Dual clutch operation

[Bonaro]

I have an old L275. This spring the clutch was stuck (wouldn't release) and I had to open the inspection cover and soak some oil in there to free up the release levers. I am certain it has a dual clutch because of the appearance of the clutch parts compared to the Kubota parts diagram.

Yesterday, I hooked up the bush hog. It grinds badly when I try to engage the PTO.
I am presuming that when I depress the foot clutch it should also disengage the PTO but it does not. The only way is to grind the PTO into gear then pop it out

How is this thing supposed to work and is there a way to free it up without splitting the tractor?

 

[Roadworthy]

I hope you were pushing in the clutch to engage the PTO. If the clutch is working it should disengage the gears allowing you to engage the PTO. It may need a bit of coaxing as I believe these are square cut gears you're trying to align. If I'm correct you depress a two stage clutch part way to disengage it from the engine. You must push it in all the way to disengage the PTO. You may have an adjustment issue.

 

[Bonaro]

I hope you were pushing in the clutch to engage the PTO. If the clutch is working it should disengage the gears allowing you to engage the PTO. It may need a bit of coaxing as I believe these are square cut gears you're trying to align. If I'm correct you depress a two stage clutch part way to disengage it from the engine. You must push it in all the way to disengage the PTO. You may have an adjustment issue.

Yes, this is my understanding of how a two stage clutch works.
The pedal doesnt have much freeplay before it begins to disengage the transmission and the trans can be shifted when the pedal is about half way down. I can push the pedal until it bottoms and the PTO does not disengage.
I will see if I can tighten the adjustment but I feel the linkage inside is probably rusted tight.

 

[D2Cat]

Not sure on the L275 but on some of the older Kubotas with dual clutch there was a metal plate with a spring attached that needed to be flipped up to allow the clutch peddle to get to the second stage (which is what you need to operate the PTO). Look above your left toe where the clutch lever would come up against a stop. Just flip the lever up.

 

[Bonaro]

Not sure on the L275 but on some of the older Kubotas with dual clutch there was a metal plate with a spring attached that needed to be flipped up to allow the clutch peddle to get to the second stage (which is what you need to operate the PTO). Look above your left toe where the clutch lever would come up against a stop. Just flip the lever up.

Yes, I see the lever and it has been in the flipped up position. When I depress the pedal I can feel a noticeable change in resistance once I get past the point of PTO disengagement...but it doesn't release.

I had an issue over the winter where water managed to get inside the clutch housing and the clutch release levers rusted and would not let move. I was able to soak it in oil and pry on it with a bar and get things moving again. I am thinking this issue has also disabled my PTO clutch.
Unless someone has a suggestion, it looks like I am splitting the tractor :-(

 

[kkk]

Stuck clutches are a pita.

Thoughts
Can you engage pto with engine off...then start tractor? not sure if this is an option on yours.
may have to bypass a switch or whatever/safety.
If so....maybe if you had a tiller mounted..you could hold clutch pedal down and lower tiller into some hardpack area..slowly..maybe....it would free the plate.
Not thinking of another implement that can get a bite....I guess you could drop the bush hog on a pile of firewood and get some action.

I'm guessing the plate rusted to flywheel or its shared pressure plate.....it don't take much to get a bite. It would almost be easier to free up the regular plate(trans/GO)

 

[Bonaro]

Stuck clutches are a pita.

Thoughts
Can you engage pto with engine off...then start tractor? not sure if this is an option on yours.
may have to bypass a switch or whatever/safety.
If so....maybe if you had a tiller mounted..you could hold clutch pedal down and lower tiller into some hardpack area..slowly..maybe....it would free the plate.
Not thinking of another implement that can get a bite....I guess you could drop the bush hog on a pile of firewood and get some action.

I'm guessing the plate rusted to flywheel or its shared pressure plate.....it don't take much to get a bite. It would almost be easier to free up the regular plate(trans/GO)

I can engage the PTO with engine off then start, most of the safety switches and lockout devices are inop. However, the starter is a bit weak and it will struggle to get all that spinning.
Your suggestion is exactly what I was thinking of doing. I have a couple rotten cedar stumps I can lower the mower on while at full RPM with Clutch depressed. I have a tiller but I think the mower would be easier to fix if I tear it up...lol

I will try this and report back

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Hook up a heavy load PTO implement, go out and work it while also working the clutch, purposely trying to get it to slip.
Sometimes you can get lucky and it will spin the clutch disk loose and clean off the rust.

Otherwise yes your in for a split.

 

[Bonaro]

Update: I engaged the PTO with mower attached, Throttled up, bottomed the clutch and dropped the mower on a tree stump...this thing is Waaay stuck

 

[Tx Jim]

Update: I engaged the PTO with mower attached, Throttled up, bottomed the clutch and dropped the mower on a tree stump...this thing is Waaay stuck

Sounds as if you need to split tractor in order to free stuck pto clutch disk from pressure plate.

 

[Bonaro]

Sounds as if you need to split tractor in order to free stuck pto clutch disk from pressure plate.

Yes, I agree. I will try one more thing. I will jam the clutch all the way down then try to reach in thru the inspection hole and pry on the dish a bit, maybe it will move

 

[Tx Jim]

Have you considered spraying clutch/PP with brake cleaner?

 

[Bonaro]

Have you considered spraying clutch/PP with brake cleaner?

Good idea, Brakleen will evaporate so it shouldn't fowl the disc. I will try that when i try prying on it maybe today

 

[SidecarFlip]

Years ago, I had a diesel MF with a hung clutch that was locked. What I did was use a stout tree, put the tractor in 3rd gear, about a foot from the tree and drove it into the tree withy my foot all the way down on the pedal. Not for the faint of heart but it works.

You can also use the drawbar chained LOW to the tree with slack in the chain and drive away, When you get to the end of the chain, or up against the tree, something will give, usually the stuck disc.

Once you get it free and working, put a block of wood between the pedal and the bottom of the dash to keep the pedal depressed. Some tractors will have a hook welded to the frame above the pedal just for that use.

 

[Bonaro]

Years ago, I had a diesel MF with a hung clutch that was locked. What I did was use a stout tree, put the tractor in 3rd gear, about a foot from the tree and drove it into the tree withy my foot all the way down on the pedal. Not for the faint of heart but it works.

You can also use the drawbar chained LOW to the tree with slack in the chain and drive away, When you get to the end of the chain, or up against the tree, something will give, usually the stuck disc.

Once you get it free and working, put a block of wood between the pedal and the bottom of the dash to keep the pedal depressed. Some tractors will have a hook welded to the frame above the pedal just for that use.

I tried something similar. Its my PTO disk that is stuck, didnt work.
The tractor slept outside last year and somehow water got into the bell housing. Both disks were stuck this last spring. I was able to work the transmission disk loose with some abuse, PTo still stuck

 

[Tx Jim]

Years ago, I had a diesel MF with a hung clutch that was locked. What I did was use a stout tree, put the tractor in 3rd gear, about a foot from the tree and drove it into the tree withy my foot all the way down on the pedal. Not for the faint of heart but it works.

You can also use the drawbar chained LOW to the tree with slack in the chain and drive away, When you get to the end of the chain, or up against the tree, something will give, usually the stuck disc.

Once you get it free and working, put a block of wood between the pedal and the bottom of the dash to keep the pedal depressed. Some tractors will have a hook welded to the frame above the pedal just for that use.

Chaining tractor to a tree then starting engine with traction clutch pedal depressed & trans in a gear in an attempt to free stuck traction clutch sounds like an excellent way to cripple or possibly kill the person sitting in tractor seat!!!

 

[SidecarFlip]

Chaining tractor to a tree then starting engine with traction clutch pedal depressed & trans in a gear in an attempt to free stuck traction clutch sounds like an excellent way to cripple or possibly kill the person sitting in tractor seat!!!

You read my post but didn't absorb the fact that I said CHAIN LOW ON THE DRAWBAR. Get some reading comprehension please. Chaining low on the drawbar, it's impossible to incur any personal injury as the rotational direction of the exerted pull is BELOW THE CENTERLINE OF THE REAX AXLE. If anything, force applied to the drawbar causes the front of a tractor to nose down, nor come up....

Not that the 'event' would last longer than a few seconds before the clutch plate broke free anyway.

 

[Tx Jim]

My reading comprehension reveals I never mentioned your tractors frt tires leaving the ground. I guess you've never seen/heard of a chain breaking? it only takes a split second for chain link to break.

My neighbors employee jerked on a chain attempting to pull out another stuck loader & chain snapped bursting both back & side windows plus LH door & windshield on a cab tractor barely missing the driver.

 

[Bonaro]

You read my post but didn't absorb the fact that I said CHAIN LOW ON THE DRAWBAR. Get some reading comprehension please. Chaining low on the drawbar, it's impossible to incur any personal injury as the rotational direction of the exerted pull is BELOW THE CENTERLINE OF THE REAX AXLE. If anything, force applied to the drawbar causes the front of a tractor to nose down, nor come up....

Not that the 'event' would last longer than a few seconds before the clutch plate broke free anyway.

Flip, since you enjoy insulting the reading comprehension of others, I would like to remind you that my question was not about the transmission clutch. It's the PTO clutch that is stuck. Your chain-it-to-a-tree remedy doesn't address the problem at all.

 

[D2Cat]

Bonaro, I would think if you could use the PTO for an extended period of time would have more effect on freeing the clutch rather then just giving it a chance on a stump. With a tiller you could use a stick to hold the clutch down and work it for an hour or so. Anything beats having to split it, if you can avoid it.