Perspective on Covid

[Abe]

Friend of mine shared this link with me. Whatever our thoughts or biases are, thought this was worth listening to.

 

[dlsmith]

The problem is that those irresponsible 30-something-year olds are getting infected, presenting as asymptomatic or only mildly affected and ignoring the sysmptoms and taking it home to their parents, grandparents and otherwise compromised people. Those are the ones who pay the price for the lack responsibility of the younger people.
The doctor's claim that "you can't even do it, there's so many zeros after the decimal point" is BS. He obviously doesn't know much about math in general and statistics in particular.
His claim that there is plenty of capacity in hospitals may be true in general, but the ICUs in some areas are getting filled to capacity again with very sick Covid patients.
Restaurants in general aren't a big problem, it's places like bars, when people are going to be in close contact that is the problem. That is the bar owners fault for allowing that to occur and not enforcing social distancing and/or reducing the number allowed in the establishment at one time.

If Covid-19 made your dick turn black and fall off, you can bet your behind they would take it a lot more seriously.

The young kid is a real wuss, made a big deal of a finger stick.

 

[torch]

While he claims to separate fact from opinion, in fact he frequently offers opinion as fact. For example, he opines that masks are ineffective, justifying this opinion based on the general population's lack of education on how to properly use a mask. It would be equally valid to state that masks could be more effective if the general population was properly educated in their use.

He states several times that those catching CV19 now are "relatively immune". Huh? "immune" means you can't catch it. It might be fair to say "relatively less fatal", based on a lowered fatality rate as the percentage of older people catching the disease diminishes.

But it is equally fair to say that deaths lag infections by about a month. People don't die immediately on catching Covid, they slowly sicken and then die. And while fatality is inversely proportional to age, it appears young people can still contract long-term organ damage, particularly to their lungs. Such misery seems to be a considerable distance from "relatively immune".

While the overall tone of this doctor's comments were a welcome change from the sensationalism coming from some quarters, I think it was driven more by political agenda than by objective analysis.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Restaurants in general aren't a big problem, it's places like bars, when people are going to be in close contact that is the problem. That is the bar owners fault for allowing that to occur and not enforcing social distancing and/or reducing the number allowed in the establishment at one time.

That covers it nicely. I see that here ion Michigan the Governor is considering closing Michigan Auto plants again... and, my wife read on her Facebook account (I don't do that), that the Jeep Plant in Toledo has a huge number of Covid positive cases and the workers there are complaining that Fiat-Chrysler was supposed to keep the plant clean and space the workstations out and do a bunch of other mitigation stuff and they did nothing.

But then whining is the popular avenue today. I don't see any of the workers walking off the job. Probably because FCA will replace them.

Didn't read the OP's post except to pull that paragraph.

 

[NHSleddog]

Well this "partial" hiding will keep it around forever. No need to get worked up over who is in and who is out. Who wears a mask, who doesn't. As long as 20% are always "partially" hiding, the flu will have plenty of new hosts to carry on for years to come. Or until the media stops scaring everyone.

It is like everyone just "forgot" all of history before this.

 

[dlsmith]

Or until the media stops scaring everyone.

Yeah, right it's all the media's fault, not that they don't chum the waters to a certain extent, but the complete lack of a centralized strategy and coherent leadership by the current administration is at more fault. Elect a clown and you get a circus. Which is precisely what we have.
Personally, the estimate of maybe 250,000 deaths due to Covid-19 is low. I think it will top 300K and maybe go to 500K before it finally subsides. But I hope I'm wrong.

Fear is what has kept us alive for the last couple of million years. Rest assured that if fearless Ogg had thought he could take down a bear with a his bare hands, his genes most likely didn't get passed on. lack of fear and stupidity are apparently genetically related.
Fear of the consequences for one actions is one of the best motivators for socially acceptable behavior for some people.
With Covid-19, and a lot of other diseases, those who don't suffer from the consequences of their actions endanger the rest of us. Just look at the HIV-1 epidemic, those who were at great risk, or were in early stages of the disease, gave it to many through blood donations.

Amidst all this gum flapping about mask wearing, social distancing or quarantining violating their rights is the most arrogant, self centered behavior I can imagine. Every right you are afforded by law or social norms comes with inherent responsibilities. Just as gun owners are held responsible for using and storing their weapons so as to protect the greater public, your behavior during a pandemic can have no less deadly consequences for those you come into contact with. If you are unable to endure a little inconvenience to help get this pandemic under control, then I guess you'd better do the rest of us a favor and go live in a cave until it's over.

 

[SidecarFlip]

I've become totally insensitive to the constant drubbing over firearms.

Lost all mine in a boating accident sometime back...............

 

[motionclone]

then I guess you'd better do the rest of us a favor and go live in a cave until it's over.

Nope, Im living out in the open whether you like it or not. Suck it up you dont always get things your way.

 

[NHSleddog]

Yeah, right it's all the media's fault, not that they don't chum the waters to a certain extent, but the complete lack of a centralized strategy and coherent leadership by the current administration is at more fault. Elect a clown and you get a circus. Which is precisely what we have.
Personally, the estimate of maybe 250,000 deaths due to Covid-19 is low. I think it will top 300K and maybe go to 500K before it finally subsides. But I hope I'm wrong.

Fear is what has kept us alive for the last couple of million years. Rest assured that if fearless Ogg had thought he could take down a bear with a his bare hands, his genes most likely didn't get passed on. lack of fear and stupidity are apparently genetically related.
Fear of the consequences for one actions is one of the best motivators for socially acceptable behavior for some people.
With Covid-19, and a lot of other diseases, those who don't suffer from the consequences of their actions endanger the rest of us. Just look at the HIV-1 epidemic, those who were at great risk, or were in early stages of the disease, gave it to many through blood donations.

Amidst all this gum flapping about mask wearing, social distancing or quarantining violating their rights is the most arrogant, self centered behavior I can imagine. Every right you are afforded by law or social norms comes with inherent responsibilities. Just as gun owners are held responsible for using and storing their weapons so as to protect the greater public, your behavior during a pandemic can have no less deadly consequences for those you come into contact with. If you are unable to endure a little inconvenience to help get this pandemic under control, then I guess you'd better do the rest of us a favor and go live in a cave until it's over.

Irrational fear also gets people killed.

Get it under control? That is funny. This current approach (the first in history) guarantees it will be staying around a long long time.
I am not the one afraid of this, you should hide in the cave. Send out a text in a couple years to see how it is going, it should still be alive and well.

If the media stopped reporting on it tomorrow, things would be back to normal in a few months. Yes, the cold will still be going around, but it will run it's coarse, just like it always has.

How old are you? Can you tell me how many times we have done this before for the Corona virus? You do realize the Corona family of virus's have been around for centuries? Actually pick ANY virus we have ever done this for.

But seriously, stay in a cave if that is what works for you. I am not saying how you should do your thing. Don't expect others to hide in a cave because you fear something. The hiding is what will prolong it. Your mask will prolong it. The partial hiding is what will prolong it.

Maybe I am wrong, I am just using EVERY virus and flu we have ever dealt with in history to this point as my base. So far this one seems like is is being handled wrong in almost every direction.

 

[sparky45]

While he claims to separate fact from opinion, in fact he frequently offers opinion as fact. For example, he opines that masks are ineffective, justifying this opinion based on the general population's lack of education on how to properly use a mask. It would be equally valid to state that masks could be more effective if the general population was properly educated in their use.

He states several times that those catching CV19 now are "relatively immune". Huh? "immune" means you can't catch it. It might be fair to say "relatively less fatal", based on a lowered fatality rate as the percentage of older people catching the disease diminishes.

But it is equally fair to say that deaths lag infections by about a month. People don't die immediately on catching Covid, they slowly sicken and then die. And while fatality is inversely proportional to age, it appears young people can still contract long-term organ damage, particularly to their lungs. Such misery seems to be a considerable distance from "relatively immune".

While the overall tone of this doctor's comments were a welcome change from the sensationalism coming from some quarters, I think it was driven more by political agenda than by objective analysis.

AND, is that your "objective analysis"?

 

[dlsmith]

Maybe I am wrong, I am just using EVERY virus and flu we have ever dealt with in history to this point as my base. So far this one seems like is is being handled wrong in almost every direction.

With the exception of the Black Plague and the Spanish Flu, we have never had a disease that spreads so easily that has affected such a large percentage of the population.
Ignoring it certainly is not going to make it go away. Living with it as an endemic infection can give it time and opportunity to mutate into a strain that could kill nearly everyone it infects, like Ebola.
You are correct, it is going to be with us for a long time, just a are a host of other viruses that are hiding in some as yet undiscovered reservoir that has yet to make the jump to humans. It's called zoonisis.

 

[NHSleddog]

With the exception of the Black Plague and the Spanish Flu, we have never had a disease that spreads so easily that has affected such a large percentage of the population........

That is simply untrue. We have acually dealt with Covid it'self many times through the past centuries. As well as thousands of others.

 

[Daren Todd]

That is simply untrue. We have acually dealt with Covid it'self many times through the past centuries. As well as thousands of others.

 

[SidecarFlip]

I like the Wuhan Flu better. After all, that is where it came from, Wuhan, China.

 

[Tornado]

With the exception of the Black Plague and the Spanish Flu, we have never had a disease that spreads so easily that has affected such a large percentage of the population.

Thats not true at all - but this is part of the problem. Because of the hype, panic, and nonstop 24 hour news cycle going on and on and on about this virus, it paints a perspective that this virus is unprecedented, never before seen, out of control. In fact, this is not uncommon at all. Just in the 2000's we have had the following virus outbreakds which were all coronoviruses: SARS-Cov in 2003, Hcov NL63 in 2004, HcoV HKU1 in 2005, MERS-Cov in 2012, and SARS-Cov-2 in 2019. That doesnt count all the other viral pandemics that occured like with varius Influenza strains like the Bird Flu, Swine Flu, etc. Every few years in fact we have a viral outbreak. What has changed this time has been our response and how heavily it has been tracked and covered. In 2009 the H1N1 (Influenza viral pandemic not a coronovirus) killed nearly 300,000 people worldwide. Most people know very little or nothing about that virus, or that it even occurred . Why? Because no one paid attention to it. Some say well Covid-19 has killed more people - and that may or may not be true actaully, because no one counted H1N1 deaths as meticulous as we have covid deaths. Most viral death counts are good estimates instead of actual head counts. This is why flu deaths every year are always reported with a wide range like "24,000 to 62,000 flu deaths in 2019" If they actually counted flu deaths every year in the same exact way they are counting covid deaths right now, you would have Hundreds of thousands of people dieing every year world wide to viruses being reported. You could scare people from ever coming out of their house.

When you get away from viruses and focus on actual health pandemics as a whole, this little coronovirus doesn't even bump the radar. As someone who has spent years reading and studying early american history, from the 1700's up through the civil war, there are lots of plagues and deaths from mass disease that dwarf this little virus. Many of them were mosquito born illnesses and the like, which the people of the time just didn't realize, but it wiped out people on a much larger scale. Some towns and cities would have 1/3 of their population die in some of these outbreaks for example. We have no concept of true struggle. If you study history you will come to realize how soft, padded, comfortable, easy our lives are today by comparison. We have gone soft as a result.

 

[CaveCreekRay]

"It's just a mask..."

 

[SidecarFlip]

One has to say that it was 'nice' of the Chinese to give the gift to the world. I wonder what will come out of China next?

 

[sheepfarmer]

One has to say that it was 'nice' of the Chinese to give the gift to the world. I wonder what will come out of China next?

You're not the only one asking that question.

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/202...demic-potential-increasingly-found-pigs-china

 

[SidecarFlip]

Just wonderful. Good read and allows one to contemplate about what might happen. I'm beginning to think China is a huge cesspool.

 

[sparky45]

Just wonderful. Good read and allows one to contemplate about what might happen. I'm beginning to think China is a huge cesspool.

It was deliberate on China's part, IMO.