Brush loosened an oil plug my L2950

rbargeron

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Unfortunately on several Kub models the front drive axle obstructs oil pan removal. On the attached brackets 070 and 160 hold the axle. With tractor supported under the transmission, loosening or removing the bracket bolts allows oil pan access. It's better not to take the axle away. If its decided later to take out the engine, it easier with the axle back in place. Unbolting the front frame from the engine allows it to roll away as a unit with radiator, battery, grille, & steering box.
 
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knightgang

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Unfortunately on several Kub models the front drive axle obstructs oil pan removal. Brackets 070 and 160 hold the axle (see attached). With tractor supported under the transmission, loosening or removing the bracket bolts allows oil pan access. It's better not to remove the axle. If its decided later to take out the engine, it works better with the axle in place. Unbolting the front frame from the engine allows it to roll away as a unit with radiator, battery, grille, bumper. steering box etc.
I see what you are saying and yes, brackets 160 and 070 are what I had identified with the 160 being in the way. Unfortunately, the 160 bracket would hit the oil pan coming out and would not be able to get out past the front axle input shaft.

I do not plan on "removing" the front axle, just supporting the front of the tractor and lowering the axle enough to get those pan bolts out then bolting the axle back up. Mine has the hydro static steering so withe the drive shaft out, the only thing connected to the axle is the hydraulic lines for the steering. I should not even have to pull them loose just to lower that axle a few inches to get to those bolts.
 

rbargeron

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Sounds good. On any of this my info may or may not be right - I have a L3250 tractor and my closest WSM is L2850. Anyway others here are pulling for you too and will chime in when complications arise. Take care, Dick B
 

rbargeron

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Knightgang,

(edit - wrong model cited, my bad)

info that's still good:
......got a PM from North Idaho Wolfman that he sent you a link to his WSM for the L2950. Sean's a good resource - good luck with your "discovery" phase,,,,,

Take care, Dick B
 
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knightgang

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Mine is the L2950 not the L295. Front axle mounting is different. I don't have the four bolts in the front, just have to lower the axle enough to get the two front center bolts out around (from under) the rear front axle bracket.

Now it looks like Saturday before I get to this, but at least I will have enough time for a thorough investigation. I hope I find minimal damage and a very simple fix...
 

knightgang

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Well, tore down the L2950 today. Turns out the only damage is the #1 rod bearing. All cylinders survived without a scratch, #2 & 3 rod bearings are perfect and the crank spins like it was sliding on glass.


BTW, rings were perfect as well. I can't figure out why it would not refire. Is it possible that the oil pressure sensor is wired in with the fuel cutoff solenoid and that could be why it shut down on its own and would not refire. It would be a great safety feature.

New rings, new rod bearings, intake, exhaust and head gaskets will be ordered tomorrow.

Should I replace that rod as well?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

bcbull378

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Good luck with the rebuild, make sure when your done the oil plug is good and tight I find it hard to believe that a tightend oil plug could be loosened by brush, but the damnedest thing happen.
 

North Idaho Wolfman

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I can't figure out why it would not refire. Is it possible that the oil pressure sensor is wired in with the fuel cutoff solenoid and that could be why it shut down on its own and would not refire. It would be a great safety feature.

Should I replace that rod as well?
No there is no interlock like that, Probably wouldn't fire because it was just spinning to slow.

By the looks of that rod I would say yes.

Are you going to turn the crank or replace it? :confused:
If your going to turn it, get that done first so you know what size rod bearings you need.
 

knightgang

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No there is no interlock like that, Probably wouldn't fire because it was just spinning to slow.

By the looks of that rod I would say yes.

Are you going to turn the crank or replace it? :confused:
If your going to turn it, get that done first so you know what size rod bearings you need.
First thing I am going to try is to soak that rod journal in muratic acid to eat off the aluminum then see how bad the scoring really is. If I that is successful and I can get a standard bearing back in it and be within tollerance (after some emery cloth polishing, then we are going to try that first. I really don't want to pull this tractor apart right now if I can get by without doing that. I have seen several old timers do this in V-8 truck engines and drove them over 100K miles after the repair some are still being driven after 20 years.

Once the house is built and I have a better suited shop for large projects, I may very well take the whole thing apart and overhaul the entire tractor and loader to include a full machined engine rebuild and anything the transmission my need.
 

tempforce

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had the same thing happen to me last summer. on my L3200. the next oil change, i'm taking the oil plugs to a machine shop and have holes drilled in the heads of the plugs. so that i can lock wire them, after each oil change. replacing or repairing a engine is too expensive..
 

knightgang

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had the same thing happen to me last summer. on my L3200. the next oil change, i'm taking the oil plugs to a machine shop and have holes drilled in the heads of the plugs. so that i can lock wire them, after each oil change. replacing or repairing a engine is too expensive..
I thought about going that with my drain plugs. But, I figured that with the brush we are driving over, it would likely break the wire. I plan on making a skid plate for the bottom to keep the brush from hitting the plugs and disconnecting my loader quick connect fittings.
 

Tooljunkie

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My buddy does his hogging in reverse, but the risk is tire puncture. Hasnt yet, but he does it in summer and all the saplings are green, softer than when frozen.
 

North Idaho Wolfman

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That tractor was not designed to drive through heavy brush and trees!
Your just going to do more damage to other parts doing that!
Keep it up and all you'll have is a junk pile to haul off!

Get the right equipment to do the job, rent, borrow, beg for a skid steer or mini dozer to do the heavy brush clearing! Then you can use the tractor to finish it off.

I'm betting you would already have been better off doing that before doing all the damage you have done to it.

While cleaning some aluminum scum off of the crank sounds all well and good, but you'll be lucky is it lasts a day after the rebuild.
There is a HUGE difference between the wear and force of an old gasoline V8 then there is on a high compression diesel, 120lbs to 400lbs is a VERY VERY big difference!
And how are you going to polish the crank, you can't spin it up to speed to get any kind of a good even polish on it with the crank in the tractor, and if you do spin it you'll fry any other bearings due to the lack of oil pressure.
Get it wrong and seize the new bearing and toss a rod through the block and you can just take it out back and use it for target practice, because as I've noted in the past that is a one of a kind motor and you would almost be guaranteed not to be able to replace it.
 

knightgang

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That tractor was not designed to drive through heavy brush and trees!
Your just going to do more damage to other parts doing that!
Keep it up and all you'll have is a junk pile to haul off!

Get the right equipment to do the job, rent, borrow, beg for a skid steer or mini dozer to do the heavy brush clearing! Then you can use the tractor to finish it off.

I'm betting you would already have been better off doing that before doing all the damage you have done to it.

While cleaning some aluminum scum off of the crank sounds all well and good, but you'll be lucky is it lasts a day after the rebuild.
There is a HUGE difference between the wear and force of an old gasoline V8 then there is on a high compression diesel, 120lbs to 400lbs is a VERY VERY big difference!
And how are you going to polish the crank, you can't spin it up to speed to get any kind of a good even polish on it with the crank in the tractor, and if you do spin it you'll fry any other bearings due to the lack of oil pressure.
Get it wrong and seize the new bearing and toss a rod through the block and you can just take it out back and use it for target practice, because as I've noted in the past that is a one of a kind motor and you would almost be guaranteed not to be able to replace it.
Wolfe, I appreciate the feedback that you post to help members if this forum, including me. However, while I am asking a lot of this tractor, I do not think that I am in anyway pushing it beyond it limits. You have not seen the area in question and therefore cannot place an accurate judgement on just how thick of brush this is. We do not run over trees lager than about 2in in diameter and we try to avoid those. Most of them end up pushing over then it gets chopped while laying flat on the ground.

The great majority of the grown is wild bushes and vines. We are taking very good care of the tractor and other than this unfortunate incident with the oil plug, nothing else of significance has happened to it other than normal wear and tear. (Knocking a light off the fender does not count in my book and will be fixed once we are done with this clearing.)

Point being, there is more than one way to fix my issue at hand. Aluminum has a significantly lower melting point than steel and therefore the melted aluminum is all that I expect to find wrong with the crank journal. Once I get the aluminum off and polish I will take multiple measurements of that journal and the other two corresponding journal to see if there is any significant difference to be concerned about. Since the bearings was still in the journal, no steel to steel contact was make between the crank and the rod, therefore the crank nor the rod should be out of round. I am still debating on reusing that rod and will be taking measurements of it tonight to make a final determination.

The process I described above for cleaning and salvaging a crank shaft has been used for many decades in everything from V-8 trucks to racing motorcycles, drag cars and semi diesels. It all comes down to tolerance. If the tolerance is correctly within spec (weather done this way or at a machine shop) then it is within spec and will perform just fine.

I think you assume I am trying to cut corners and will grenade my engine by doing so. While I am trying to save dollars I am also trying to save time by not having to rely on others. If I can make this repair within spec on my own, then I will have this tractor back to work before any other shop can do it for me while dealing with other workloads and waiting on parts.

Again, if it does not meet spec and needs additional work at a machine shop, then it will go the the machine shop. Either way, it will be done right and within spec. Question here is who decides what is right? Old timers that have performed backyard fixes for decades or the professional that does this everyday with near endless resources. I say it does not matter if it works and stands the test of time and that is all about the specs.
 

KellyfromVA

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We do not run over trees lager than about 2in in diameter and we try to avoid those. Most of them end up pushing over then it gets chopped while laying flat on the ground.
I've actually made the same assumption/mistake. The difference is, my hydraulic oil filter got torn in two, not the engine oil plug. 2" trees don't stay horizontally-flat after you run over them. They spring back up and hit things under your tractor, limbs get wedged in linkage, etc. Running over brush other than grass is just asking for damage.

I think you assume I am trying to cut corners and will grenade my engine by doing so. While I am trying to save dollars I am also trying to save time by not having to rely on others. If I can make this repair within spec on my own, then I will have this tractor back to work before any other shop can do it for me while dealing with other workloads and waiting on parts.
Having been a service manager at a Kubota dealership, I agree with Wolfman that what you're proposing is a bad idea. By the looks of the photos, the number one connecting rod was severely overheated as evidence by the bluing around the big (crankshaft) end. That connecting rod is likely to catastrophically fail just above the crankshaft journal sometime under load.

Usually after spinning a crankshaft bearing as what was in the photo, the rod journal can't just be cleaned up with emery cloth and spit. The bearing surface is no longer level, causing uneven bearing wear. Failure of the new bearing again isn't a matter of whether, but how fast. Not sure if you checked the crankshaft main bearings too, but given the number one spun and overheated significantly, there is a possibility that one of the main bearings spun or were damaged too. That crank should be removed and checked with a micrometer.
 
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knightgang

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Not sure if you checked the crankshaft main bearings too, but given the number one spun and overheated significantly, there is a possibility that one of the main bearings spun or were damaged too. That crank should be removed and checked with a micrometer.
There would be evidence of a main bearing failure. Drag on the crank and the sound of rough metal on metal surfaces. Did you see where I said that the crank spins like it was on wet glass with all of the rods out?
 

North Idaho Wolfman

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We are just trying to open your eyes and mind to a more seasoned take on this situation, how many severe engine, rod, crank failures have you dealt with first hand? Me, I've dealt with more than I can count and every time I've dealt with a situation like yours when someone goes the cheap / easy route in a fix it will eventually cost them way more in the long run.

It doesn't sound like your going to listen to any amount of begging and pleading for you to save yourself from doing something that could cost you dearly down the line.

Doing a complete rebuild could have already been done in the time you've weighed all this out, and probably for much less than you think.
Replacing parts and machining parts that are most obviously stressed and overheated is only logical, but you feel otherwise, so I bow out.

I wish you no ill will and wish you all the luck getting it fixed. ;)
 

Tooljunkie

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Its not uncommon to do a bearing roll in a semi truck,some nearing the half-million mile mark. Albeit a spun bearing is a spun bearing, the muriatic acid will clean off the bearing material and nobody knows the outcome until its at that point. A polish with crocus cloth and a few measurements will determine the next step. I agree the con rod will be in a weakened state and i wouldnt trust it. Dropping main caps and inspecting the condition would be due dilligence. As mentioned if it is below spec it will come out for machine work. A great deal of work is already done towards that step.

Wolfman has a great deal of experience in this field, i on the other hand frequently deal with things like marine and snowmobile engines that exceed 6500 rpms,and use near nothing for an oil film to lubricate. Mind you they run on the edge of self destruction from new.

Hope it works out well.