B6000 Battery Charging Problem

[Chanceywd]

The concens

The consensus I have gained from Kubota tech's who work on these machines as a profession is it is a mistake to rely on cheap meters to do diagnostic tests.

Diodes fail in several ways. Keeping in mind the diode's main job is to block one half of an AC signal, I have seen unexpected signals when trying to determine if a battery is being charged.

If things do not make sense with voltage readings, the first thing I do is to change meter scales from DC to AC.

If I am reading AC at the battery my findings are generally there is charging system trouble.

There are forum members whose electronics knowledge is much greater than mine and they may have comments to provide.

Dave

I have to agree Dave, I always check for ac when checking any charging system. Even small engine and motorcycle I have found it to be helpful. I usually grab my fluke 87 not the cheap meter.

Bill

 

[Oldie68]

I have to agree Dave, I always check for ac when checking any charging system. Even small engine and motorcycle I have found it to be helpful. I usually grab my fluke 87 not the cheap meter.

Bill

I hear you fellas on all counts. I'm no genius on electrical matters either.

 

[Dave_eng]

I continue to be puzzled how on the B6000 the headlight switch can produce 2 levels of brightness.

I wonder if the correct headlight switch is installed in the B6000 as the Operators' manual only shows a two position switch.

If you look at a later B model, namely a B9200HST, its headlight switch has the 3 positions b ut this is matched by headlight bulbs which two filaments.

None of this is particularly important as the three wire dynamo only had a short life with Kubota. John Deere uses a much higher output 3 wire dynamo on its newer tractors.

Dave

 

[Oldie68]

I continue to be puzzled how on the B6000 the headlight switch can produce 2 levels of brightness.

I wonder if the correct headlight switch is installed in the B6000 as the Operators' manual only shows a two position switch.

If you look at a later B model, namely a B9200HST, its headlight switch has the 3 positions b ut this is matched by headlight bulbs which two filaments.

View attachment 80632
View attachment 80633

None of this is particularly important as the three wire dynamo only had a short life with Kubota. John Deere uses a much higher output 3 wire dynamo on its newer tractors.

Dave

Not sure about the original or not headlight switch, but the bulbs in the apparently original headlights seem to have two filaments (not exactly sure) but the bulb number is 1156. Definitely a 2 position plus off switch, and from the rear connections aside from any noticeable identification markings appears original??
As I've stated I'm still learning about this unit. Trying to get the things that aren't/werent working to work as they should or better. Am I to believe that an alternative dynamo/alternator could be utilized? Such as from a john deere?

 

[Oldie68]

Not sure about the original or not headlight switch, but the bulbs in the apparently original headlights seem to have two filaments (not exactly sure) but the bulb number is 1156. Definitely a 2 position plus off switch, and from the rear connections aside from any noticeable identification markings appears original??
As I've stated I'm still learning about this unit. Trying to get the things that aren't/werent working to work as they should or better. Am I to believe that an alternative dynamo/alternator could be utilized? Such as from a john deere?

I can't recall but think i have only 2 wires to each headlight

 

[Mark_BX25D]

Not sure about the original or not headlight switch, but the bulbs in the apparently original headlights seem to have two filaments (not exactly sure) but the bulb number is 1156.

An 1156 bulb is a single filament bulb. Should have two wires - power and ground.

Definitely a 2 position plus off switch,

Are there two bulbs in each housing, perhaps?

Am I to believe that an alternative dynamo/alternator could be utilized? Such as from a john deere?

Not a problem, in theory. Conceptually, swapping in a different alternator for your alternator should be pretty straightforward electrically, and swapping a different dynamo for your dynamo should be straightforward electrically. Alternators and dynamos are very different, though, so swapping in an alternator for your dynamo, or a dynamo for your alternator, would be complex.

In practice, it's not that simple. A different alternator might have very different mounting characteristics and space requirements, for example. Alt for alt will mostly be a physical challenge, same for dynamo for dynamo.

All theoretically doable, though, and it's probably been done very successfully. It all depends on what it's worth to you. You'd probably be spending a lot more effort that any improvement would be worth in practical terms.

 

[GeoHorn]

The elect schematic above shows a dual element bulb…in which case the 1156 is an INcorrect bulb.

 

[Oldie68]

An 1156 bulb is a single filament bulb. Should have two wires - power and ground.



Are there two bulbs in each housing, perhaps?






Not a problem, in theory. Conceptually, swapping in a different alternator for your alternator should be pretty straightforward electrically, and swapping a different dynamo for your dynamo should be straightforward electrically. Alternators and dynamos are very different, though, so swapping in an alternator for your dynamo, or a dynamo for your alternator, would be complex.

In practice, it's not that simple. A different alternator might have very different mounting characteristics and space requirements, for example. Alt for alt will mostly be a physical challenge, same for dynamo for dynamo.

All theoretically doable, though, and it's probably been done very successfully. It all depends on what it's worth to you. You'd probably be spending a lot more effort that any improvement would be worth in practical terms.

Ok, got it, 1156 bulb single filament, only one 1156 bulb in each headlight assembly. Two wires power and ground.
Regarding a dynamo or alternator swap, of course, each might present their own mounting challenges. I'd only consider an alternator swap if it was feasible for mounting, the dynamo also if mounting was straightforward, or retrofit in tge same loaction as OEM.
I will however inspect and attempt to follow suggested troubleshooting/testing of rectifier.
Thanks to all for info.

 

[Oldie68]

The elect schematic above shows a dual element bulb…in which case the 1156 is an INcorrect bulb.

The socket from my recollection is same confiuration for the 1156 pin type so??

 

[GeoHorn]

The socket from my recollection is same confiuration for the 1156 pin type so??

Not sure what you’e asking by “so??”… but, for example, an 1156 socket would have a SINGLE contact inside its’ base…while an 1157 dual-filament lamp (which outwardly has a similar appearance) will actually have TWO contacts within its’ base. Furthermore, the 1156 socket (BA15S type)has accomodation for two pins in its’ sides that accept the 1156 equi-depth pins of the lamp…while the 1157 socket (BAY15D) type) has similar accomodation for two pins…but those 1157 pins are at different depths so that the lamp can only be installed in the correct orientation for the differing levels of illumination of the dual filaments.

See this illustration for the differences:

 

[Oldie68]

Not sure what you’e asking by “so??”… but, for example, an 1156 socket would have a SINGLE contact inside its’ base…while an 1157 dual-filament lamp (which outwardly has a similar appearance) will actually have TWO contacts within its’ base. Furthermore, the 1156 socket (BA15S type)has accomodation for two pins in its’ sides that accept the 1156 equi-depth pins of the lamp…while the 1157 socket (BA15D type) has similar accomodation for two pins…but those 1157 pins are at different depths so that the lamp can only be installed in the correct orientation for the differing levels of illumination of the dual filaments.

See this illustration for the differences:
View attachment 80671

OK thank-you for the illustration. I believe from recollection the bulb and socket is a BaA15S 91156) single contact bulb, as I attempted a couple of 7056 LED bulbs but didn't quite work as I had expected. So these I know are the BA 15S type base/contact.

 

[Oldie68]

I continue to be puzzled how on the B6000 the headlight switch can produce 2 levels of brightness.

I wonder if the correct headlight switch is installed in the B6000 as the Operators' manual only shows a two position switch.

If you look at a later B model, namely a B9200HST, its headlight switch has the 3 positions b ut this is matched by headlight bulbs which two filaments.

View attachment 80632
View attachment 80633

None of this is particularly important as the three wire dynamo only had a short life with Kubota. John Deere uses a much higher output 3 wire dynamo on its newer tractors.

Dave

Thank you I have the type switch as in this example but of course no symbols or description on the dash to indicate anything as such. The headlights operate on both ;positions although I don't a significant difference in brightness (maybe a teensy bit brighrt on second position, especially after finding a red wire on the switch going to the rectifier broken off, resoldered it back to switch)

 

[GeoHorn]

Note: I edited my post #30 above to point to the BAY15D difference (dual contact, different-level pins)

 

[Oldie68]

Note: I edited my post #30 above to point to the BAY15D difference.

I have 3 wires in total coming from the dynamo, and a 2 position headlight switch, (off, 1st position and 2nd position)

 

[Russell King]

I have 3 wires in total coming from the dynamo, and a 2 position headlight switch, (off, 1st position and 2nd position)

You may be able to look up a label part number for the switch for lights and find an image of the label to see what the function was

 

[Cat-herder]

Good morning all!

New here so of course I'm going to resurrect an old conversation as it applies to my current issue.

I have a B6000 with the 2 wire dynamo, dual range headlight switch with single element bulbs. They don't work because the sockets fell apart but I don't need them anyway.

Aside from that my issue seems to be opposite of most of what I can find in searching the forum. My charging system is not stopping. Battery is overheating, acid all over the place, and with a meter on it yesterday it went well over 17 volts before I decided not to burn up my meter and shut it off. I bought the tractor a couple of months ago and not used it much so don't really know the history other than it looks very original. Seller did say he thought it might need a new battery but I'm thinking the rectifier must also regulate voltage?

Anyone have helpful advice for me on this?

Thanks!

 

[Russell King]

You will have to correct the regulator side of the charge system.

try to take and post pictures of the regulator if you can find it.

some of the older Kubota models have some strange regulator systems that can cause problems to fix since they are obsolete.

hopefully someone more experienced will be along to help you

 

[Cat-herder]

You will have to correct the regulator side of the charge system.

try to take and post pictures of the regulator if you can find it.

some of the older Kubota models have some strange regulator systems that can cause problems to fix since they are obsolete.

hopefully someone more experienced will be along to help you

I learned a lot today. Chiefly I learned to actually read the emails from this site that say "do not reply to this email". I did a couple of updates but now understand you need to be on the site to post updates. Live and learn I guess.

As to the charging issue, it turns out the rectifier/regulator has a terminal labeled "E", as in earth. As far as I can tell it never was grounded, hence it couldn't tell what the system voltage was and kept charging away.

Once I grounded that terminal it settled in right about 13.7 volts or so. I can live with that. Now to neutralize the spilled acid and check electrolyte levels.

I also replaced a couple of fuel pump wiring splices, replaced the injector to tank return lines, and turned the fuel tank straps around the right way so the bonnet actually closes correctly. I'm OK with those things for the day.

Next step is to change the angle of the main loader cylinders so they move at a reasonable rate but that's for another post.

Have a great week!

 

[Russell King]

Great that you have the charging system worked out now and thank you for coming back to post about the fix.

Good luck with the battery acid remedy. It always seems to keep rusting away when I have the problem.