B1700 run upside down, in water.

[Brewer]

Yep.

Using the FEL to fill in part of a dam. I knew the new fill was soft and I was watching it, but late in the day the front right (downhill) wheel suddenly sunk deep and the whole thing gently rolled over to the right and didn't stop until it was upside down in about a foot of water. Fortunately I was able to scramble clear and I am unhurt, other than feeling like an utter fool.

The motor continued running for about 10 seconds then stopped before I could find the key. It didn't sound bad, just stopped running. I'm hoping it just ran out of fuel, being upside down and all. I did notice a lot of engine oil being spat out from somewhere at the 'top' - which is, of course, normally the bottom. Don't know what that is from.

I righted it a couple of hours later, and my plan tomorrow (assuming I can get it out of the dam) is to try and pop the injectors or plugs, check that it turns, and blow out any oil from the cylinders.

Obviously I'm worried that it may have sucked a load of water through the air filters, or that enough oil made it into the cylinders to lock and bend a rod. But I have no idea what else to be looking for at this stage.

Any help, theories or suggestions would be very welcome!

 

[Pitbull]

WOW!!!!!! I can't help with your questions, just wanted to say I'm glad to hear you're ok, that's a scary situation!!!!

 

[nickelplated5s]

If you don't want to pull the pan at least drain the oil to check it. I'd put a new filter on too. If you pull the injectors you can turn it over by hand, if it will.

 

[Daren Todd]

Drain/ change fluids. All of them as well as filters. On transmission, and front end, at least pull the drain plug and check fluids. Make sure they aren't contaminated. Remember, oil and diesel will float on top of the water. Water will be on the bottom

You can pull the glow plugs or injectors to clear the cylinders. Either will do. Use the starter to turn over engine to blow the crud out. You can't spin the engine by hand fast enough to blow the stuff out the top.

If there is water in the fuel filters, you will have to drain and purge the fuel system of water all the way to the injectors.

 

[Kubota Newbie]

What D T said. 10 seconds upside down probably not long enough without oil to hurt anything unless it was running wide open. Even then probably enough in the galleys and crank passages to lube it under no-load conditions.
Significant oil in the cyls in that time? Not likely
Water? Probably not if the paper element was in place. It would choke off the air pretty quick and kill the motor when the element got wet before letting any real water through.

 

[Kubota Newbie]

R.o.p.s. ???

 

[Brewer]

So this was yesterday afternoon. In hindsight I can see that it didn't actually get very wet:

 

[Brewer]

Later in the evening I figured I'd see what a chain block on that willow might be able to do. As it happens, it was able to do this. It is still on very unstable ground and would roll back in if it weren't for the chains holding it up:

 

[Brewer]

This morning I got another chain and come-along attached to the back of my ute (out of pic) and there was a lot of this:

 

[Brewer]

It looks precarious, and it is, but we were only moving it a few inches at a time and constantly adjusting the two chains, chocks, planks etc.

Finally we got it out onto solid ground and towed it round to the shed. There was really no physical damage, it had rolled in quite gently and I rolled it out just as gently.

The first thing I did was remove the battery and put it on charge. Hey, I'm an optimist.

Then I pressure washed it all down and removed the hood and panels.

I checked the engine and hydro oil - the level was down on both but no sign of water.

Next I removed the glow plugs - the cylinders were full of oil. Like right up to the top. I wanted to turn it over to blow that out, but I didn't want to pump any bad fuel through, so I drained what remained of the fuel, flushed the tank with some fresh diesel, (removed the TWO fuel-can nozzles that must have been in the tank for years), then replaced the filter and topped it up.

I decided to hook up a spare battery and gave the key a quick flick while standing beside it, not expecting anything to happen (normally I have to be pressing the clutch) but to my surprise it span over, blowing some oil out of the cylinders. I did this a couple more times, until I was seeing puffs of clean diesel from all 3 cylinders.

Then I replaced the glow plugs, gave it another wash, topped up the oil and gave it a crank. It fired straight up, blew a bit of smoke then came good. I started and stopped it a couple of times, gave it some revs, and it's running perfectly, other than the apparent bypass of the clutch switch. I ran all the FEL rams a couple of times, no problems there, and I've parked it up for tonight. I'll give it a full service before I put it back to work, but it feels ready to go.

I can't quite believe my luck!

 

[bearbait]

Your a lucky man, just goes to show how fast $hit can happen. You learned a hard lesson but could have been much worse.

 

[kbrothers]

Great to hear no damage to you or your machine One of those life lessons I suppose

 

[Lil Foot]

Great to hear there was no damage to you or your orange buddy.
You might consider going out & buying some lottery tickets while your luck holds.

 

[85Hokie]

Your a lucky man, just goes to show how fast $hit can happen. You learned a hard lesson but could have been much worse.

I'll second, third and fourth all that Bear said...... lucky is an understatement too!

 

[sgtboz]

I'm a huge seat belt advocate but if you'd had yours on in this scenario, do you think you would have been able to get free before being pinned underneath? That's such a scary thought. Glad your experience wasn't worse and is a good reminder for all of us. I've been up on 3 wheels like this and there was a real pucker factor going on!

 

[Brewer]

In this scenario, a seatbelt would probably have killed or seriously injured me - although I could have been killed or seriously injured without it too, I was just lucky it wasn't a higher slope or a deeper dam.

But I think it's well recognised that a seatbelt should only be worn with a ROPS. With no ROPS your best hope is to jump clear, you really don't want to be strapping yourself to any machine that will roll onto you.

A ROPS and seatbelt in this scenario would have prevented me jumping clear, but it also would have stopped the machine at 90 degrees (propping on the logs) instead of fully inverting. However I may well have broken an arm or something in the chaos of going down with the machine. And if the logs hadn't been there? Without a seatbelt I could still have jumped clear, but it's difficult to tell how far a ROPS would have penetrated the soft mud. I suspect not far enough to drown me, but I'm pretty glad I didn't find out.

I currently run without a ROPS. I do a bit of contract mowing on properties with trees, my own place is much the same, and the ROPS I have doesn't fold easily with my spray gear etc on the back. It is unusual for me to be working anywhere near an incline, being very flat terrain around here, but I think I will take this as a warning and re-engineer the ROPS so I can leave it on the machine. Not because it would have produced a better result in this case (the result I have is about as good as I could possibly hope for), but because this has shown me that even when dealing with risks I totally foresaw and was being careful about, when things begin to go bad they continue going bad very rapidly without waiting for me to react, and I suspect in most situations a ROPS will deliver better outcomes than without.

 

[Lencho]

Hi Brewer,
good job moving quick enough and in the right direction to get clear!
I appreciate the photos. Thanks for showing how a roll over can happen.
Do you think a counter weight like a box blade would have helped avoid the roll?
I’d also like to know if your rear tires are loaded or not.
Nice job getting it back upright and running as well.

 

[Brewer]

Thanks everyone for the tips and the kind sentiments, sorry I didn't acknowledge that earlier but I really appreciate it.

The rear tyres are water filled and the FEL was down - difficult to see any additional weights helping in this particular scenario. One of the things I have to constantly remind myself is just how small the wheelbase is on these things. A small bump or pothole feels huge as the whole machine rotates. But honestly I think planning and task management were what was missing here, I should have been more disciplined with the sequence of filling, and worked my way in from the solid end so I didn't put myself side on.

In case it isn't obvious I was parallel to the incline but up on the flat pathway. The dam cut in a bit too close to the house at that point and the timber retaining wall (now buried) was sagging a bit, so I was backfilling it. The existing clay is hard packed but I knew the new fill would be friable, so I was mostly just filling in from the accessible end and delivering the occasional load up the pathway to level it up and start getting some material in front of the retaining wall.

I can't remember if the bucket was full or empty, but it wasn't high. The front right tyre ventured onto my new fill and sunk deeper and quicker than I expected, and she rolled over gracefully enough that I could kind of step off it and scramble away over the logs and into the dam before she fully inverted.

 

[hodge]

You are blessed, and you've learned without serious consequences. The longer you operate equipment, the more likely that a person will have similar experiences. It is what it is, and we can all hope that we get by, as unscathed as you.
This also brings to light the fact that no safety features are absolute (seat belt or ROPS), and they can't take the place of caution and good evaluation.

 

[st8yd]

Glad to see you made out safe and it all turned out well.
I do not wear a seat belt and will not on my tractor, if something goes bad I'm bailing, Yellow jackets, fire, roll over, etc.
Just when you think you'll never need the rops it will prove you wrong.
I was bush hogging along a ditch one night trying to finish a project. The ditch jogged and I didn't see it. I had the bucket up as headlights were useless when it was down, I couldn't have dropped it quickly enough to have helped once I realized what was going on.
As it rolled I just stayed on the high side, rops, roof didn't keep me from getting clear of it. But had the rops not been there it would have been upside down.

I recently graded a back yard of a jobsite, stock piled the dirt as my dump trailer was being worked on. Dirt pile wasn't 2' high and found my self in a position where it could have easily rolled.

So I have become a big proponent of Rops, you just don't realize how much you need it till your there, and that quite possibly to late.