tier 4 warranty void

[Daren Todd]

Contacted a dealer today about some new tier 4 engines i had just got in. Was trying to get a code list, which i think with a little more brow beating and a large filter order i'll probably get. I'm not sure about kubota, but a couple of other brands are voiding engine warranty's if the piece of equipment comes into there shop for warranty work with aftermarket filters on them. So it's something you guys that have newer tractors still under warranty should check into, to avoid a hassel later.

 

[Tooljunkie]

If kubota says non oe filters void the warranty, they have to provide them for free.
Theres some legal mumbo jumbo i read about this a long while back, was in the baldwin filter catalogue.it was a copy of some law.
All aftermarket filters are built to meet or exceed manufacturers specifications.

Just sayin.

It has to be true, i read it in a book, not on the internet.
But again it was 20 some odd years ago when i was in parts.

Further to that fact, hastings would stand behind their products.
Today, dont know if that is still the case.

 

[koja]

OEM all the way. I believe that a manufacturer trust their name in a filter or oil then that's the one I'm using. I have been using motorcraft oil and filters in '05 F150 since new. It now has approximently 174,000 miles. No leaks , no oil burning, runs just like it always has. I know " motor oil is motor oil ,,,," but whoever makes OEM oil is doing a great job.

 

[Daren Todd]

If kubota says non oe filters void the warranty, they have to provide them for free.
Theres some legal mumbo jumbo i read about this a long while back, was in the baldwin filter catalogue.it was a copy of some law.
All aftermarket filters are built to meet or exceed manufacturers specifications.

Just sayin.

Thats actually good to know. I'll have to contact the baldwin guy we've been using and see if i can get a copy, I like to argue. I was actually suprised when the dealer told me that. And it wasn't a kubota dealer. I haven't had any of their tier 4's yet. So far just the two d's and cat

 

[Daren Todd]

OEM all the way. I believe that a manufacturer trust their name in a filter or oil then that's the one I'm using. I have been using motorcraft oil and filters in '05 F150 since new. It now has approximently 174,000 miles. No leaks , no oil burning, runs just like it always has. I know " motor oil is motor oil ,,,," but whoever makes OEM oil is doing a great job.

I got the same truck 04, have to tell the auto parts or any one else that it's the 05 or they get the wrong parts. Has 140,000, no leaks, or oil burning either. Filter is what ever the speedi lube place puts on it. But i've always run synthetic oil. Only issue i've had was the a/c going out. And am gonna have to have the tranny rebuilt. The people who fixed the a/c cracked the filler tube for the tranny and it broke off this past winter. Got the tranny serviced and the tube replaced. But have one hell of a wine in the tranny now.

 

[koja]

I got the same truck 04, have to tell the auto parts or any one else that it's the 05 or they get the wrong parts. Has 140,000, no leaks, or oil burning either. Filter is what ever the speedi lube place puts on it. But i've always run synthetic oil. Only issue i've had was the a/c going out. And am gonna have to have the tranny rebuilt. The people who fixed the a/c cracked the filler tube for the tranny and it broke off this past winter. Got the tranny serviced and the tube replaced. But have one hell of a wine in the tranny now.

Mine had that too . Turns out it was the torque converter. Only whined in reverse or drive. Drove me crazy till I figured out what it was. Oh well , I have all new idler/accessorie bearings now as well as a new torque converter , lol .

 

[Tooljunkie]

I have disagree with Koja's statement that oil is oil.
I have had different experiences with oils.
Quaker state from day one-short trips sludged up an inline six so bad it plugged the oil pickup.

I ran cheap oil in my 88 lebaron 2.2 turbo, rep insisted it was good oil, turns out it burns up when it passes through the turbo lubricating channels.
Took out turbo and piston rings. After rebuilding it, i ran 10 30 synthetic diesel oil and never ate a drop of oil.

The synthetic gear lubes were tearing up the posi rear ends in the 03/04 f150's

Running a good quality oil like motorcraft oil is one of the best things you can do for longevity. 5w20 was made for these new generation engines with smaller clearances. Or lower tolerances.

The cheap oil filters will definetly bite you in the butt. Quality filtersn all the way

 

[Daren Todd]

Mine had that too . Turns out it was the torque converter. Only whined in reverse or drive. Drove me crazy till I figured out what it was. Oh well , I have all new idler/accessorie bearings now as well as a new torque converter , lol .

Have you had any issues with the throttle control? One of the sensors went out on mine at about 40,000. Check engine light came on as i was leaving my neighborhood. Tapped the throttle and it started roasting the tires, blew through an intersection side ways next light i was driving miss daisy taking forever to get to speed. Went to pull in a parking spot, tapped the throttle and it started roasting the tires again. My buddy bout went thru the windsheild on that one cause i was two footing the brake to keep from slamming a parked car. Truck went to the dealer the next morning.

 

[Daren Todd]

I have disagree with Koja's statement that oil is oil.
I have had different experiences with oils.
Quaker state from day one-short trips sludged up an inline six so bad it plugged the oil pickup.

I ran cheap oil in my 88 lebaron 2.2 turbo, rep insisted it was good oil, turns out it burns up when it passes through the turbo lubricating channels.
Took out turbo and piston rings. After rebuilding it, i ran 10 30 synthetic diesel oil and never ate a drop of oil.

The synthetic gear lubes were tearing up the posi rear ends in the 03/04 f150's

Running a good quality oil like motorcraft oil is one of the best things you can do for longevity. 5w20 was made for these new generation engines with smaller clearances. Or lower tolerances.

The cheap oil filters will definetly bite you in the butt. Quality filtersn all the way

I've always run the 5w20 either semi, or full synthetic. We use a semi synthetic 15w40 in the bulk tank at work. We pull samples on the equipment every now and then and have it tested. It's good for 750 hours in the small equipment. 500 on the big diesels. Gets changed every 250 any way. The local speedi lube that does my truck uses wix. Which i've had really good luck with. I stay away from frams. And use baldwins at work

 

[hodge]

And this, boys and girls, is a good example of chasing a rabbit!

 

[D2Cat]

Well teach, since the original poster has been involved in the entire thread why is this a problem for the "boys and girls"?

 

[dmanlyr]

All aftermarket filters are built to meet or exceed manufacturers specifications.

I wish this was the case, but it is not. The perfect example is some of the current HST filters, the oem has a magnet, so far NONE of the aftermarket filters have a magnet. That means they DO NOT meet or exceed oem filters.

No law states that a manufacture has to provide free filters if the aftermarket filters DO NOT meet oem specifications. If the aftermarket filters do meet ALL oem specifications, then that is true, they are the same as Kubota branded filters, and would have no effect on warrantee.

So regardless of what filter manufactures state, as they do time and time again, until one of there aftermarket filters meets Kubota's specs for a HST filter, then they just are NOT a acceptable substitute and Kubota would be well within there rights to deny any warrantee claim arising from using such a sub standard filter.

Other filters in aftermarket versions are fine. Just have to take each case on a case by case basis, there is no blanket statement that all aftermarket filters meet or exceed....

Just food for thought

David

 

[85Hokie]

Well teach, since the original poster has been involved in the entire thread why is this a problem for the "boys and girls"?

I am going to speak for Hodge (and he can correct me if I am off base!), the chasing the rabbit is referring to the "oil is oil" thought......

and the OIL was NOT part of the original question, the FILTER was, which I agree with 100% - FILTERS aint FILTERS....

and on the subject of OIL - OIL aint oil........oil for a diesel is a wee bit different than oil for a gasoline engine.

synthetic is a wee bit different that oil fashion oil.....

and the weight of the oil DOES matter too.....until it gets to about 212 degrees.......

and this oil thing.....is chasing the rabbit, cause we aint never gonna catch it!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[D2Cat]

Here's where I'm coming from. The subject was filters and every post with the exception of #6 and #8 made some mention of filters. Only post #9 specifically did not mention filters.

Then post #10 was a condescending comment to "boys and girls" about chasing a rabbit and mentioned nothing about filters, or oil for that matter.

So how is a reader suppose to know what "chasing a rabbit" comment refers to?

General Douglas Mac Aurthur said, "Don't ever issue a communique that can be understood. Always issue a communique that can not be misunderstood.

 

[85Hokie]

Here's where I'm coming from. The subject was filters and every post with the exception of #6 and #8 made some mention of filters. Only post #9 specifically did not mention filters.

Then post #10 was a condescending comment to "boys and girls" about chasing a rabbit and mentioned nothing about filters, or oil for that matter.

So how is a reader suppose to know what "chasing a rabbit" comment refers to?

General Douglas Mac Aurthur said, "Don't ever issue a communique that can be understood. Always issue a communique that can not be misunderstood.

I like that quote.....might have to borrow that one. - He was a sharp dude too.

 

[Daren Todd]

We don't need to argue over it i would assume hodge just meant i opened the proverbial can of worms with the oil and filters and hey, now i have an idea as far as whats wrong with my truck too Or he could have been refering to some of us diverting off topic no worrys, some of us have shorter attention spans and get distracted easy. And i wasn't even asking a question on post #1 Just letting folks know what i've run into with the new tier 4's with my dealers on the warranty's. Wasn't sure if kubota had the same policy, but it's something folks should look into before they accidentally void their warranties

 

[85Hokie]

We don't need to argue over it i would assume hodge just meant i opened the proverbial can of worms with the oil and filters and hey, now i have an idea as far as whats wrong with my truck too Or he could have been refering to some of us diverting off topic no worrys, some of us have shorter attention spans and get distracted easy. And i wasn't even asking a question on post #1 Just letting folks know what i've run into with the new tier 4's with my dealers on the warranty's. Wasn't sure if kubota had the same policy, but it's something folks should look into before they accidentally void their warranties

I think I would rather buy an older tractor than a tier four........and good advice on the warranty thing, seems like a dealer is "looking for ways to screw you" ...and I hope that is not true either.

When I bought my tractor, my dealer said that I could cut holes in the bucket and weld and whatnot....said that HE was the one that would decide if the a warranty was a issue, he was saying that if I didnt break it - he would fix it!

 

[Daren Todd]

I think I would rather buy an older tractor than a tier four........and good advice on the warranty thing, seems like a dealer is "looking for ways to screw you" ...and I hope that is not true either.

When I bought my tractor, my dealer said that I could cut holes in the bucket and weld and whatnot....said that HE was the one that would decide if the a warranty was a issue, he was saying that if I didnt break it - he would fix it!

Thats a good dealer I've been dealing with the green tier 4 for a few years. All the new sensors, having to get certified for the ecm's. Forget trouble shooting. Everythings a code. The other "D" just came out with the tier 4, and looking at it, and not paying attention, i thought it was a green motor from another builder. First time ever, seeing one liquid cooled. Gonna have to learn another ecm package, fight like hell to get a code list till we can get software certified and licensed. Will probably be another week of classes some where and and a whole new set of sensor quirks and failures till the rush on the engine builds dies down and the parts vendors sorted. I'm sure i'll start getting some kubotas in within the next 6 months. Then i get to start all over I'll take my 40 year old, simple, mechanical, gravity fed setup on my tractor any day of the week

 

[skeets]

Magnus-Moss
HD try's to do the same thing and have told customers they cant do this or that because it will void the warranty,, that's BS,, Read this there is a lot of inform that as a customer we should know abut the law

http://consumer-law.lawyers.com/warranty-law/consumer-law-warranty-faq.html

 

[Tooljunkie]

It was my job to know the products i was selling, as i mentioned, was twenty years ago. If these laws are still in effect, then i am in fact correct.

But, twenty years and a lot has changed, mainly the cheap garbage on the market, claimed to be as good as O.E.M
We all know you get what you pay for. Or less, mostly less.