. Good luck, Dick B

 

[Lightning Truck]

OK. So I plan to split it at the intersection of the engine block and the bell housing like portion.
How do I split the floor apart so the 2 halves can move?
I left the loader and the box blade on for balance. Should I crib up the front or rear? And the other half roll out with floor jack? I guess I planned on rolling the rear, but I have room to pull forward also.
When back together I will do a fluids and filter changes on all fluids and filters.
I wonder what the guy at Kubota meant when he said countershaft?
Also where can I get the WSM? Or do I not need one for this?
Thank you for all the great replies! Mike

 

[rbargeron]

You'll want to drain the hydraulic reservoir (the transmission) before you split it. Hydraulic tubing, wiring, etc that crosses the split location needs to be disconnected, maybe removed. The WSM has info on separating.

Time spent preparing and studying can be beneficial. This video on splitting a L2900 is helpful in learning what's involved.

It isn't always necessary to disassemble as much as the WSM says. Some loaders can be left bolted on. And if you partially unbolt and lift the center console a bit some models can be split for a clutch leaving a lot in place.

The factory parts lists accessible here also give a good idea of how its assembled. Click on Illustrated Parts Lists and type in your model numbers (tractor, loader).

Allow a few days with breaks if its your first tractor split. Good luck, Dick B.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

I wonder what the guy at Kubota meant when he said countershaft?

He was trying to pull something out of some unmentionable port in his back side!
Your HST doesn't have a countershaft!

 

[Lightning Truck]

Thank you for all the info.
The video helps a lot!
I hope to start working on it this week. I am studying the parts diagrams to get an idea of order of things. I need to find a wsm. I will try to lift up the console like in the video and leave a lot attached. I will take some pictures and keep you posted.
Wolfman I am glad i did not take it to the dealer. They said 1250 to split then go from there
Thanks again, Mike

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Yea doing your own work will save you some serious $$$, and all of us are here to help if you need info, advice, clarification, or the celebratory drink after it's all done.

While you are in there I think that is the series with a upgrade to the front wheel drive propeller shaft seal.
I'll see if I can find the posts.
It's real easy to do and you'll be taking it out on the split.

 

[Lightning Truck]

OK!
Been a while but last week I had some time and my back was not killing me so I split the tractor.
The splitting of the tractor was pretty easy. The removal of 100ish parts, bolts, lines, linkages, hoses, cotter pins........ was a real test of patience.
I was excited to see that the splines on the shaft were junk (because 1. I knew the problem and 2. I did not have to look further!)
Pictures will tell it all. Now where do I get some replacement parts(not going to local Kubota thieves) and how do I correctly remove the input shaft?

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

I hope your sitting down!
P/N TA240-51400 $794.05
http://www.colemanequip.com/parts/KubotaParts/TA240-51400/

This place is showing used or rebuilt, might be worth a shot to call them.
http://marketplace.capitalpress.com/farmlandtractor/ta240-51400-shaft-24t/

It doesn't look to me like those splines are worn beyond service, I would get a new clutch plate and check it's engagement (as I would think the clutch disk is completely stripped).

If you do end up replacing the shaft it look like you pull the throw out bearing holder then the shaft might come out, but I think you might also have to split the front case off of it because of the gear (50) that fits behind it???

 

[Lightning Truck]

You may be on to something. Clutch center is splineless smooth!
Measured input with caliper from high to high on orig surface and worn surface.
They are 1.355 and 1.345, lots of actual spline left.
I need to get pressure plate off and buy a throw out bearing and a disc. Any recommendations for supplier??
Thanks! The help is priceless! Mike