know I need a tractor, but too much or to little??

[virginiavenom]

hey all, I'm currently in the market for my first tractor. I am a small ranch owner and about to upgrade to a larger property. I own 15 acres currently that I use for horses, and chickens. I am a mechanic by trade but have never had a tractor, I've always done all the work on our property myself.....turns out I'm getting older and it's not so easy anymore. post hole digging with a hand auger is getting old.....and tired of having others have to do my grading or general dirt work. usually push a round bale out of my truck from time to time too. anyway my needs are simple. the only tractor I've ever used is a friends old b series, only weighs like 1000 lbs. we tried doing some dirt work with it, turns out it just wasn't enough tractor for it, mostly the weight and lifting capacity.

I've looked at some like the L3560 but not sure if that's too much or not enough.

what I know I want are the following:
weight (at least 3000 lbs)
FEL
4 in 1 bucket
hay bale spear (needs to be able to handle a large round bale)
4wd
enough to do small square bales in the future or possibly round bales, no money for the equipment at the moment though.
cab tractor with heat and air.
FEL needs to have skid steer style quick attach and hydraulics obviously for 4 in 1.
post hole digger with the ability to push down.....used a friends large JD tractor with a post hole digger one time at his place in north dakota.... other than the raw power or control.....it sucked at digging without being able to push.
6 foot brush hog or finish mower.
6 foot box blade

I don't want to go crazy on price, but don't want to regret my purchase either. I don't want it to struggle during any of the tasks I lined out.

if I should be looking at other models please let me know. I'm not made of money so I'd like to keep it under 40k if possible. I know the 3560 I was quoted on was with cab and large FEL for 33,400 without taxes as I'm ag exempt. is this a good price? I have no idea what the give/take of the tractor market is like I do the car market. anyone done it through kubota financing? thoughts on how you like them?

any other worth the while attachments I should get while I'm there or special tools needed?

Thanks

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

I would say first that's too small of a tractor to safely handle round bales.
I would bump up to the M's if that's what you need it for.
Everything else is not really a factor.

 

[virginiavenom]

I would say first that's too small of a tractor to safely handle round bales.
I would bump up to the M's if that's what you need it for.
Everything else is not really a factor.

what are the differences between the Ms and the L series? is it mostly chassis size/weight?

 

[Ridger]

I was looking for a tractor a few months ago and looked at some used ones in my area. I looked at a MX4700 that had less than 200 hours, FEL, rear remote, R1 tires, and one owner. The Kubota dealer was asking $23,800 for it. I found an L3940 that met my needs and I bought that one instead. As of a month ago, the MX4700 was still available. The dealer told me the difference in the L and M series is that the M series have a heavier built frame and are primarily agricultural tractors.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

what are the differences between the Ms and the L series? is it mostly chassis size/weight?

Length, width, weight, HP, Lift capacity on both the three point and the Loader.

I personally would avoid the MX series as they are 1/2 L and half M, step up to a full M.

 

[virginiavenom]

seems like they are way more expensive at least on the kubota website. which really sucks I might add.

can you recommend a specific model M I should investigate? besides frame being heavier what are the primary differences from L to M?

 

[mickeyd]

Welcome to the forum. Bigger is always better for those times when you really need it.

 

[DocGP]

Do any of the Kubota's have a power down option for a post hole digger? Or are we talking FEL post hole digger?

Doc

 

[virginiavenom]

Do any of the Kubota's have a power down option for a post hole digger? Or are we talking FEL post hole digger?

Doc

from what I've been told it's just an auxilary hydraulic for the rear, although I believe I might just get a front end one like a skid steer. the rears supposedly only put a maximum of 400 lbs of downpressure on it, which really isn't enough. I built a rig on a friends where it looks like a giant jousting pole that he would have someone push down on the end like a giant breaker bar to put pressure on his PTO driven post hole digger.

I personally don't understand why a 3 point is not already set up to push down from the factory....I'll never understand why.

 

[CaveCreekRay]

If it needs weight, the manufacturer usually provides it.

By having no down pressure, the implement has a means of escape if you encounter something hard. Take a rototiller, Put 300 lbs of down pressure on that and hit an average size stone and you will break something. Unweighted, the tiller can pop up and over and keep going.

Less down pressure.
Less breakage.
Less repair.
Less cost.
More up time.

Buddy of mine has a post hole digger on his 3pt (L3800) and it works like a dream in Ohio's clay soil. Many have an auger that pulls the bit into the soil. I am not sure that would work very well in AZ rocky soil conditions.

 

[BAP]

If you are going to handle round bales, you a tractor big enough to do it safely. There is a couple of ways to obtain more tractor for your dollar.
1) Buy a tractor without a cab, that will save quite a bit. Unfortunately, it makes the tractor not so nice to run in the heat, cold, dust, inclement weather.
2) Buy a low hour used tractor. A lot of times, you can find some nice used tractors with low hours that somebody bought and didn't really need. It can take some looking to find one, but can be well worth it.

 

[virginiavenom]

so is it that an L series just simply won't handle lifting round bales? because I'm being told by a few dealers there are no available cabs for the MX series. there is also no backhoes for the Ms or topNtilt systems, a little playing on the kubota website finds this to be accurate. as well as MX being the largest available with a HST. their recommendation is a grand L60. some say the 3560 is enough, some say hydraulically it won't do it. although it seems the hydraulic pump flow rates appears to be very close to the same among all the L series. the L series can have a backhoe. can also have a mid PTO kit, a cab, and 4in1 buckets appear to be available as well as hay bale spears. now I would assume the hay bale spear wouldn't be available for that particular model if the tractor wasn't heavy enough to do it. the other advantage I see is that it is easily towable even with the fel and bucket on a half ton truck. where some of the larger ones when you add a FEL and a bucket are coming in around 7500 or more. my truck would do it, but I don't imagine it being happy about it.

 

[sheepfarmer]

I have an L3560 hst which I love, it does everything I've asked of it. 15 acres, horses sheep.The issue with lifting heavy things from the lever arm of a fel is that the whole enterprise gets tippy. Those roll bars are on there for a reason. For example, I notice it if I do something like trying to dump a load of manure onto the top of my mulch heap. When the front wheels get into something soft like mulch, the weight of the tractor can make one front wheel sink in more than the other, and all of a sudden what looked like something safe, isn't. A load of manure in a bucket is way lighter than a round bale. So what NIW and the other guys were saying was if you have to handle a lot of round bales, you are safer with a wider, heavier tractor.

 

[virginiavenom]

ahhh, see I was planning on multiple things to help it's static weight when dealing with that anyway. it would have a box blade or brush hog on it at all times as well as the rear tires not only having the coolant in them but also having 2 add on wheel weights per rear tire. our round bales down here tend to be much dryer and lighter than most. but I understand the physics that take place with a tractors front to back weight bias for loader work. hell it might even have a back hoe on it which I'm sure is heavier than anything else out back while doing work. what if anything are your regrets and what options did you get on your 3560? how many hours do you have on it so far? still looking at how I should spec mine out. also wondering if you don't mind what kind of pricing offset from "MSRP" I can expect for wiggle room.

Thanks for the activity and useful information on my thread guys.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

The grand L's are a little heavier especially with a cab, and a backhoe on the back.
ballast the tires and you might be fine for smaller round bales, I guess it has a lot to do with terrain and pucker power, I personally don't like it when the tractor gets tippy, just takes a second to flip a tractor on it's side or worse on it's top!
If you take the round bales out of the equation then all is good.

Edit: Most dealers offer no discount to MSRP as they don't have to, to sell them.

 

[D2Cat]

Since hay bales seem to be the critical factor why not take a couple in to get weighed. Then you can present the dealer with some facts on what you need to do with the tractor.

If you try to cut it close, the weight of bales to capacity of tractor, you're inviting grief in my opinion.

If you're wrapping your own hay, what happens if you buy a different baler and it makes bigger bales, but you can't haul them so you have to drop them early to accommodate. That's a waste of time and money.

If you buy hay and have to go to a different supplier, same problem.

If what I needed (and I was looking at new)was out of my budget, I'd look for a good used larger tractor. Just end up with what will do the job, not something that just fits your budget.

 

[virginiavenom]

Since hay bales seem to be the critical factor why not take a couple in to get weighed. Then you can present the dealer with some facts on what you need to do with the tractor.

If you try to cut it close, the weight of bales to capacity of tractor, you're inviting grief in my opinion.

If you're wrapping your own hay, what happens if you buy a different baler and it makes bigger bales, but you can't haul them so you have to drop them early to accommodate. That's a waste of time and money.

If you buy hay and have to go to a different supplier, same problem.

If what I needed (and I was looking at new)was out of my budget, I'd look for a good used larger tractor. Just end up with what will do the job, not something that just fits your budget.

my problem is that out of those tractors that are bigger and would handle the round bales easy is that none have cabs HST, or have the ability to do what I need the tractor to do and don't want to have to buy multiple tractors when I see no good reason why one good tractor won't do it. as stated the M series do not offer an HST, nor do they offer top-N-Tilt, nor backhoe options. other factors being half ton truck vs having to buy a HD truck.

 

[sheepfarmer]

ahhh, see I was planning on multiple things to help it's static weight when dealing with that anyway. it would have a box blade or brush hog on it at all times as well as the rear tires not only having the coolant in them but also having 2 add on wheel weights per rear tire. our round bales down here tend to be much dryer and lighter than most. but I understand the physics that take place with a tractors front to back weight bias for loader work. hell it might even have a back hoe on it which I'm sure is heavier than anything else out back while doing work. what if anything are your regrets and what options did you get on your 3560? how many hours do you have on it so far? still looking at how I should spec mine out. also wondering if you don't mind what kind of pricing offset from "MSRP" I can expect for wiggle room.

Thanks for the activity and useful information on my thread guys.

I have about 33 hours on my 3560, I got it in November. So I am still a newbie, and the comments below are from that perspective. The rear tires are loaded. I have a front end loader with a 6 ft light materials bucket and a 6 ft rear blade. I use both for clearing snow, and the bucket to carry manure from my horse stalls to a manure pile, and when spring comes will pick it up again and if I can fix my old spreader, spread it on the pasture. I can fit 4 square bales in the bucket and carry to sheep.

I started out wanting a pricy hydraulic angle-able front snow blade, but realized that it would be a pain for me to switch hydraulics around all the time and I'd need the bucket on most of the time. Several people said you probably can do most of the snow removal you want with the bucket. They were right. I am still learning the best snow removal techniques with the bucket and the rear blade. I think I want a brush hog in the spring, or maybe a flail mower.

Re: the tippy issue, using an implement as weight on the rear helps with the forward backward plane but not necessarily the roll sideways problem. The weighted wheels are the most helpful, and the separation of the wheels. And it is kind of a pain to have to keep looking over your shoulder to make sure you aren't going to clip something with whatever is hanging off tne 3 pt hitch. The length of my rig is around 20 feet at the moment with the rear blade and a quick hitch.

If you don't have to make any decisions soon, I would recommend hanging out on OTT and see what the pluses and minuses are. I didn't know any of these things, and even after a couple of months of looking I didn't know about the dpf and regeneration issue until I read the owner's manual. Drive some of those bigger tractors and see if you like some of the other shifting mechanisms. I would have been ok with a manual transmission and a clutch, but the hst with auto throttle is nice. The 4060 and 5060 are a little wider than the 3560. Figure out how often you are going to have to haul your tractor on a trailer. If not too often, might be cheaper to have the dealer pick up and deliver when it needs service. The rear hydraulics can be added separately when you need them, there are a bunch of guys on here that know how to do that even if you don't get the kubota kit.

A lot of the choices are personal preference. I liked the 3560 because you can fill the fuel from the ground. But I am a little long in the tooth and have arthritis in my hands. I am glad I got the 3560, it comes with a lot of things that are options on other tractors. It was better for me to put my money into getting a better tractor than into a fancy blade. I like being able to switch in and out of autothrottle depending on what I am doing. It's easy to drive.

Good luck, and keep asking questions

 

[gssixgun]

Round Bale Weight ????


Something I never knew but was interested in finding out

http://www.caes.uga.edu/commodities/fieldcrops/forages/Ga_Cat_Arc/2012/SF1209.pdf


Today was a good day already I learned something new

 

[virginiavenom]

these are about the size of our round bales. this one says it's an L 4600 and it seems to do the job without too much difficulty? knowing this would a L3560 be enough, or should I step up to say an L 4760 for about 400 more lbs of weight and higher lift capacity? ours are typically 4x5. it wouldn't be used for hay all the time, just it's heaviest task. maybe once or twice every month or so. the horses mostly eat all of my pasture anyhow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fH3qg2RJ2Fs