I second this. Doing this sure helped this guy move from zero a bit in a positive direction…highly recommended.
Fixing hole in side of block
- Thread starter joesmith123
- Start date
Joe, you are missing the boat on this one. The teacher in an adult learning class at the community college, which goes on in the evenings, or on the weekends, are not there for the money really. They are there because they want to help people learn.
Don’t write this opportunity off too quickly. If you try it, you may find out that you’re mistaken in your opinion.
I took a welding class at my community college 52 years ago and still use what I learned during it. Having answers , pointers from a professional watching me , and proper equipment taught me the basics that gave me strong welds in a couple weeks. Not real pretty but proper penetration. Definitely the best way to get started.
More like brazing only a small few will ever get it right. By the time he gets done ? He could have just bought a good block or motor. It’s painful to see someone fail badly trying to prove knowledgeable welders wrong.Brazing is just like having sex. Once you have the torch in your hand it will come back to you. Just like sex, you won't be good at it the first time, it just takes a lot of practice. When you get old, brazing is just like sex, you have the desire, but sometimes it is just too much work, so you don't bother. YMMV
Pretty sad …
I mightve achieved the goal...
Heated cast iron, picture of thermometer is of the flux coated bronze being used
Notice how blue I got the cast iron in the BBQ grill
Last picture: melted bronze into the groove of the cast iron
Exactly what I did different: flame about 4 times stronger (whoever said that you are smart)
Left hand holding bronze was pushing down on area where we wanted it, soon as it melted, pull out and move to the next area to do another mini puddle
Now: in the oven on low heat, let it cool down and I post for yall hammer test in 15-30 minutes...
Sledgehammer will be used: for fun, while we wait for it to cool, say whether you think it will hold or not hold
Heated cast iron, picture of thermometer is of the flux coated bronze being used
Notice how blue I got the cast iron in the BBQ grill
Last picture: melted bronze into the groove of the cast iron
Exactly what I did different: flame about 4 times stronger (whoever said that you are smart)
Left hand holding bronze was pushing down on area where we wanted it, soon as it melted, pull out and move to the next area to do another mini puddle
Now: in the oven on low heat, let it cool down and I post for yall hammer test in 15-30 minutes...
Sledgehammer will be used: for fun, while we wait for it to cool, say whether you think it will hold or not hold
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My gosh, he has mastered brazing. I'll bet for him this feat is better than sex!
GreensvilleJay
Well-known member
Equipment
BX23-S,57 A-C D-14,58 A-C D-14, 57 A-C D-14,tiller,cults,Millcreek 25G spreader,
Good, now go buy JBWeld epoxy and fix the block cause there is no way you'll be able to braze the patch in and NOT destroy the block. Given the equipment you have and your level of practical knowledge, you will not succeed. Not trying to be mean or cruel, just a 'reality check'.
You need a LOT of serious heat ,in a CONTROLLED environment to braze the block.
You need a LOT of serious heat ,in a CONTROLLED environment to braze the block.
fried1765
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Kubota L48 TLB, Ford 1920 FEL, Ford 8N, SCAG Liberty Z, Gravely Pro.
NCL4701
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L4701, T2290, WC68, grapple, BB1572, Farmi W50R, Howes 500, 16kW IMD gen, WG24
Not sure this is worth posting, but…
Somewhat before I was born, I think mid-1960’s, my father bought this Ford that had a long crack and chunk missing from the left side of the block. He rebuilt the engine and glued a piece of steel in the hole with some sort of two part epoxy. In the late 1970’s it started to weep coolant. I was tasked with removing the coolant, wire brushing as needed, and prepping to re-coat with JB Weld. The point was to make it functional and if it looked good or looked like crap was irrelevant.
If you zoom in on the below pic, you can see the left side of the block under the filter bowl looks kind of melted. That’s a large quantity of epoxy. The hole was big and the crack was bigger so it took a lot of epoxy. Doesn’t look good, but as of November 2022 when we gave it to a fellow who had a use for it, it hadn’t leaked again and it ran just fine.
First attempt at repair with epoxy lasted about 15 years +/-. Follow up with JB Weld lasted about 45 years +/- and still counting so far as I know.
No telling how many hours my father put on that thing with the epoxy repaired block. I’m confident I put well over 1000 hours on it myself, many of them would be considered abuse by many here as it was used as a skidder quite a bit. Yes, we got rid of it. Didn’t think I would ever part with it but after my father passed I couldn’t stand looking at it every time I went to the shed. Why isn’t relevant. Next to last time I drove it was on this trailer under its own power. Last time I drove it was off the trailer at its new home. It was running as good as ever and not leaking.
Point being, those who suggest epoxying a patch aren’t suggesting some half-a$$ repair that won’t last. Just something to consider. If it doesn’t work you’re out the cost of some JB Weld so it’s pretty low risk.
Braze it. Weld it. Do whatever you want. Hope it works out for you whatever you do.
Edit: BTW, for anyone actually looking at the photos, I’m aware the hood says Ferguson. It’s off a 35 (I think). Expertly fitted with a sledge hammer. It’s a junkyard hodge podge of a machine. Mostly a 9N, though.
Somewhat before I was born, I think mid-1960’s, my father bought this Ford that had a long crack and chunk missing from the left side of the block. He rebuilt the engine and glued a piece of steel in the hole with some sort of two part epoxy. In the late 1970’s it started to weep coolant. I was tasked with removing the coolant, wire brushing as needed, and prepping to re-coat with JB Weld. The point was to make it functional and if it looked good or looked like crap was irrelevant.
If you zoom in on the below pic, you can see the left side of the block under the filter bowl looks kind of melted. That’s a large quantity of epoxy. The hole was big and the crack was bigger so it took a lot of epoxy. Doesn’t look good, but as of November 2022 when we gave it to a fellow who had a use for it, it hadn’t leaked again and it ran just fine.
First attempt at repair with epoxy lasted about 15 years +/-. Follow up with JB Weld lasted about 45 years +/- and still counting so far as I know.
No telling how many hours my father put on that thing with the epoxy repaired block. I’m confident I put well over 1000 hours on it myself, many of them would be considered abuse by many here as it was used as a skidder quite a bit. Yes, we got rid of it. Didn’t think I would ever part with it but after my father passed I couldn’t stand looking at it every time I went to the shed. Why isn’t relevant. Next to last time I drove it was on this trailer under its own power. Last time I drove it was off the trailer at its new home. It was running as good as ever and not leaking.
Point being, those who suggest epoxying a patch aren’t suggesting some half-a$$ repair that won’t last. Just something to consider. If it doesn’t work you’re out the cost of some JB Weld so it’s pretty low risk.
Braze it. Weld it. Do whatever you want. Hope it works out for you whatever you do.
Edit: BTW, for anyone actually looking at the photos, I’m aware the hood says Ferguson. It’s off a 35 (I think). Expertly fitted with a sledge hammer. It’s a junkyard hodge podge of a machine. Mostly a 9N, though.
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I can't upload the weld test video, my internet weak, I'll upload tomorrow
Almost got a patch ready for engine block
Hit engine hole with abrasives including files of different shapes
Put a light in engine block, piece of paper on top, traced it
Cut it out, put it on broken loader, traced it, cut out the square
Put square on vice then hit it with cutting wheel and grinding wheel getting closer to desired shape
Put flat patch along engine block, labeled top and bottom and a line for where it bends
Took patch to vice, put rod above it, hit rod with sledgehammer, bending patch along the line yall see
Got it close to shape of block, then sitting next to block and grinding wheel, putting patch on block and seeing where to grind it
Sit down, patiently grinding away, grind bottom of patch and block tapered so they fit snug
Almost got a patch ready for engine block
Hit engine hole with abrasives including files of different shapes
Put a light in engine block, piece of paper on top, traced it
Cut it out, put it on broken loader, traced it, cut out the square
Put square on vice then hit it with cutting wheel and grinding wheel getting closer to desired shape
Put flat patch along engine block, labeled top and bottom and a line for where it bends
Took patch to vice, put rod above it, hit rod with sledgehammer, bending patch along the line yall see
Got it close to shape of block, then sitting next to block and grinding wheel, putting patch on block and seeing where to grind it
Sit down, patiently grinding away, grind bottom of patch and block tapered so they fit snug
I'm rooting for you Joe!
That fitting job of the patch looks great. Better then some of the trained fitters I've seen.
At this point or after grinding the bevel I'd take it to someone that knows how to braze and let them do the dirty work...
...or you've been fooling us all along and playing a huge joke and have actually figured it out over the past 50 years like everyone else is suggesting.
Or another option is grind the patch 1/4" to 1/2" smaller all around and epoxy 'sandwich' it in if you can access the backside to smooth it in.
That fitting job of the patch looks great. Better then some of the trained fitters I've seen.
At this point or after grinding the bevel I'd take it to someone that knows how to braze and let them do the dirty work...
...or you've been fooling us all along and playing a huge joke and have actually figured it out over the past 50 years like everyone else is suggesting.
Or another option is grind the patch 1/4" to 1/2" smaller all around and epoxy 'sandwich' it in if you can access the backside to smooth it in.
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That's a fine looking patch! Make sure you don't have any slots or sharp corners like you did on the skillet. As you've learned, that's where cracks originate, whether you braze or epoxy.
Runs With Scissors
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Equipment
L2501 TLB , Grappel, Brush Hog, Box Blade, Ballast box, Forks, Tiller, PH digger
+1
I know I am beating a dead horse here, but when I bought my TIG welder I spent maybe a month or so trying to figure it out. Lots of bad beads, swearing, and frustration.
I signed up for a TIG welding class; After the third class, I was laying down some nice'ish beads and it only got better from there.
Having someone to point out your mistakes "in real time" is invaluable.
One difference between me, (and my buddy who took it with me) and the rest of the class was that we wanted to be there and were willing to learn. I couldn't have given a damn about the grade, or the "credits", and the instructor took notice of that very quickly.
The others in the class were forced to be there for work, or just taking it to "get the credit" and their lack of interest was apparent.
We were the "nerds' sitting at the front of the class with sharp pencils and asking questions, and we both became "much much better".
It was a very positive experience for me and my buddy.
There is such a thing as "bad students"
Just sayin....
GreensvilleJay
Well-known member
Equipment
BX23-S,57 A-C D-14,58 A-C D-14, 57 A-C D-14,tiller,cults,Millcreek 25G spreader,
I was never able to dance so when my daughter became engaged to be married I wanted to learn in preparation for father-daughter dance at wedding. I began teaching myself by dancing (or called it dancing) with the broom,a mop,my dog and a dining chair. I kept stepping on my own toes and my dog began running away the minute I turned music on. In desperation I signed up with a dance teacher and accomplished more the first lesson than I had over previous weeks. I'm still clumsy but I made my daughter proud.+1
I know I am beating a dead horse here, but when I bought my TIG welder I spent maybe a month or so trying to figure it out. Lots of bad beads, swearing, and frustration.
I signed up for a TIG welding class; After the third class, I was laying down some nice'ish beads and it only got better from there.
Having someone to point out your mistakes "in real time" is invaluable.
There is such a thing as "bad students"
Just sayin....
There was zero chance that I was going get that weld without completely shattering the entire skillet, including the area where cast iron was not cracked, bottom of the skillet
Where is this suggestion that others are making that I have lots of experience welding?or you've been fooling us all along and playing a huge joke and have actually figured it out over the past 50 years like everyone else is suggesting.
Please elaborate on exactly what you mean, with full sentences and zero assumptions
Anyone else find this statement interesting? There is big meaning behind this statement, with tons of assumptions
Implicitly he/she is saying way more than what is actually articulated
That sandwich your talking about is what is happening - As I taper the bottom of the patch and the block, they are slowing becoming more flush with each other
Moving forward: Hit the block and the patch with grinding wheel accommodating the shape of the patch into the shape of the hole in the engine
Spent 4 or 5 hours last night sitting next to the block: put the patch on the hole, used a light to see where there wasnt a gap, that is a high spot, mark it with sharpie, hit it with the grinder exactly where you want it to drop, I did this task until I couldn't see straight from fatigue
the goal: carve into the patch in this custom and tedious fashion, sinking the patch into the block to give it a more flush look and better seat for better reliability and stronger hold
I do have some cheap Walmart epoxy, or I might invest in 3M high quality epoxy,
Regardless, I cannot invest more in this project until I have more money
Patch almost flush with block
Bucket of bx1500
While waiting on financing the rest of engine build, it would be nice to build up this bucket with solid steel and maybe give it teeth to cut the earth
10 foot I beam: use this to make robust loader
Square tubing 1 inch, I do also have 2 inch square tubing
Goal: finangle a bucket back together with teeth and real strength using the I beam and other metal shown
Goal: make it sharp and durable loader using scrap metal
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You may as well offer a decathlon athlete on his morning workout a ride. Golfers don't hit balls because they are mad at them and Joe isn't hitting this motor because it's the most practical option.