Kubota ZD1211 - won't start

[texaskubota]

I'm stumped.

I'm helping the owner of a ZD1211. The mower ran fine last time, was parked, and now won't start up. There is no crank. Just the startup buzz. Dash lights up.

I've checked
- both steering arm safety switches
- brake safety switch (also tested by jumping)
- seat safety switch (also bypassed by jumping)
- starter gets 12v
- cleaned battery terminals
- checked all fuses
- slow blow fuses passes continuity
- no loose connection at starter relay
- no visible loose connections anywhere as far as i can see
- all grounds seem ok, even jumped a ground from neg bat terminal
- ignition switch passed all continuity tests (including start)

The only thing I see is the solenoid signal wire only gets 0.01 on key start. If I'm correct it should get around 12

I have not taken the starter relay off. Not sure how often these fail

 

[Pawnee]

If there was 12V on the starter it would be spinning or trying to, unless bad ground. Maybe you mean 12V on the solenoid big lug?
if there is only .01V on the solenoid actuation lug it won't do anything so 12V at the starter makes no sense.

Everything fails.

I would run a line(momentary contact) from the battery + to the solenoid actuation lug - make EXTRA sure it's in neutral. And have somebody on the seat in control.

Go from there.

 

[texaskubota]

If there was 12V on the starter it would be spinning or trying to, unless bad ground. Maybe you mean 12V on the solenoid big lug?
if there is only .01V on the solenoid actuation lug it won't do anything so 12V at the starter makes no sense.

Everything fails.

I would run a line(momentary contact) from the battery + to the solenoid actuation lug - make EXTRA sure it's in neutral. And have somebody on the seat in control.

Go from there.

Sorry yeah I meant the solenoid. 12v at the solenoids lug and 0.01 from the signal wire when in key start

 

[texaskubota]

Jumped the solenoid power lug and and the signal port and it seemed to briefly spin the starter.

Having jumped two safety switches already.....I'm wondering how often the starter relay can fail?

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Jumped the solenoid power lug and and the signal port and it seemed to briefly spin the starter.

Having jumped two safety switches already.....I'm wondering how often the starter relay can fail?

They fail, also if it was parked for any length of time check for damaged wiring from rodents

 

[DJM1591]

Are blades engaged ?

 

[whitetiger]

Jumped the solenoid power lug and and the signal port and it seemed to briefly spin the starter.

Having jumped two safety switches already.....I'm wondering how often the starter relay can fail?

It would only take one failure.
Here is the start circuit.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

Where did you connect the ground( blk wire) of the DVM ?

Zero volts at the solenoid B/R wire would mean no 12 volts to it from pin 1 of the OPC
easy to confirm.... jumper +12 to the solenoid, should here it 'click', and starter should spin with key in ST position.

 

[Pawnee]

It is very likely one of the interlock switches (5,6,7,8,9 in the start circuit) that isn't closing for whatever reason.
I don't know how easy it is to get to and test but pins 4,6,7,9,13,15 all need to be +12V to enable the start solenoid.
I have no idea what the module looks like or how hard it is to get a meter probe on those pins so I think the best thing would be to find all those switches and make sure they are working. Dirt, bent bracket, corroded switch all possible culprits.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

yes, need to check AT the OPC connector !
While a safety switch may check 'ok', mouse could have eaten the wire between switch and the OPC !!!

 

[texaskubota]

I checked the starter relay today and it seems to be working as it should. With 12V I get the click and continuity to the b/w solenoid signal prong.

i didn't mention I don't even hear the relay CLICK at any point. So I'm definitely starting to lean towards safety switches despite that they all "appear" fine.

I should mention that before start....the dash does properly report whether the parking brake and PTO is engaged or disengaged.....As well as when the steering arms are in Neutral or not. Im not sure if this tells us anything.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

The problem I have is the starting.PDF( whitetiger supplied ) doesn't show any wiring from the switches to the dash lights.....
Now if the dash lights are 'true' then it sounds like the OPC module could be bad.... but without a proper wiring diagram, I can't say for sure.

 

[texaskubota]

I can't seem to trace and locate the opc. Driving me nuts!

 

[texaskubota]

The problem I have is the starting.PDF( whitetiger supplied ) doesn't show any wiring from the switches to the dash lights.....
Now if the dash lights are 'true' then it sounds like the OPC module could be bad.... but without a proper wiring diagram, I can't say for sure.

Try this. It's the whole manual Ive been following

https://www.kubotabooks.com/AutoIndex/index.php?dir=Mowers/&file=ZD1211%2C%20ZD1211R%2C%20ZD1211L%2C%20ZD1211RL_K3441-71255ENG%5B1%5D%20Ops.pdf

 

[tthorkil]

I have had only one instance a couple of years ago when my ZD1011 would not start. I remembered bumping against the harness from the bottom of the seat when I was greasing the drive-shaft - I disconnected the connector coming from the seat to the harness and applied some dielectric grease to the pins and reconnected - has not been a problem ever since - always starts.

 

[Pawnee]

Try this. It's the whole manual Ive been following

https://www.kubotabooks.com/AutoIndex/index.php?dir=Mowers/&file=ZD1211%2C%20ZD1211R%2C%20ZD1211L%2C%20ZD1211RL_K3441-71255ENG%5B1%5D%20Ops.pdf

That is the Operator's manual.
They also have a WSM, which may be more helpful.

 

[texaskubota]

That is the Operator's manual.
They also have a WSM, which may be more helpful.

Sorry linked wrong, it IS the WSM I'm using.

https://www.kubotabooks.com/AutoIndex/index.php?dir=Mowers/&file=ZD1211%2C%20ZD1211R%2C%20ZD1211L%2C%20ZD1211RL_9Y111-13443%5B1%5D%20WSM.pdf

 

[texaskubota]

Is that the OPC behind the relays/fuse box? Just got it out, but still cannot find a B/R wire

And man it's impressive how little they do to protect the connection points from the inevitable dust of mowing. All the wiring is jacketed well until a connection point, where its totally exposed to the elements.

Gosh it's almost like they want you to need service. Do they make money on that!?

 

[GreensvilleJay]

B/R should be Black/Red wire... Black with a Red stripe on it.....
sadly the 'electrical section' of the WSM has NO info about the OPC !!!

 

[texaskubota]

Yeah can't find the B/R wire anywhere