DEF---DIESEL EXHAUST FLUID

lugbolt

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Oct 15, 2015
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I asked my brother about DEF in military.

For the most part, it is not used. And a good thing too as in some parts of the world it is not available, and more importantly the engines used in a lot of the equipment are multi-fuel. meaning, they can run on kero, jet fuel and diesel. Kind of good that DEF isn't used, as it's a complication that can easily and quickly cause the vehicle to stop in it's tracks if DEF tank is ruptured or if it runs low or if it has more than about 34% or less than about 31% urea or it's too cold or too hot or whatever.

Some days around here you can see convoys of APC's and transporters running down the freeway at 55mph. They sound like they're still powered by the old 71 series Detroits but I don't know. I forgot to ask my brother. Some equipment is gas turbine, will run on about anything for the most part but designed to run jet-a.

He works on school buses now at the school system. Says DEF is for the most part a pain in the backside. Failing injectors often. Failed headers. Leaking tanks, hoses, lines. The costs of all this stuff, paid for...by the taxpayers. He says remember that next time a tax increase comes up. I played with Kubota's def systems before I left Kubota dealer. Yes it was a pain. It was income. But the people who plow and plant have to use it now, and it costs them too like it does everyone else.
 

Fordtech86

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quickly cause the vehicle to stop in it's tracks
we learned a little bit from this, we had to reprogram emergency vehicles (ambulance,fire trucks, etc) to not shut down or go into limited power mode due to an emission system fault.

but still curious as to where non emergency government agencies are buying these delete kits and programmers and who is installing them. Also who is paying for it 🤔
 
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Fordtech86

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Warning…May be fear porn, I don’t know. Consider the source 🤷‍♂️

 

ccoon520

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My work has had a hard time getting grease from our supplier due to thickener shortages and oil for gas engines is getting scarce on the shelf as well. So I wouldn't be surprised if diesel oil is in short supply as well due to additive package shortages.

I don't quite understand the quotations around base oils in the article, that is kind of odd. There are a bunch of different base oils that can be used and different additive packages that give a lot of differing viscosities, thermal and pressure resistances, etc.. Just a weird way to right the article.
 

aaluck

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Ive been following this. My 1-year-old ecodiesel obviously needs this to run. I guess Ill start buying 2.5 gallon jugs and stockpiling that.
 
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Fordtech86

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Just a weird way to right the article.
Im sorry, but 🤣

but same thing with supplies at work. Bulk oils are hard to come by at times (especially diesel oils), basic filters and maintenance items, not to mention other parts as well (especially electrical parts).

I’ve got vehicles from last fall that are still sitting there waiting on parts to show up.
 

L35

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Ive been following this. My 1-year-old ecodiesel obviously needs this to run. I guess Ill start buying 2.5 gallon jugs and stockpiling that.
It has a shelf life, don’t go too crazy.
 
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Daren Todd

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I was at RK this morning and there were 2 guys that between them had, I would say 35 or 40 jugs of DEF
I have a 300 gallon tote of DEF with dispenser at work.

We have 2 semi trucks, two F550 diesels, an 18,500lb rated Doosan forklift, and two 12" water pumps with 300hp Cummins diesels that take def.

DEF pump at the truck stop was $4.35/gallon yesterday when I fueled up the F550 service truck.

Tote cost us around $2.25/ gallon plus $300 for the def dispenser and 50ft of def rated hose so I can reach outside the shop bay with it.
 

Daren Todd

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Im sorry, but 🤣

but same thing with supplies at work. Bulk oils are hard to come by at times (especially diesel oils), basic filters and maintenance items, not to mention other parts as well (especially electrical parts).

I’ve got vehicles from last fall that are still sitting there waiting on parts to show up.
Currently for me it's Bosch injection pumps for a Cummins 2.8. No new ones available, and the injection pump rebuilders can't get parts for them.

I've had 3 starters on order from the local armature company for the same engine. Going on 4 months now.
 
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aaluck

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Warning…May be fear porn, I don’t know. Consider the source 🤷‍♂️
Exactly... and maybe not. This is the overall problem with the media. What should we believe?

What I can say is I went out and purchased 10, 2.5 gallon DEF jugs. (BTW shelf life is supposed to be two years when stored between 40-90). That should last me about 35,000 miles. If there is no shortage Ill use it anyway, no loss.
 
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lmpres

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lx2610
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It's not just DEF that's problematic....

A couple months ago, while driving my 2017 F350 Diesel Dually my dash display lit up like a Christmas tree. It was giving me a message that I had a DEF malfunction or something like that. "in 50 miles your vehicle will revert to limp mode". I knew I had plenty of DEF in the truck, but pulled into the Walmart I was passing and threw in more. Warnings went off but check engine light was on. Continued driving and the warning message came back on.

I brought it into my dealer to find out my #1 NOX sensor had gone bad. This sensor has a chip in it. The Service Manager told me not to drive the truck until they could get one because of the possibility of it going into Limp mode. The problem being, these sensors were on national back order.

My truck sat in my yard for just over 2 months! At my small dealership, I wasn't the only one waiting, there were 4 other trucks with the same issue! I am lucky that I don't depend on my truck for my livelihood. But that truck/engine is a common one that is. Think of how many small businesses that were/are affected by this back order.....Last week my sensor finally came in.
 

Daren Todd

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It's not just DEF that's problematic....

A couple months ago, while driving my 2017 F350 Diesel Dually my dash display lit up like a Christmas tree. It was giving me a message that I had a DEF malfunction or something like that. "in 50 miles your vehicle will revert to limp mode". I knew I had plenty of DEF in the truck, but pulled into the Walmart I was passing and threw in more. Warnings went off but check engine light was on. Continued driving and the warning message came back on.

I brought it into my dealer to find out my #1 NOX sensor had gone bad. This sensor has a chip in it. The Service Manager told me not to drive the truck until they could get one because of the possibility of it going into Limp mode. The problem being, these sensors were on national back order.

My truck sat in my yard for just over 2 months! At my small dealership, I wasn't the only one waiting, there were 4 other trucks with the same issue! I am lucky that I don't depend on my truck for my livelihood. But that truck/engine is a common one that is. Think of how many small businesses that were/are affected by this back order.....Last week my sensor finally came in.
Even worse is if you have one on the larger chassis (F450 or larger). There are limited dealers with a lift big enough to work on them. They had a transmission recall on the new 10spd automatics. They weren't allowed to order parts till the transmission was torn down. Once they started the repair, that truck sat on the lift till the repair was completed. Turn around time was about 2 weeks to tear down the transmission, order parts, receive the parts, and complete the repair.

Trucks are a first come first serve, so they need to stay at the dealership or lose there spot in the que.

We sent our flat bed in for the recall, and were first up. In two weeks when I picked the truck up, they had 5 other trucks waiting. That 5th truck was 8 weeks out to start the repair. 10 weeks expected before the owner got it back.