FEL Bucket tilt Drifts down over 2hrs

[Henro]

Raise the bucket to chest height, curl, and disconnect the bucket couplers. If it leaks down and there is no oil on the ground its in the cylinders. You could probably speed the test up by hanging a couple hundred pounds on the cutting edge. When the cylinder seals on my B1630 went south a loaded bucket would leak down in under a minute.

Dan

Myself, I would curl the bucket while it was on the ground, then lift it after disconnecting the couplers. ONLY because I would worry that the weight of the bucket would add some pressure perhaps making disconnection of the couplers difficult.

NOT sure if this is a valid concern or not...

If it were me and I needed to add a couple hundred pounds to the bucket lip, I would probably just position it a little lower, and sit on it...LOL

 

[Vlach7]

Thanks for your thoughts, my old JD backhoe would drift down, I was told it was in the control valve, which made sense because I rebuilt/sealed the ram with no change, not looking forward to opening up the control valve, will wait till I have to, I will just be quicker when I'm using the bucket to hold stuff.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Thanks for your thoughts, my old JD backhoe would drift down, I was told it was in the control valve, which made sense because I rebuilt/sealed the ram with no change, not looking forward to opening up the control valve, will wait till I have to, I will just be quicker when I'm using the bucket to hold stuff.

I doubt opening the valve up will buy you anything if the spool is leaking.

Dan

 

[BruceP]

No leaks.

INTERNAL leak past seals. (usually the seal on the piston within the cylinder will lower the bucket)

There is nothing wrong with the tractor. 2 hours is FARRR longer than I would expect to move a couple inches.

DO NOT PUT HUMANS IN THE BUCKET!!!
Bucket should ALWAYS be on the ground when engine not running. (the stored energy can release at any time)

 

[Vlach7]

What is the spool, where is it located? Would that allow both rams to leak down?

 

[TheOldHokie]

What is the spool, where is it located? Would that allow both rams to leak down?

The spool is the metal rod that the levers move in and out. They control the flow of oil. They do not have any seals and rely on a sub-thousandth clearance in the valve body for sealing. When they or the valve body develops wear and start leaking they are not serviceable and the entire valve is toast. And yes - a leaking valve will affect both cylinders.

Dan

 

[Vlach7]

Thanks, so a new valve will probably be needed, sad that could happen at 400hrs. I will update if I get there.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Thanks, so a new valve will probably be needed, sad that could happen at 400hrs. I will update if I get there.

Don't jump to conclusions. You need to positively identify your problem and its source. All you have so far is speculation from afar.

Dan

 

[Vlach7]

Yes, Thanks.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

You NEED to disconnect the 'curl' hose and see what happens !
Odds are good it'll be seals($) in the cylinder(s) NOT the valve assy($$$$$$$$$$$$$) !
400 hrs is 'nothing' for the valve assy...seals could be wore out though is it's 400hrs of heavy loader use.
I've got 700+ hrs on my BX23S, bucket stays put for days....and a LOT of those hrs ARE loader work !

 

[Vlach7]

I am attempting to understand this curl hydraulic hose disconnect test and am shy to be pulling hoses off, still cleaning the hydraulic fluid off the cement from replacing the blown curl end hose one week ago. Engine running? Which hose? What is normal or not?

 

[TheOldHokie]

I am attempting to understand this curl hydraulic hose disconnect test and am shy to be pulling hoses off, still cleaning the hydraulic fluid off the cement from replacing the blown curl end hose one week ago. Engine running? Which hose? What is normal or not?

The idea is to disconnect the cylinders from the control valve and see if the cylinder drifts with both ports blocked. Thats easy to do and no chance of spillage if the loader is detachable and has quick disconnects. on the hydraulic lines. Not so easy and lots of spillage if its permanently attached.

EDIT: BTW nothing in the hydraulics should be worn out at 400 hours so hours is really immaterial.

Dan

 

[Vlach7]

Yes permanently, and if it's not the spool/valve, then that means both cylinders are internally leaking?

 

[TheOldHokie]

Yes permanently, and if it's not the spool/valve, then that means both cylinders are internally leaking?

I looked at the parts diagram for your loader. Its not easy to isolate the cylinders. Looks like you would have to disconnect the hoses atthe cylinders and plug the ports on the cylinders. Doable but messy.

This has become way too speculative. I suppose one cylinder could bypass and take the other with it. But as was said early on while 2 hours is not desirable its also not a rapid leakdown.

Dan

 

[Vlach7]

This test if it failed/bucket dropped, would show there is an internal leak in the cylinder, if bucket held would show it to probably be the spool/valve?

 

[TheOldHokie]

This test if it failed/bucket dropped, would show there is an internal leak in the cylinder, if bucket held would show it to probably be the spool/valve?

Correct.

Dan

 

[Tx Jim]

Yes permanently, and if it's not the spool/valve, then that means both cylinders are internally leaking?

Raised bucket can tilt over when control valve is in neutral position if only ONE(1) bucket cylinder piston seal is faulty. In rare situation where both bucket cylinder piston seals were faulty bucket would just curl over faster than with one faulty cylinder piston.

 

[Donystoy]

My bucket has had a slow downward curl for as long as I can remember. If I am going a distance with the bucket full I just occasionally give the control lever a shot to bring it back up. Quite frankly I have never given it much thought and just assumed that it was to be expected. Sometimes cylinder drift can be good like when I was installing wall sections when building my shop. I would position a section over the foundation, get off the tractor and guide the section over the anchor bolts as it dropped. Have had those cylinders re-built since. My tractor has 2300 hours with tons of loader work.

 

[Vlach7]

So Donystoy, did rebuilding the cylinders stop or help the bucket curl drop?

 

[Donystoy]

So Donystoy, did rebuilding the cylinders stop or help the bucket curl drop?

It was the main lift cylinders that I had re-built and only because they were leaking around the shaft.
My curl cylinders would be easy to test since the hose's disconnect at the valve and have quick connects.