Do R4 tires suck in snow?
- Thread starter MAXA
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jyoutz
Well-known member
Premium Member
Equipment
MX6000 HST open station, FEL, 6’ cutter, forks, 8’ rear blade, 7’ cultivator
R4s have less traction in snow, but are superior for loader work. I have them and have no problems with plowing snow, but I also tend to have dry or wet snow, but not much ice with new snow. If you are dealing with ice very often, then tire chains are the answer. Some people on this forum are also happy with their tire grooving efforts.
Tractors are not designed for use in snow.
That said, many folks use tractors of many sizes to remove snow and tire selection is relevant.
Of the commonly available tractor tire types, turf tires are most effective in snow, followed by R-14s, R-1s and, lastly, R-4s. Z-bar tires are even more effective than turf tires in most conditions but these have become quite uncommon and were never available in anything but small sizes.
Adding "grooves" to your R-4 tires will provide a modest improvement in snow performance but they will never perform as well as do turf tires.
For serious snow removal work you will need tire chains.
My R4's do slip a bit, especially on packed icy road. Still like them on for winter duties. I cut a hole in my turf tire on ice a few years back. On the side wall. One reason I went with R4's.
The MX has R4s and the M has R1s. The MX has very poor traction in snow whereas the M will walk up a 40% grade in deep snow with ease. The converse is that the R4s on snow covered asphalt are a lot better than the R1s. There is no one size fits all but I ran screw in studs when I had the BX that worked great, but I didn't have asphalt then. Chains aren't great on asphalt either so you have to figure out a system that works for you.
I have R4's on my tractor and have a short, a bit steep incline that I have to go up to get to my barn. Unless the snow is light and fluffy I can't get enough traction to get up there. I grooved my tires and that helped some.
My last tractor had R1 tires and never had a problem unless it was icy.
My last tractor had R1 tires and never had a problem unless it was icy.
I grooved the R4 tires on the MX and also found that it helped with traction on both asphalt and gravel, but going off-piste in the MX is never a good idea. It's an awesome tractor in so many ways, and my first choice for blowing and pushing snow, but not my first choice for heading into a snow covered field to do some work.
Nearly all snow removal I've done has been on asphalt since we paved our driveway in the early 90's. Before that we had a gravel driveway and a 2WD tractor with chains. The last year or that the driveway was gravel we swapped the 2WD for the little Ford 1210 with R1's that still lives here. The Ford has done well except when there was ice or hard packed snow under new snow.
Grooving R4's did make a big difference on the last couple of tractors. We had a decent snow here on Sunday and I did two parking lots at the church and two more at the gun club. Then I did our driveway. The L4240 had plenty of traction to push the 8' Fisher plow, and since the plow is mounted on a QA plate on the FEL there were places the piles were pushed 7-8 feet tall. The rear tires are loaded and the only weight on the 3-point was a flimsy 6' blade I threw on Saturday just in case I needed to pull some snow away from the garage door.
The only place the tires slipped was here at home on the driveway hill on the first pass when I hit a patch of ice under the snow.(pushing snow uphill). I raised the blade and drove through the snow and then plowed down from the top.
Here's an older thread - see Post #652 for an idea of the driveway slope:
tractorbynet.com
Grooving R4's did make a big difference on the last couple of tractors. We had a decent snow here on Sunday and I did two parking lots at the church and two more at the gun club. Then I did our driveway. The L4240 had plenty of traction to push the 8' Fisher plow, and since the plow is mounted on a QA plate on the FEL there were places the piles were pushed 7-8 feet tall. The rear tires are loaded and the only weight on the 3-point was a flimsy 6' blade I threw on Saturday just in case I needed to pull some snow away from the garage door.
The only place the tires slipped was here at home on the driveway hill on the first pass when I hit a patch of ice under the snow.(pushing snow uphill). I raised the blade and drove through the snow and then plowed down from the top.
Here's an older thread - see Post #652 for an idea of the driveway slope:
Snow Equipment Owning/Operating - Cutting / Groving / Siping R-4 for snow
Got the iron too hot at some point. Oh wow... Not sure that's possible though... [emoji848]
tractorbynet.com
theres a lot of wisdom here. No one size fits all.
No one tire good for every situation.
R4's are hd tires, great for loader work on hard surfaces and gravel with decent traction on loose stuff. My tire of choice due to stiff sidewalls that are kinda top of pile for minimizing sidewall damages.
R14's more an all round tire.
R1's good in dirt/mud, OK in snow, suck on ice but many have weak sidewalls so not great pick for hd loader work or work in the woods.
etc...
like car and truck owners arguing what tire is "BEST" whether to buy summer, slicks, all season, winter, studded, put on chains, etc.... No one size fits all is a real truth IMHO. Gotta buy what suits your most common needs or get a second set or add chains.
Supposedly, R4s are the worst choice for snow. I only have one tractor, and it has R4s so no comparison for me.
However, I'd use chains after seeing the difference and chains work on ice, and I don't think any of the tractor tires will work as well.
However, I'd use chains after seeing the difference and chains work on ice, and I don't think any of the tractor tires will work as well.
NCL4701
Well-known member
Equipment
L4701, T2290, WC68, grapple, BB1572, Farmi W50R, Howes 500, 16kW IMD gen, WG24
You mention having lots of sleet. Sleet looks a lot like snow but it doesn’t act like snow. We get more sleet here than snow. Had about 4” of sleet outside yesterday. No snow at all. Looked a lot like snow, but if you put your hand out to steer your sled away from the rip rap pit at the tail race on the back of the dam (yes we did that), the “snow” felt like frozen 80 grit sandpaper.
Snow packs (sticks to itself really well). That’s why sipes work well for snow. Sleet is little ice balls that don’t pack until it starts to melt. If you want better traction on sleet or sheet ice, get chains. If you want better traction on snow, listen to some of the other folks who deal with it routinely.
Last edited:
Blue2Orange
Active member
Equipment
BX2380 with LA344S & QH05. SB1051. SG0554. BB1248. RB0560, Vassar dirt bucket
Yes.
JMHO, the issue with R4s are the spacing and size of the lugs are the worst option. That is, not far enough apart and tall enough to act as "paddles" in deep snow and not close enough for snow to pack in like turfs under conditions where snow on snow contact provides some bite.
Had R1s on the old NH. Larger heavier tractor probably helped. But the deep lugs seemed to provide significantly better traction in most snow conditions relative to the BX's R4s.
Looking at my ice and snow winter tires on the truck I notice snow packed into the treads and sipes. Have about 4" of very cold (sharp crystal) snow covering the driveway. 2 wheel drive mode and traction control did not kick in. No issues making it over and around the last steeper curve. BX. Without chains life would stink.
Sales promo from the dealer was for R14s. Supposedly the best of both the turfs and R4s, but at a premium cost. Then they noted I would need chains anyways given our trend for ice or hard glazed covered driveways over the past few years.
Ice or glazed hard pack conditions. Chains. Only on the rears right now. Really should have them on all 4 wheels. Hind sight. For R4s, the euro diamond pattern might be a better option v. the 2 link ladder I went with. More chain to ground contact. And maybe better lateral bite. Or if going with 2-link, the square link v. twist link style for better bite.
I should have added to my #6 post I only grooved the tires laterally and I can see where the groves fill up with snow. Once it warms up (June???) I plan on adding front to back grooves to hopefully help clean out the lateral grooves and also add less slide slip of the tractor.
NCL4701
Well-known member
Equipment
L4701, T2290, WC68, grapple, BB1572, Farmi W50R, Howes 500, 16kW IMD gen, WG24
You want the grooves to retain snow. Nothing sticks to snow like more snow. That’s the whole reason for siping. Nothing wrong with grooving in the other direction, but if they don’t retain snow, they don’t work.
Good to know thanks! But I was also concerned about the side slip, would adding front to back grooves help this without compromising the forward traction as you mentioned?
NCL4701
Well-known member
Equipment
L4701, T2290, WC68, grapple, BB1572, Farmi W50R, Howes 500, 16kW IMD gen, WG24
Like NCL4701 pointed out - you want the grooves to hold snow, since snow sticks to snow. I grooved the R4s on my BX25 and it made a big difference. If I had to do it again I'd probably try to fit 2 parallel grooves instead of single groove centered on the lug. My new LX came with R14s. I was planning to groove those tires, too, but the R14s perform well enough that I've left them alone.
airbiscuit
Well-known member
Equipment
New Holland T2310, New Holland TC21D, Kubota l3010 GST, Farmall H
I've Had
R1 Ag Tires - the best in snow
R3 Turf Tires - better in snow than you would think
R4 Industrial Tires - racing slicks in wet snow
R1 Ag Tires - the best in snow
R3 Turf Tires - better in snow than you would think
R4 Industrial Tires - racing slicks in wet snow