EverythingMoneyAttachments. All the money up front?

[greg86z28]

Glad to hear EA is making it right. Hoping they fix the hose issue.

I’m still in line but was concerned about the response to the bent lid. Sounds like it worked out though.

Greg

 

[mcmxi]

I bury the stumps but I have a nice backhoe to make holes! You can burn them…but if you are in fire country like me it is illegal (they burn for days/weeks). Almost nothing else you can do with stumps. They are covered in dirt, tough (dull chainsaw blades quick, can’t chip them, etc).

Yep. They sure are a pain. Burying them is out of the question. I only have a few feet of dirt that covers rock so it's either burn, haul or leave. I think I'll go for burn this fall/winter.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

re: stumps
neighbour made a windrow of them in front of property, had grankid powerwash most of the dirt off them...
eventually someone stopped and bought one ! Within 2-3 month they were all sold as 'yard art'

 

[River19]

Travis from EA called me and apologized for his jr. sales guys comments to me, we spoke for a while and I believe he was concerned about how this played out, everyone knows your reputation is everything.
He asked if i'm comfortable replacing the top part myself, or shipping mine back, I am , so he is sending it out to me.
MCMXI, he asked that I mention to you that he tried to find your email with pictures, and could not locate your info, if you would email him direct he would like to talk to you. (don't shoot the messenger

BTW I agree great view

Bob M

Boom. That is more like what I think we all expected. I hope it all works out.

Plus, it would be nice to see some details as to what the swap entails. No pressure

 

[Goz63]

Travis from EA called me and apologized for his jr. sales guys comments to me, we spoke for a while and I believe he was concerned about how this played out, everyone knows your reputation is everything.
He asked if i'm comfortable replacing the top part myself, or shipping mine back, I am , so he is sending it out to me.
MCMXI, he asked that I mention to you that he tried to find your email with pictures, and could not locate your info, if you would email him direct he would like to talk to you. (don't shoot the messenger

BTW I agree great view

Bob M

Glad they are making things right. I still am sticking with my LP SGC0660 but am looking at EA for some other equipment like a post hole digger and Landscape rake. Their response was going to be a significant factor in whether they were in the running for those orders. A little concerning that their “jr sales guy” gave you that initial response and took this thread to put the necessary pressure to get it right. Shouldn’t have needed that but in the end it is being fixed.

 

[mcmxi]

Travis emailed me this morning and this is what he said.

"Yeah, even though it [hose on sharp corners] has never been an issue, I’ve asked the guys to change it numerous times, so we don’t have to see it ever again.

I’ll be glad to send you whatever hoses you need. Just take a pic from further away, so I can see the whole grapple and point out which ones you want.

I’d use the ones on it and keep the others for spares. You’ll probably never need them unless you snag something in a freak occurrence, but we aim to please!

We’re a small business, with small business customer service and old school, true principles with our customer’s best interests in mind.

Please tell any others who are concerned that we’ll honor those hoses from now on. If one *ever* has an issue due to the routing, bang, new hose coming."

I responded with a "thank you" and informed Travis that I don't need replacement hoses. The fact that he offered was enough and that he took the time to respond to my email. I told him that if a hose fails I'll have a replacement hose made up locally and that I'd simply let him know so that he has more data. Travis is a good guy and EA is a good company as far as I'm concerned.

Every manufacturing company has issues with products from time to time but it's how they handle those issues and their customers that determines whether or not they get repeat business from me. EA and LP will continue to be my "go to" brands for implements.

 

[River19]

Every manufacturing company has issues with products from time to time but it's how they handle those issues and their customers that determines whether or not they get repeat business from me. EA and LP will continue to be my "go to" brands for implements.

^^^^ This

I say that all the time about our vendors here in extremely large corp America......it isn't about "if" something goes wrong it is "when" and then it is really about how they handle it that matters.

 

[mcmxi]

I received a follow-up email from Travis and he made some interesting points re paying up front that I'd like to share here. I like this guy and I admire his honesty whether you agree with him or not.

"Paying ahead locks them into the price. We’ve had two price increases since some of those have ordered, due to materials increases in this crazy market. How happy would they be if the price of their grapple went up 10% before it shipped?

Frequently, credit card issues happen when we try to collect payment. CC authorizations disappear in less time than our builds, which means we’d have to go back and visit thousands of orders prior to shipping. It would be insane."

I asked the local dealer a couple of months ago to put a LP grading scraper (GS2584) to the side for me when one shows up but I'm considering placing an order for the EA XTreme Tractor Land Leveler V2.0 With Scarifier Shanks instead. The box blade I bought from EA is the real deal and their land plane/grading scraper has some better features compared to the LP such as the shanks, how they're attached, gusset placement, grading blade angle, side height etc.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

re: price increases... if their business is booming, they'd be making huge bulk purchases on steel and supplies (aka volume purchases).Having raw material inventory is kinda important,and you get deep cuts in prices which more than makes up for the warehouse space needed for the material. BTDt

re: Frequently, credit card issues happen when we try to collect payment. CC authorizations disappear in less time than our builds, which means we’d have to go back and visit thousands of orders prior to shipping. It would be insane."

This doesn't make much sense to me. If the CC is refused at payment, the buyer has options, like cash or another card. If the buyer can't pay, too bad, so sad....the item (seems grapples are high demand..) goes to the next guy in the queue. If HIS card goes ding...winner,winner,winner... the sale is made.

 

[NHSleddog]

re: price increases... if their business is booming, they'd be making huge bulk purchases on steel and supplies (aka volume purchases).Having raw material inventory is kinda important,and you get deep cuts in prices which more than makes up for the warehouse space needed for the material. BTDt

re: Frequently, credit card issues happen when we try to collect payment. CC authorizations disappear in less time than our builds, which means we’d have to go back and visit thousands of orders prior to shipping. It would be insane."

This doesn't make much sense to me. If the CC is refused at payment, the buyer has options, like cash or another card. If the buyer can't pay, too bad, so sad....the item (seems grapples are high demand..) goes to the next guy in the queue. If HIS card goes ding...winner,winner,winner... the sale is made.

You must not do any purchasing for a small company. Why don't they just order 5 times what they need? 10 times? 20 times what they need? There are no "deals" in the steel industry between 10 and 100 tons and VERY little between 100 and 1000 tons. Warehousing is a HUGE cost (10.00/sqft+) and everything steel is big and heavy. Also, they may not even be able to "get more" depending on what they are ordering. Many steel types are in short supply right now.

The point you are missing on the CC charges is CHASING THE MONEY. 30 orders a day is pushing 1000 orders a month. 100 orders/day = 3000/mo (I have no idea what their volume is but based on their videos of the shipping docks it is pretty good) If they had to go chase the money on 10% of them it would require another whole employee just to "chase the money". Their solution is perfect, no chasing money. You also can't hold an auth on a card that long, that is the CC company issue, not EA.

It makes perfect sense to me to "lock in the price". And honestly, he is right, if they upped the price at delivery the same guys crying about paying for it would be crying about the price going up. I have no problem paying them when I order from them as long as the leadtime is accurate and so far, even through all this crap, their leadtimes have been pretty accurate.

 

[mcmxi]

re: price increases... if their business is booming, they'd be making huge bulk purchases on steel and supplies (aka volume purchases).Having raw material inventory is kinda important,and you get deep cuts in prices which more than makes up for the warehouse space needed for the material. BTDt

re: Frequently, credit card issues happen when we try to collect payment. CC authorizations disappear in less time than our builds, which means we’d have to go back and visit thousands of orders prior to shipping. It would be insane."

This doesn't make much sense to me. If the CC is refused at payment, the buyer has options, like cash or another card. If the buyer can't pay, too bad, so sad....the item (seems grapples are high demand..) goes to the next guy in the queue. If HIS card goes ding...winner,winner,winner... the sale is made.

I think there's enough information in this thread to help just about anyone make up their mind on whether or not they want to order an implement from EA. I've been open and honest about my entire experience whether it's purchasing, shipping time, product quality and communication. EA and Travis have done the same too. I would say that you've had an issue with EA from the get go and have no intention of changing your mind and that's very clear to the members here. Perhaps it's time to move on.

I spoke with Garrett this morning about ordering a land plane/grading plane and he worked out a decent shipping option that would get the 800 lb beast to within 2 hours of me for a shipping cost $260. Looks like I'll be ordering another EA implement and once again am ok with paying up front.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

I've owned my energy control company for 3+ decades as well as cut code(real programming...) for inventory control for several other small businesses,both retail and manufacturing. Ordering of materials is 'interesting' ,based upon several factors like what are the parts, where used, current sales, past sales, time of year, etc. Basically a hazy crystal ball BUT with today's computers and databases it is a predictable 'known'. Say you've got orders for 10 grapples, have stock to make 3. You don't order stock to make 7, as most will assume. No, you look at the 'bits and pieces' and see that if you order 'stuff' for 12 grapples, you'll make the best (cost effective) use of $$ to buy the raw materials. Say you need 12 bolts for a grapple, well bolts come if boxes of 10 or 50, you buy a ''50' box. Better pricing and product can be made. even better cause 2 more orders came in for them grapples ! It's not 'rocket science' ,just a form of number crunching called 'manufacturing inventory control.
Warehousing is another 'juggling act' though most think $10 /sq ft yet forget about the 3rd dimension, height ! Everyone has seen cargo ship with stacks of seacans ' piled high to the sky....same principal applies in a warehouse. Got 'dead' stock ? 'dust collecting' products ? You 'run the numbers' and either sell at really ,really low prices or toss out, to regain that expensive warehouse space,to store product that MAKES you money. Yes, steel is heavy, but unless you're buying 10T ingots or 5T coils, it's usually in managable sizes and shapes. I usually buy my steel in 24' or 48' lengths(varies on product), cut as required in house. I save about 24% overall this way.
re:CC chasing the money.. hmm using your numbers, say 30 orders a day, average of $1000 per order(?), that's $30K. Say 30% profit.... so $10K... per day, you could easily pay someone 3 days profit to 'chase the money', for a whole year...and the other 300+ days is pure profit....

Yes running a business is a challenge, far easier to just work for someone else.

 

[DDCD]

We order millions of dollars in steel from a huge company. You know how long the quotes are good for? Until the end of the day. That's how crazy the steel market is.

Small companies don't get the benefit of floating millions in steel for months at a time.

 

[Motronic]

Once again an amazing series of posts. I run my stuff, I don't buy them for parades.

Still no problems here. All works as advertised.

If my root grapple didn't close straight I'm pretty sure I'd just grab something on the side that closes more and crunch it if that bothered me so much. But it doesn't. Because it's literally inconsequential to it's operation. The brand/stickers on it don't matter.

Is this a garage queen thread? Are you washing and waxing these things?

 

[Goz63]

Once again an amazing series of posts. I run my stuff, I don't buy them for parades.

Still no problems here. All works as advertised.

If my root grapple didn't close straight I'm pretty sure I'd just grab something on the side that closes more and crunch it if that bothered me so much. But it doesn't. Because it's literally inconsequential to it's operation. The brand/stickers on it don't matter.

Is this a garage queen thread? Are you washing and waxing these things?

That may work for you but if I paid almost $2500 for an implement and waited four months to get it and it didn’t close right it would be going back or fixed. I use my stuff but I also take care of it. If that makes me a garage queen I guess that’s your opinion as well. I don’t agree that a grapple that doesn’t close well is inconsequential to its operation. If it puts too much stress on one side you can bend other hydronic arms. But hey, use your stuff as you see fit. You paid for it.

 

[Nicfin36]

Once again an amazing series of posts. I run my stuff, I don't buy them for parades.

Still no problems here. All works as advertised.

If my root grapple didn't close straight I'm pretty sure I'd just grab something on the side that closes more and crunch it if that bothered me so much. But it doesn't. Because it's literally inconsequential to it's operation. The brand/stickers on it don't matter.

Is this a garage queen thread? Are you washing and waxing these things?

Well, I thought the same thing seeing the crooked grapple. It would certainly work, but he didn't pay for a scratch and dent grapple. He paid for one that is supposed to be of the same quality everyone else bought. If it happened to me and EA offered to give me some money back, I would take it and run the grapple no problem. And EA claims in all their videos how superior their product is. If this was a common situation with their products, they would not last very long. I bought my grapple from them because I read so many good things about them and have not been disappointed. If I had seen something like MidwestGuy's situation and it not be resolved, I would have never ordered from them. But, they are standing behind their product and making it right, and that is what they should do.

 

[GeoHorn]

If I order something today from a company…. they either already have the materials in-hand to make it…OR…they order the materials immediately to make it. There IS NO reason to believe a “price jump” will occur within that time-frame. While they certainly have the right to run the business as they see fit….. they’re simply taking advantage of the “float”…making more profit using the customers money. That’s OK…. that’s not illegal…. it’s just not true they suffer from increased materials-costs within the time frame…. UNLESS they wait several weeks before ordering the materials they were PAID FOR several weeks earlier. (which is what it sounds like is happening.)

I’m glad they will stand by their product quality. It’s a shame it ever got out the door like that however. ”Quality Control” is NOT simply inspecting random samples …. and it is NOT waiting until the product is complete and on the shipping dock headed for the customer …(but that it never should have been shipped is certain! They simply didn’t inspect it ….OR they hoped the customer would accept defective product and they’d get away with it.)
Quality Control is the workman who inspects his own work AS HE PERFORMS that work!
That grapple was wrong while it was still in-production and that’s when it should have been caught and corrected. IMO

 

[mcmxi]

That grapple was wrong while it was still in-production and that’s when it should have been caught and corrected. IMO

I agree, but as an engineer in the firearms industry working for three major manufacturers over the past 10 years I can assure you that many firearms leave factories that shouldn't. With the huge in increase in demand for implements EA has had to hire on more people and there are bound to be growing pains. What makes the difference is that EA wants to make it right. Many companies don't or won't.

The two previous companies I worked for couldn't give a crap about the customer, but the company I currently work for is customer centric whether it's safety or satisfaction and that's why I owned their products long before they knocked on my door.

 

[mcmxi]

If I order something today from a company…. they either already have the materials in-hand to make it…OR…they order the materials immediately to make it. There IS NO reason to believe a “price jump” will occur within that time-frame.

Travis mentioned this morning that they're 600 + Wicked 55 grapples behind and that's just one of many products they make. Many industries didn't anticipate the situation we're in now. Take the car rental market for instance. I drove my own vehicle to AZ and back in May at $0.58/mile because it would have cost $4,500 not including gas to rent a car up here for the trip.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

hmm, 600 grapples behind, that's roughly 1.5 million they have upfront, which they can park in a GIC or other secured investment. At a lousy 1% per annum, that's $ 15,000 pure profit on top of the grappler profit. yes, I know they won't have 'grapple money' for a year but since they make other things, it's all the 'same' money at least to the bank.
I have to wonder if the '600' pay off THEIR CC every month, to wipe out the near 30% up here, interest on the $2500 grapple purchase ? Also now wondering about their suppliers ? Does EA pay 100% up front or, lke most businesses ,have 'Net30' accounts ? Then there's the known defect, the warp. How many of the '600' will return them,if EA doesn't correct the manufacturing defect NOW ? Wonder if EA will invest the 500K grapple profit in hiring competent welders or buy a robot ?
it is an interesting 'slice of the economy' to look at.