Teaching Profession

[GeoHorn]

The deep seeded reason folks don't respect others property is they don't respect themselves!

It’s an education issue. As long as parents consider public schools as baby-sitters and rich folks resent paying for public schooling then we’ll continue to have parents as ignorant as their own parents. The way out of this circle is to get involved ourselves in local schools and PTA groups, pay teachers more to attract better teachers.

 

[Magicman]

Re: What did you do to or on your Kubota today?

No school nor teacher, regardless of the pay, can ever replace what should have been taught in the home.

 

[GeoHorn]

Re: What did you do to or on your Kubota today?

That’s exactly correct! But the problem is generational. The PARENTS are ignorant/uncaring so we have to BREAK that cycle. The teachers are overwhelmed by the challenges of the classroom needs and we aren’t supplying the tools they need: Time and money. But there’s been a constant pressure to reduce spending on public schools and we’re reaping those rewards.

We are not allowed to go into the homes and interfere with parents, so we must stress these skills in schools so the next generation of parents are better at parenting. This means we need to teach things that some groups are adamantly against: sex education, political science, government, social studies, citizenship skills, etc.

 

[dlsmith]

Re: What did you do to or on your Kubota today?

We are not allowed to go into the homes and interfere with parents, so we must stress these skills in schools so the next generation of parents are better at parenting. This means we need to teach things that some groups are adamantly against: sex education, political science, government, social studies, citizenship skills, etc.

But those very same uneducated people are the ones that oppose teaching those very subjects that will break the cycle. You know, all that LIBERAL ideology.

 

[NHSleddog]

Re: What did you do to or on your Kubota today?

That’s exactly correct! But the problem is generational. The PARENTS are ignorant/uncaring so we have to BREAK that cycle. The teachers are overwhelmed by the challenges of the classroom needs and we aren’t supplying the tools they need: Time and money. But there’s been a constant pressure to reduce spending on public schools and we’re reaping those rewards.

We are not allowed to go into the homes and interfere with parents, so we must stress these skills in schools so the next generation of parents are better at parenting. This means we need to teach things that some groups are adamantly against: sex education, political science, government, social studies, citizenship skills, etc.

Not enough money? Per capita we are usually #1 or #2 in spending IN THE WORLD. Always in the top 5. THERE IS NO MONEY PROBLEM. In our town, the school gets $24,740.00 per student. PER STUDENT! There is a HUGE spending problem, but no money problem.

We (the USA) have not been in the top 5 in learning/smarts as far back as I can remember. If we were in the top ten consistently, at least you could argue you are putting a competitive product out there.

So yes, blame all the parents for not spending the day in the classroom teaching their children, but don't blame money. Money has gone up, up, up, while the product has gone down down down.

I hear people say all the time "it isn't the teachers fault". Well it was a teacher that sent my kids home with this new math that doesn't add up in under 30 minutes and the rest of the common core crap. The parents have no choice.

It would be really great to hear ONE time from a teacher that there are bad teachers in the system that needs a vehicle in place to remove them. That common core is retarding the education process. That the school is spending in all the wrong places etc.

All I ever hear from teachers in our area is they are poor (45K average salary), the parents are to blame, the school has no budget. NEVER anything else.

I am not saying they face no challenges (what job doesn't face challenges) but money is not one of them. The public schools in America have a HUGE spending problem and unfortunately is isn't being spent on teaching the kids to read, write and count.

 

[aeblank]

Re: What did you do to or on your Kubota today?

Not enough money? Per capita we are usually #1 or #2 in spending IN THE WORLD. Always in the top 5. THERE IS NO MONEY PROBLEM. In our town, the school gets $24,740.00 per student. PER STUDENT! There is a HUGE spending problem, but no money problem.



We (the USA) have not been in the top 5 in learning/smarts as far back as I can remember. If we were in the top ten consistently, at least you could argue you are putting a competitive product out there.



So yes, blame all the parents for not spending the day in the classroom teaching their children, but don't blame money. Money has gone up, up, up, while the product has gone down down down.



I hear people say all the time "it isn't the teachers fault". Well it was a teacher that sent my kids home with this new math that doesn't add up in under 30 minutes and the rest of the common core crap. The parents have no choice.



It would be really great to hear ONE time from a teacher that there are bad teachers in the system that needs a vehicle in place to remove them. That common core is retarding the education process. That the school is spending in all the wrong places etc.



All I ever hear from teachers in our area is they are poor (45K average salary), the parents are to blame, the school has no budget. NEVER anything else.



I am not saying they face no challenges (what job doesn't face challenges) but money is not one of them. The public schools in America have a HUGE spending problem and unfortunately is isn't being spent on teaching the kids to read, write and count.

Don't forget the benefits and only working 9/12s of the year....

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[NHSleddog]

Re: What did you do to or on your Kubota today?

Don't forget the benefits and only working 9/12s of the year....

My neighbor is a teacher, she jokes about the top three reasons to become a teacher is - 1. June, 2. July, and 3. August - the same neighbor that makes well above the average in our area and always cries about the school not having any money.

 

[aeblank]

Re: What did you do to or on your Kubota today?

My neighbor is a teacher, she jokes about the top three reasons to become a teacher is - 1. June, 2. July, and 3. August - the same neighbor that makes well above the average in our area and always cries about the school not having any money.

Doesn't matter what we make (me included), it's not enough.

If you do the math on those salaries, they're pretty good. At least IMO.

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[BigG]

Re: What did you do to or on your Kubota today?

Don't forget the benefits and only working 9/12s of the year....

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Have you ever been a teacher? That 9/12 of a year is BS. I taught for 11 years. I took guns and knifes from middle school students. Had my glass broken and punched half a dozen times. At 6'6" and 250 lbs I was not a pushover but due to the laws and rules of the education system I was not allowed to defend myself from students that belonged in jail but were sent to school as punishment for felonies. Worked in my classrooms until 10 o'clock at night when the custodian would lock up the building and kicked me out. Had to work from 8:30 til 4:00 with no breaks. Had to walk the students to lunch and back to class during my 20 min lunch break. That was my only break for the day. Spent hours collecting scrap metal to raise money to buy supplies for my students.

I taught drafting, small engine repair, woodworking, construction math and was forced out of the school because I was to strict with the students and did not allow them to have fun as they were running bandsaws, table saws, radial arm saws, and drill presses. I never sent one student to the nurse for an in class injury.

My replacement had a student cut off a finger in the first semester after I left the school.

So all you that think teaching is easy and you only work 9/12 of a year need to get an education.

Teaching is a profession that you love and hate every day. I have seen several of my former students that went on to become diesel techs, machinist, construction workers and sheriff deputies. And they all came back to thank me for what I taught to them.

If you want to fix the schools ask a teacher not the politicians and administration. They have little or no day to day contact with the kids. Rules and discipline have been removed from the school to the point they can not function. The inmates (students) have all the rights and the guards (teachers) are handcuffed as to control them.

 

[aeblank]

Re: What did you do to or on your Kubota today?

My reply is more than I want to do on my phone.... Just a couple points.

You sound like a good one, who cared. Like so many jobs, I certainly couldn't do it. I respect teachers for sure, as just about anyone who does their job well and "cares" (from doctors to janitors--nobody likes a nasty bathroom).

Since you quoted my reply, you worked summers as a teacher? Most I know don't. Some worked construction or did drivers training for some extra cash. Several retired early (with good pensions, etc).

Lastly, the issues you spoke mostly about (except the scrap metal bit) aren't "throw money at it" issues. Much more so respect/discipline/accountability issues. $1M/student doesn't fix that.

But I'm sure we're way off topic.

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[GeoHorn]

Re: What did you do to or on your Kubota today?

And this discussion just illustrated the problem: MIsconception by non-teachers of teaching jobs, and the ridiculous idea that teachers have summers “off”.
My wife and most of her coworkers all worked 12-16 hour days, either by staying after school in the classroom grading and preparing for the next day, or at home doing the same thing but in both cases sacrificing their homes and family-time for their low-paid jobs. (Out of 50 states, Texas is in the bottom 5.)

How many other jobs give you a 20 min lunch break and 20-30 individuals to not only supervise... but to actualy TEACH something? I doubt very many people participating in this forum could stand up to 20-30 children clamoring for attention 7 hours straight while having to develop curriculum to keep their attention.

Summers Off? B.S.! Between “staff development” and required “continuing education” my teacher-wife typically had less than 30 days truly “off” (without paid vacation by the way) while during the school-terms had, besides classroom work and after-school work, had to develop and give away weekends on “field trips” and work-study programs..

Retirement benefits? Her health insurance is the highest priced, lowest benefits in the state, and her school system did not pay into Soc. Sec.so not only can she not obtain SS benefits... she cannot even get survivor’s benefits when I die.... even tho’ (before she was a teacher) she paid into that system for 14 years.

If you weren’t a teacher or married to one... your perception is entirely uninformed and likely completely ignorant of the reality teachers have to endure.

 

[coachgeo]

Re: What did you do to or on your Kubota today?

Have you ever been a teacher?...

yes and still am in an educational industry that pays 1/3rd of public schools, is year round and offers no retirement benefits at all. I want out but nowhere to go due to my age.

I'll have to work till I die.... if the pain does not kill me first (body is shot cause this type of teaching (acrobatic sports) is extremely physical.

 

[bearbait]

The same old story, never judge a man or women till you've walked in their shoes. Some people can make even the toughest jobs look easy but once you try it you will soon find out for yourself. Things aren't alway what they seem to be. Right now I highly recommend retirement, best job I ever had.

 

[ccoon520]

The same old story, never judge a man or women till you've walked in their shoes. Some people can make even the toughest jobs look easy but once you try it you will soon find out for yourself. Things aren't alway what they seem to be. Right now I highly recommend retirement, best job I ever had.

I 100% agree. Its like some banker saying that farmers have it easy because they only work from March-November. There is a lot more to every profession that outside people do not see. Just like everything else (from cops to cooks) the few bad apples make the rest of them look bad even though the hours and effort they are putting in are ridiculous. During the school year my wife works on classroom stuff nights and weekends as well and still has to report during her "summer break" for required things and to set up her classroom for the next year.

This doesn't even break into the discipline issues that kids bring from homes broken by poverty, abuse, jail, or divorce either. I have said it many many times that I do not have the patience or discipline to be a teacher.

 

[NHSleddog]

We must be unique here in NH. Our teachers here get the summers off, they also get 3 - 1 week vacations during the year and 7 days for teachers workshops. We are probably unique in that as well, so I will agree not all teachers get the summers off as long as you admit that a whole lot of them do get summers off.

But this thread and every other I have ever read, reads the same.
Teachers don't make any money (which is demonstrably false).
The schools have no money (false - they usually get the most in the world per student)
It is all the parents fault. (like they are the teacher all day).

That entire industry continues to be dishonest about the issues. It sure would be nice to hear some honesty instead of the same 3 lies over and over.

If you are in the 20's in the world for cost and in the top for learning NOBODY would complain about increasing the money. Now when you are paying the MOST and getting in the 20's for results, you can bet people will have a problem throwing more money at it.

We have a spending problem in our public schools. not a money problem. Bring in charter schools in every community and you will see the public schools change within a couple generations. If they had to compete it would be better for everyone. It would also be a TON of jobs for all those under rated sterling silver teachers we hear so much about that are just held back by the parents.

 

[Tornado]

Education, specifically self improvement, self teaching, and reading, is something that's always been close to my heart. Im in my 30's so a bit younger that most around this forum I believe. I did about half my schooling in private christian schools, and half in public. All of my highschool was in public school. It was the worst 4 years of my life. Some areas in the country have good public schools, but many areas its down right abysmal. I honestly dont feel I learned much of anything in high school that I either didn't already know, or taught myself during those years. Every day of school was just a circus. Kids showing out, fighting, horseplaying, teachers unable to control the class room. It didnt feel like school at all to me but just a mad house most of the time, with only a very few exceptions. I have not had any kids of my own yet, but if I do, they will 100% go to a private school, and I will be very involved in their education.

I side with those who say that most all of our problems start at HOME. We do not have parents invested in their kids as much these days. Kids these days are connected to the outside world, internet, social media, more than they are with mom and dad under their own roof. Its a culmination of things that all add up to worse and worse outcomes for kids. One thing too that has changed a lot in the past 100 or 150 years is the rise of the career woman. Do not mistake me - im not against women working and having a career as good as any man, but when BOTH parents are working full time jobs, I think the end result is less involvement with the kids, less education in the home. When you look back at history, mothers were typically the glue in the home. Many kids recieved tremendous amounts of their education from mother. Moms were with their kids, nurturing their kids, and drilling good character and morals into them. Times have changed though. You still see a lot of great kids though, a lot of smart kids with great morals and manners, and in most of those cases you see they have a strong connection to their parents - in other words - when parents are involved in the actual raising of their kids and not taking a back seat, it makes a huge difference. Parents take a back seat a lot today. Kids are raised on social media, the internet. Kids are far far more socially connected than they used to be. So many outside influences at such a young age. I admire when I see parents who refuse to buy their kids a smart phone until they are well into their teenage years. I see so many kids these days 10, 11, 12 years old with a smartphone already. It just sets up so many potential problems I think.

We need to push for school choice legislation. Allow parents to send their kids to ANY school of their choice. That should be the right of any parent - to pick their kids schooling. If I ever have a child, they will NOT go to public schools, I dont care what I have to do to pay for a good school I would do it. Education is so so important. Knowledge truly is power, and there is NO substitute for it. I would also push my kid to read a lot of books. If you can get a kid to start reading early, and get them into books, it will make a world of difference I feel.

 

[ccoon520]

We must be unique here in NH. Our teachers here get the summers off, they also get 3 - 1 week vacations during the year and 7 days for teachers workshops. We are probably unique in that as well, so I will agree not all teachers get the summers off as long as you admit that a whole lot of them do get summers off.

But this thread and every other I have ever read, reads the same.
Teachers don't make any money (which is demonstrably false).
The schools have no money (false - they usually get the most in the world per student)
It is all the parents fault. (like they are the teacher all day).

That entire industry continues to be dishonest about the issues. It sure would be nice to hear some honesty instead of the same 3 lies over and over.

If you are in the 20's in the world for cost and in the top for learning NOBODY would complain about increasing the money. Now when you are paying the MOST and getting in the 20's for results, you can bet people will have a problem throwing more money at it.

We have a spending problem in our public schools. not a money problem. Bring in charter schools in every community and you will see the public schools change within a couple generations. If they had to compete it would be better for everyone. It would also be a TON of jobs for all those under rated sterling silver teachers we hear so much about that are just held back by the parents.

The teachers not making any money is not entirely false. The average income for people with 4 year degrees is $50k (keep in mind that has extremes of those who get rather useless degrees and end up working for well under that and those that get astronomical salaries as well). Teachers who get a 4 year degree for education (which we can all agree is not a useless degree) make $40k (in Omaha) (10k lower than the average) out of the gate. Which if you end up going to a state school in state (think division I football schools) at the low end is still 10k a semester. So the ROI on that is 2 years not including interest if you had to take out student loans, cost of living, retirement savings, buying things for their classroom that the school will not provide like hand sanitizer, tissues, class library, etc.. This also doesn't take into account that in the fly over states the cost of living is relatively low. Imagine trying to live on a teachers salary in an actual large city and receive a salary that is 20% lower than the average for a 4 year degree in the same area.

Schools have no money is a little different. It depends on the school and how money is distributed through the district. A lot of the time the money and staffing is not going where it is needed and the schools in low income areas do not get the budget more successful schools do. Leading to large disparities in performance of schools that are within a few miles of each other and leading to these threads.


"It is all the parents fault. (like they are the teacher all day)."- This is 100% true. It is the parents fault every time. The teacher did not make you or anyone else push a child out of themselves into the world. The kid is your responsibility and their failures are your failures. If your kid is not doing as well as you think they should in school then YOU take the time to teach them math, or YOU spend the money to get them a tutor or send them to a private institution. A teacher is not a babysitter and they do the best they can within the bounds they are required to stay within. Teachers did not choose to implement common core, our representatives within the local, state and federal governments did.

If we want to see real progress in our education system support needs to be given to the under performing schools not taken away. You don't fix a flat tire by changing the radio. You put the time, effort and money into where it is needed.

 

[sheepfarmer]

There aren't any generalities about school funding. It is highly dependent on the state and district. Some states funding comes from property taxes, some from business taxes. Around here some schools are well funded, nice buildings etc, some are not. Most teachers I've talked to complain about being handicapped by parents who raise Cain with the administrators if they don't pass their kid or even give them an A when they don't deserve it. And discipline for misbehaving is restricted. Even poor school districts could give kids a better start if parents did more. The biggest problem for even good teachers is class size. I have only taught at the university level, and even at that age, more than 30 students at once isn't teaching it is crowd control. Can't imagine how exhausting it would be to manage 35 or 40 little kids.

 

[NHSleddog]

Yep, same old same old. No money, parents fault.

So in the end this will never be fixed because everyone running the show doesn't see any problems (except that it is all the parents fault and they have no money).

Common Core? Who's brainfart was that? Was it just put in place to slow our kids down? Everyday Math? Cute name, it is just the opposite of what it means. Too bad we don't teach the kids to count anymore. A "para" for every 3rd kid IEP's for everyone etc.

I see a TON of waste in the system, is is AMAZING that all the "highly" educated teachers can't see any.

And just to be sure, are these same "highly" educated teachers the ones teaching this new binary gender BS with the 57 genders and a bathroom for everyone? Highly educated, hmmmmmmm.

Lets just focus on learning real stuff for a few decades, get back on top, and then try to slow it all down again.

Charter schools will help a lot. It will give parents that do not believe the same three lies told by the system options for their kids. The charter school in our town (opened 3 years ago) is full and doing very well. No gender classes though. They already are adding on to the building and there is talk about adding another one.

 

[ccoon520]

Yep, same old same old. No money, parents fault.

So in the end this will never be fixed because everyone running the show doesn't see any problems (except that it is all the parents fault and they have no money).

Common Core? Who's brainfart was that? Was it just put in place to slow our kids down? Everyday Math? Cute name, it is just the opposite of what it means. Too bad we don't teach the kids to count anymore. A "para" for every 3rd kid IEP's for everyone etc.

I see a TON of waste in the system, is is AMAZING that all the "highly" educated teachers can't see any.

And just to be sure, are these same "highly" educated teachers the ones teaching this new binary gender BS with the 57 genders and a bathroom for everyone? Highly educated, hmmmmmmm.

Lets just focus on learning real stuff for a few decades, get back on top, and then try to slow it all down again.

Charter schools will help a lot. It will give parents that do not believe the same three lies told by the system options for their kids. The charter school in our town (opened 3 years ago) is full and doing very well. No gender classes though. They already are adding on to the building and there is talk about adding another one.

Literally all of that stuff is determined by the administration of school districts, as well as state and federal institutions. Yet it is the teachers fault?

Teachers don't set the budget or how things are spent. Teachers don't choose the curriculum or the books that are used, who the vendors for school supplies are. Teachers don't require a state and federal exam every 3 weeks of the year to determine what the level of the kids are. Who does these things? Elected school board officials, superintendents, principals, elected state officials, and elected federal officials.

What teachers do teachers do then? They take the convoluted crap that some one got a raise for and organize it into something the kids can learn and grow from. They deal with over bearing parents who think their kid that is eating glue in the corner is the next Elon Musk. And they do everything in their power to make sure that when the kid reaches the next grade they are as prepared as they can be to learn the new material all while prepping for the next state exam that is always 3 weeks away. All while corralling 20+ fur-less cats.

If you think teaching is such a cake walk go get a license, get a job at an under performing school and prove to us how easy it really is. We will all bask in your excellence.