When the wind decides to turn a barn into a chicken coop!

[mcmxi]

What ever size you go with on the replacement, it’ll be too small! Sweet mixer!

True, but I can always build another structure which is basically what I'm doing. It's a 16'x 24' steel framed and steel sided shed for firewood and one tractor. I have the pipe, a bunch of siding and a new 10'x10' steel roll up door.

 

[mcmxi]

Well $hit! I have a story for those of you into Schadenfreude! If it sounds too good to be true it probably is, and the devil is in the details.

I had asked the seller of the steel building to send me a copy of the drawings (text me an image or two) that came with the building. He said he would but he didn't, but when he showed up today I asked to see the drawings. Guess what the ground snow load rating of the building is? It's shown on the drawing as 20 PSF. Guess what the ground snow loading at my house is? It's 58.13 PSF!

So it turns out that the building was designed for Salmon, ID in a location where the ground snow load is 15 PSF. Had the owner sent me the drawing as requested I could have saved him the trouble of a 4-1/2 hour drive. Now I'm left with the problem of compensating him fairly for his time and effort. He claims that he had no idea about the design specs. Decisions, decisions.

I'm fed up with this steel building debacle. I'm going back to my original plan of making my own trusses.

 

[rc51stierhoff]

Well $hit! I have a story for those of you into Schadenfreude! If it sounds too good to be true it probably is, and the devil is in the details.

I had asked the seller of the steel building to send me a copy of the drawings (text me an image or two) that came with the building. He said he would but he didn't, but when he showed up today I asked to see the drawings. Guess what the ground snow load rating of the building is? It's shown on the drawing as 20 PSF. Guess what the ground snow loading at my house is? It's 58.13 PSF!

So it turns out that the building was designed for Salmon, ID in a location where the ground snow load is 15 PSF. Had the owner sent me the drawing as requested I could have saved him the trouble of a 4-1/2 hour drive. Now I'm left with the problem of compensating him fairly for his time and effort. He claims that he had no idea about the design specs. Decisions, decisions.

I'm fed up with this steel building debacle. I'm going back to my original plan of making my own trusses.

Great reference. I believe only the Germans have a word for it.

Only a few months to hunting season…better get started.

 

[mcmxi]

Great reference. I believe only the Germans have a word for it.

Only a few months to hunting season…better get started.

Yeah, it all went down hill rapidly this afternoon when I told him that I'd give him $250 for his trouble. Our text exchange ended with him telling me "You can rest assured you will see me again" to which I replied "ok then".

I suggested that he inform potential buyers that he's selling a building rated at 20 PSF in a state that has values in the 100+ PSF range, and that he might be civilly and criminally liable if the building collapsed, injuring or worse yet killing someone.

 

[rc51stierhoff]

Better you find out sooner than later if it’s not going to work out. As I understood you previous post there was a request for the drawing / spec…if you covered his fuel I think that was reasonable.

When I built my little equipment building, I originally wanted to use an Amish builder…there is a community near my other place. Anyway the do great work and they do work and charge a fair price. However for the ones I found, the buyer (me) has to spec everything, and I mean everything. They provide outstanding labor however take no ownership of a spec failure, which is everything. Then to top it off I live 4 hrs away and then do not use phones. All messages have to be passed thru their runner, including follow up questions. That was the deal breaker for me being 4 hours away. I think they would have built me a barn with some features that I would like (I wanted a Dutch style with open attic truss for a second floor of space)…they haven’t called me back either . Morton was rigid in their engineered spec but they fully guarantee it (they offered an attic truss but was very limited space for what their calculations would allow safely) It was worth for my piece of mind. However Morton would not build me the truss I thought I wanted, but they give a guarantee for a reason…it’s engineered and my place is in snow belt, so I trusted their design/warranty. Dollars and cents I am not sure who was really cheaper because I could not spec / buy the same materials that Morton uses…they have their own stuff and it’s gorgeous material…especially the yellow pine lumber…our lumber yards around here having nothing that nice….absolutely beautiful lumber. They did great and would use them again if I were using a builder. Hope you get yours up before the season starts and or weather turns. Good luck.

 

[mcmxi]

Better you find out sooner than later if it’s not going to work out. As I understood you previous post there was a request for the drawing / spec…if you covered his fuel I think that was reasonable.

When I built my little equipment building, I originally wanted to use an Amish builder…there is a community near my other place. Anyway the do great work and they do work and charge a fair price. However for the ones I found, the buyer (me) has to spec everything, and I mean everything. They provide outstanding labor however take no ownership of a spec failure, which is everything. Then to top it off I live 4 hrs away and then do not use phones. All messages have to be passed thru their runner, including follow up questions. That was the deal breaker for me being 4 hours away. I think they would have built me a barn with some features that I would like (I wanted a Dutch style with open attic truss for a second floor of space)…they haven’t called me back either . Morton was rigid in their engineered spec but they fully guarantee it (they offered an attic truss but was very limited space for what their calculations would allow safely) It was worth for my piece of mind. However Morton would not build me the truss I thought I wanted, but they give a guarantee for a reason…it’s engineered and my place is in snow belt, so I trusted their design/warranty. Dollars and cents I am not sure who was really cheaper because I could not spec / buy the same materials that Morton uses…they have their own stuff and it’s gorgeous material…especially the yellow pine lumber…our lumber yards around here having nothing that nice….absolutely beautiful lumber. They did great and would use them again if I were using a builder. Hope you get yours up before the season starts and or weather turns. Good luck.

That's a very nice building.

Yes, I asked the seller to send me an image of the drawing showing the specs and he said he would but didn't. He was very keen to get up here and unload it so maybe he's had a hard time selling it given the 20 PSF rating. He claimed that he didn't know about it but it's possible that he didn't text an image over because he knew it would be a deal breaker. Perhaps he was hoping that I would hand over $17,750 and only figure out the problem after he was long gone. Maybe that's why he's so pissed off.

I took a photo of the engineering specs and a screenshot of the snow load rating for Salmon, ID. The building is fine for Salmon, ID as indicated by the pointer, but clearly not safe for my location with a ground snow load of 58.13. If you go a couple of miles outside of Salmon you can see areas where the ground snow load is in excess of 100 PSF. This is why it's critical to know what the loading is where the building is being erected, and why companies like Future Buildings don't have fixed prices on their website. They use different steel gauges for the various parts to account for loading and that's reflected in the price.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Yikes, My ground snow load is 120.64psf and 90mph winds!

 

[WDF]

Yeah, it all went down hill rapidly this afternoon when I told him that I'd give him $250 for his trouble. Our text exchange ended with him telling me "You can rest assured you will see me again" to which I replied "ok then".

I suggested that he inform potential buyers that he's selling a building rated at 20 PSF in a state that has values in the 100+ PSF range, and that he might be civilly and criminally liable if the building collapsed, injuring or worse yet killing someone.

So what, he's driving back another 5 hours, to whip your ass?
For some reason not sure that would go well for him, better keep Ruger around just in case.

That's an obvious omission of details (snow loading) - intentional or not, it's unfortunate for both parties resulting in wasted time, fuel, and effort.

 

[mcmxi]

So what, he's driving back another 5 hours, to whip your ass?
For some reason not sure that would go well for him, better keep Ruger around just in case.

That's an obvious omission of details (snow loading) - intentional or not, it's unfortunate for both parties resulting in wasted time, fuel, and effort.

It's unfortunate because I thought I'd found a good solution at a great price. As it is he now gets nothing for his trouble.

I've been talking with Future Buildings and if I could get a slab put down I might still order something from them if it makes sense financially i.e. compared to a custom DIY build.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

So what, he's driving back another 5 hours, to whip your ass?
For some reason not sure that would go well for him, better keep Ruger around just in case.

That's an obvious omission of details (snow loading) - intentional or not, it's unfortunate for both parties resulting in wasted time, fuel, and effort.

I'm leaning towards the intentional, most anyone knows the difference in snow conditions between Salmon Idaho, and anything to the north, be it Idaho or Montana!
We have no building codes in Northern Idaho, You can build your home out of popsicle sticks if you want no one will stop you.
So people are always building substandard buildings.
I lean the other way, my house is designed and built to withstand just about anything mother nature or earth could throw at it.
We got hammered pretty good this last winter, lost of wet heavy snow.
I have seen so many new transplants that have no idea the force that snow and wind play.
And they didn't do any research on it before hand.
I've seen quite a few Enclosed trailers, Sheds, Buildings, and Motor homes that just this winter crushed like a bug.

 

[mcmxi]

I'm leaning towards the intentional, most anyone knows the difference in snow conditions between Salmon Idaho, and anything to the north, be it Idaho or Montana!
We have no building codes in Northern Idaho, You can build your home out of popsicle sticks if you want no one will stop you.
So people are always building substandard buildings.
I lean the other way, my house is designed and built to withstand just about anything mother nature or earth could throw at it.
We got hammered pretty good this last winter, lost of wet heavy snow.
I have seen so many new transplants that have no idea the force that snow and wind play.
And they didn't do any research on it before hand.
I've seen quite a few Enclosed trailers, Sheds, Buildings, and Motor homes that just this winter crushed like a bug.

I had called and left a message with a local roll up/overhead door company a couple of days ago for a quote on a 12'x10' door. He called back this morning and I apologized for wasting his time. I relayed my recent experience with this Craigslist purchase and he remembered a winter snow storm up here around 1990 that resulted in the roofs of many homes, barns and shops collapsing due to not being designed/built properly to withstand the ground snow load values for this area. Those values aren't necessarily typical values but the greatest snow load that can reasonably be expected. Here's one such database if anyone is interested.

https://design.medeek.com/resources/snow/groundsnowloads.html

There are no building codes where I am, or at least only for septic, so people are able to do what they want. That can be a good thing or a bad thing. I could have bought and assembled that steel building with the hope that the snow load never exceeded the factor of safety designed into the structure, and I could have woken up one morning to find two tractors destroyed, or I could be in the structure and never wake up again. Just not worth the risk.