Kubota L245F No Throttle Control High RPM at start up

[banochris]

Hey there folks, It's been a while and this old L245 has been running very well,, until recently.. and it may be something I messed up... grrr.

So it a few weeks back I was running the brush cutter (not a Bush Hog Brand) and doing some general work with the front end loader. Had been going at it for a few hours and out of the blue, throttle control was sporadic. It would drop to idle speed and I would have to push in the clutch to prevent killing it, pump the foot speed controller a few times till it became responsive again, then I could go a few more minutes and it began again. After a few cycles of this behavior, I figured it may be running hot, so I limped back to the shed and let her idle low a few minutes then shut her down. I waited a bit and checked the fuel level, coolant level, and oil level, and all where fine. I then pulled the fuel line off the injector pump to make sure fuel was flowing, and it was flowing very well. Then I pulled the injector fuel feed lines, opened the petcock and fuel rose up through the injector pump openings. I figured it may be the injector pump, so I went to work removing the pump and doing some research.

I found that most folks agreed, that if the pump was functional, and it's rare that injector pumps completely fail, that you should not try to rebuild it due to the complexity and cost. So I decided to replace the brass delivery valve gaskets, the delivery valve holder o-rings, intake manifold gasket, and an injector pump shim. Jumped on German Bliss and ordered the parts. Put everything back together, primed the fuel lines, and cranked her up. She started right up but was running wide open like the throttle was all the way open. The throttle lever had no affect and the little kill lever didn't shut it down, so I closed the petcock and it shut down. I figured I must have missed aligned the pin on the control rack to the slit on the governor fork lever. I think I'm using all the correct part names.. Took it all apart 3 times, double checked everything, and it looks correct. Put it back together and it still runs wide open with no throttle control.

I took off the little cover to see inside and the pin is in the slot. So now I'm just confused. Did I just not reassemble it correctly, or did I break or bend something with the governor? I'll go snap a few pics and post em. Maybe you guys can see something I missed.

Thank and sorry for the long post..

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Did you up the exact same size shim in under the pump?
As that shim sets timing, you should have just reused the old shim.

For the reason that it's running full out with no control.
When you pulled the delivery valve holders you very likely damaged to delivery valves or the more likely the pump element.

The other option is you damaged the idle apparatus.
That normally will only affect idle, not max throttle or control.

DO not remove the idle adjustment to inspect
Pull the pump and take pictures of it.

 

[banochris]

Thanks Wolfman...

I realized there was not a shim installed so I took it off when I took the IP back out the first time around.

Agreed, I haven't messed with the idle adjustment cause I didn't figure it was an idle issue, in that it just runs wide open without idling.

I also have not attempted to remove the speed control plate.

In the pic I sent, does it look like the governor arm lines up and positions correctly? I'll try and make a video of the motion if it'll be of any use.

I'll take the IP back off and snap some pics. The control rack does slide freely. What are we specifically looking for? do you want me to take the delivery valve holders off? Also, I noticed that the 2 nuts on the 15221-56020 LEVER, GOVERNOR, #28 in the diagram you sent, have been twisted off or something. They are just not there. I'll snap a pick of that as well.

 

[ruger1980]

When you had the injection pump out and remove the delivery valves out did you remove or alter the position of the barrels that the brass sealing washers seal against? If they are the style that is not held by a pin it may be possible you have one or both in a way that you cannot achieve a no fuel situation. Also did you alter the orientation of the control rack and gears?

 

[ruger1980]

Sorry I just reread your last post and you are saying the nuts that hold control lever to the governor shaft are missing?
That is interesting. but shouldnt directly cause a runaway condition. It could however cause issues if the governor lever were to slide down into the governor assembly

 

[banochris]

Thanks ruger1980.

I didn't mess with the bottom half of the IP, just took off the delivery valve covers in an attempt to clean it. I'm going to take the IP back off and look at it, but I think I may have reassembled it in the wrong order and put the little brass ring in the wrong place. I'll take a pic when I get it out and show what I did. If that ring is supposed to be the 2nd part in the reassembly order, then I goofed that part up.

Right now I'm a bit more concerned about the broken top of the governor shaft shown on the speed control diagram. If you say that can fall down into the case, that's a biggie! Here's a pic.

 

[banochris]

Is this the solenoid that is supposed to shut it down and if it is please tell me this wire isn't supposed to be connected to it...


After looking at all the diagrams and the housing, I don't think this L245 has an electronic shutoff. ???

 

[ruger1980]

No electric shut off on that vintage machine. Probably goes to the fuel gauge or one of the wires seen under the fuel tank.

Is this the solenoid that is supposed to shut it down and if it is please tell me this wire isn't supposed to be connected to it...


After looking at all the diagrams and the housing, I don't think this L245 has an electronic shutoff. ???

 

[ruger1980]

Is this the solenoid that is supposed to shut it down and if it is please tell me this wire isn't supposed to be connected to it...


After looking at all the diagrams and the housing, I don't think this L245 has an electronic shutoff. ???

The shaft looks like it is still in place, other wise it would be dropped down into the governor ass'y. If the shaft is actually twisted off it can be replaced. Just remove the four nots that hold that plate in place and pull up. The governor spring attaches to the lever and all you have to do is disconnect it from the lever. Tie a wire or string to the spring to keep track of it.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Is this the solenoid that is supposed to shut it down and if it is please tell me this wire isn't supposed to be connected to it...


After looking at all the diagrams and the housing, I don't think this L245 has an electronic shutoff. ???

Most likely temp sending unit, top rear of head.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Fix the throttle control first, looks like your missing 2 nuts and a washer.
Also make sure the keyway is still there.
That being out of whack could make the governor not work properly.

Then you might need to look at this, it looks like it's gotten bent down.
Don't randomly bend it as you can very easily break it.

 

[Russell King]

Is this the solenoid that is supposed to shut it down and if it is please tell me this wire isn't supposed to be connected to it...


After looking at all the diagrams and the housing, I don't think this L245 has an electronic shutoff. ???

If wire is solid blue it is for the oil pressure sensor, if it is blue with a white stripe then it is for a horn that you probably don’t have (and there would be a push button on the dash to activate the horn)

 

[banochris]

Wolfman - I thought it looked a little low. In that's part of the governor arm how in the world can I get it bent back into position without taking the governor apart? It's probably bean that way for a while.

I'll be taking the speed control plate off and checking for the keyway is still there. Finding a replacement shaft looks like it may be a little bit of a challenge. Messicks and German Bliss don't have it.

I'll check the colors on the wire and let you know what I find. If it's the temp sending unit I'll certainly fix that quickly.

I found this video and I understand now why rebuilding the IP isn't for the week at heart. I'm pretty sure I can do it if it comes down to it, I rebuilt my mini cooper engine. lol. I'll use it as a reference for the order of reassembly.
"

"

I'll be trying to get the IP off tomorrow.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Yea the L245F didn't come with a temp sending unit so it's most likely the horn wire as the oil pressure sending unit is on the other side of the engine.

The arm gets bent from someone putting the fuel pump in and not aligning the pin to the slot and tightening the pump down, bending the arm.

To fix the governor linkage you will need to bend it back SSSSLOWLY.
And yes If you break it you'll need to pull the front of the engine apart.