Slow FEL and 3Ph

[Jake9000]

I have a m9000 with about 3400 hours on it. Some reason the fel and the 3ph won’t raise without reving up the engine. I’m not sure where to start looking for issues.

 

[TheOldHokie]

I have a m9000 with about 3400 hours on it. Some reason the fel and the 3ph won’t raise without reving up the engine. I’m not sure where to start looking for issues.

Start by looking at the loader hydraulic connections to the tractor. Is this new behavior?

Dan

 

[Jake9000]

Start by looking at the loader hydraulic connections to the tractor. Is this new behavior?

Dan

I switched the dump/curl with the raise lower/quick connectors and there was no difference.
This tractor was just purchased this spring. I haven’t been able to use it hardly at all yet. The loader appeared to operate normally when purchased. It would raise at a good speed at idle.

 

[TheOldHokie]

I switched the dump/curl with the raise lower/quick connectors and there was no difference.
This tractor was just purchased this spring. I haven’t been able to use it hardly at all yet. The loader appeared to operate normally when purchased. It would raise at a good speed at idle.

Put it back.

Make sure ALL your rear remotes are in neutral. Dont rely on the levers - double check at the valves.

Dan

 

[Jake9000]

Put it back.

Make sure ALL your rear remotes are in neutral. Dont rely on the levers - double check at the valves.

Dan

loader hoses are in the proper locations. Both remotes are in neutral. I should add it also has a third function coming off of the loader valve.

 

[TheOldHokie]

loader hoses are in the proper locations. Both remotes are in neutral. I should add it also has a third function coming off of the loader valve.

Does the third function work?

Dan

 

[Jake9000]

Does the third function work?

Dan

the third function is working slowly like the FEL and 3PH

 

[TheOldHokie]

the third function is working slowly like the FEL and 3PH

If it were me I would start by checling flow and pressure at the loader inlet hose.

If that is good I would start eliminating parts oc the downstream circuit.

How are you fixed for extea hose.and a pressure gauge?

Dan

 

[Jake9000]

If it were me I would start by checling flow and pressure at the loader inlet hose.

If that is good I would start eliminating parts oc the downstream circuit.

How are you fixed for extea hose.and a pressure gauge?

Dan

Ok. I have the means to check pressure there but not flow.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Ok. I have the means to check pressure there but not flow.

5g bucket + stopwatch = flowmeter.

All we need is a rough estimate.

Were and how are you going to test pressure?

Dan

 

[Jake9000]

5g bucket + stopwatch = flowmeter.

All we need is a rough estimate.

Were and how are you going to test pressure?

Dan

I never thought about doing the bucket trick.
I put a “T” in and a gauge between the feed hose and the loader valve. I’m getting 400 psi at idle and 1500 psi at max rpm if I dead head the dump function.

It took 56 seconds to almost fill a 5 gallon bucket at idle.

 

[TheOldHokie]

I never thought about doing the bucket trick.
I put a “T” in and a gauge between the feed hose and the loader valve. I’m getting 400 psi at idle and 1500 psi at max rpm if I dead head the dump function.

Good work - thats perfect!!!

Five GPM and 1500 PSJ at idke is a bit anemic. Do you know what the rated flow for the pump is? I found 25 GPM but I dont trust the source.

Assuming the oil is at operating temperature the 400 PSI @ 5GPM is considerably more than I would expect but its not fully deadheaded. Move the gauge to the outlet side and see what you are getting there. Pressure drop across that valve should be in the 10's not 100's of PSJ.

I dont have a WSM but deadheaded pressure should be closer to 2500 PSI. That suggests a weak pump or something amiss with the relief in the loader valve. Disconnect the tank return hose and see if you are getting flow when the boom spool is deadheaded at 1500 PSI.

We are maKing progress.

Dan

 

[TheOldHokie]

I found a factory specification sheet for the M9000.

Flow: 17 GPM @ 2600 RPM
Pressure: 2846 PSI.

So that flow looks decent but pressure is way low.

Dan

 

[Jake9000]

Good work - thats perfect!!!

Five GPM and 1500 PSJ at idke is a bit anemic. Do you know what the rated flow for the pump is? I found 25 GPM but I dont trust the source.

Assuming the oil is at operating temperature the 400 PSI @ 5GPM is considerably more than I would expect but its not fully deadheaded. Move the gauge to the outlet side and see what you are getting there. Pressure drop across that valve should be in the 10's not 100's of PSJ.

I dont have a WSM but deadheaded pressure should be closer to 2500 PSI. That suggests a weak pump or something amiss with the relief in the loader valve. Disconnect the tank return hose and see if you are getting flow when the boom spool is deadheaded at 1500 PSI.

We are maKing progress.

Dan

I attached the specs for the pump. All I’m finding is 15.6-16.5 gpm at 2600 rpm’s. Mine is the combined flow type.
I will check outlet pressure this evening.
Thanks for helping me try to figure this out.

 

[TheOldHokie]

I attached the specs for the pump. All I’m finding is 15.6-16.5 gpm at 2600 rpm’s. Mine is the combined flow type.
I will check outlet pressure this evening.
Thanks for helping me try to figure this out.

What is combined flow type? Does thst mean the PS is supplying some flow to the implement circuit? Looking at the parts diagrams I cant see how that works.

Dan

 

[Jake9000]

What is combined flow type? Does thst mean the PS is supplying some flow to the implement circuit? Looking at the parts diagrams I cant see how that works.

Dan

im not exactly sure what combined flow is. I do know that the front pump is the power steering which also supplies the PTO. Then there are two pumps connected together next to the power steering pump that supply the 3PH, loader and auxiliary valves.

 

[Jake9000]

Good work - thats perfect!!!

Five GPM and 1500 PSJ at idke is a bit anemic. Do you know what the rated flow for the pump is? I found 25 GPM but I dont trust the source.

Assuming the oil is at operating temperature the 400 PSI @ 5GPM is considerably more than I would expect but its not fully deadheaded. Move the gauge to the outlet side and see what you are getting there. Pressure drop across that valve should be in the 10's not 100's of PSJ.

I dont have a WSM but deadheaded pressure should be closer to 2500 PSI. That suggests a weak pump or something amiss with the relief in the loader valve. Disconnect the tank return hose and see if you are getting flow when the boom spool is deadheaded at 1500 PSI.

We are maKing progress.

Dan

I don’t have flow coming out of the loader valve outlet until I get into the higher rpm’s then it does.
I moved the pressure gauge to the loader valve outlet port. I have no pressure there at any time no matter rpm’s.

 

[TheOldHokie]

I don’t have flow coming out of the loader valve outlet until I get into the higher rpm’s then it does.
I moved the pressure gauge to the loader valve outlet port. I have no pressure there at any time no matter rpm’s.

Your oil is going someplace.

Takk the inlet hode off and check for flow there. If you have inlet flow take the tank return hose off and check for flow there.

Dsn

 

[Jake9000]

Your oil is going someplace.

Takk the inlet hode off and check for flow there. If you have inlet flow take the tank return hose off and check for flow there.

Dsn

the inlet hose is how I checked for flow last night. So yes that has flow. There is no flow on the outlet hose. I’m going to have to assume the oil is going through the power beyond port, then through the third function and back into the main feed line going back to the three point hitch then.

 

[TheOldHokie]

the inlet hose is how I checked for flow last night. So yes that has flow. There is no flow on the outlet hose. I’m going to have to assume the oil is going through the power beyond port, then through the third function and back into the main feed line going back to the three point hitch then.

There are two outlet ports.

Tank port goes straight to reservoir and does noy normally carry oil.

PB is where the center flow exits and goes to 3rd function. You just checked that port and said no flow.

Dan