Tree work and pulling advice - rope or chain recommendations?

[NCL4701]

Really appreciate any other experiences as this is great info that is not discussed often!

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One thing that comes to mind looking at those split trunks: If dealing with a heavy leaner, lightning struck, or hollow where a split like that is anticipated as a potential problem, consider wrapping the trunk with a stout chain and tightening with a load binder to prevent trunk splitting. Have done that several times with 3/8” grade 70 chains and appropriately matched load binder.

 

[minthral]

I'm kinda in the same boat. I want to transport pine logs from recently dead pine trees (up to 24 inch wide, 17 foot long). Some of the trees are right off the existing trails I have, but some are deeper off trails where I couldn't reasonable take the tractor to.

I got a grapple and foolishly thought that was going to cut it. Trying to move (or get to) large logs with a grapple on narrow(er) and sloping bumpy trails (or no trails) gets sketchy quick. Certainly is a good way to flip your tractor or get you killed.

In short, after consideration, the best way to do it is with a log skidder/winch. Park the tractor on trail or reasonable spot, loosen 3/8+ steel cable, place it around log with choke chain in a straight shot from tractor, or use other trees to bend line, and then reel it in. Depending on the situation, you can just drag the log (~1/2 the weight is supported by tractor skidplate and rest is on ground). You can also drop it, move the tractor in position, and then pull up or down the log as the tractor is anchored in the ground.

For trees that fall on to each other and get forked/stuck, I've had good success using chain to pull in a strategic spot so they continue to fall, otherwise I cut the tree they hung on (often is doomed with damage from the impact anyway). This gets kinda sketchy as the tree might go falling down where you don't want it, including toward your tractor or pulling it...so I typically avoid the situation and let nature/time fix it...a good ice or thunder storm often takes care of the problem. It's been very rare that I had a problem felling a tree as as long as you notch correctly and using a wedge/hammer, it almost always goes where you want...if it doesn't and you did everything right, maybe its best to avoid that tree (and nature will finish it off).

 

[bbxlr8]

Thanks for the info and a winch is a great addition in those instances. Here I decided to use power (tractor) after conventional methods proved dangerous, be out of the fall zone (needed long line).

Additional info: I left this one for a few months with up to 50+ mph winds and seriously hoping mother nature would do the job. Not a chance, as it turned out to only be slightly rotten low in the outer ring section. The rest of the tree was solid and firmly intertwined up top. It is next to a campsite and wanted to save the other tree and I am trying to preserve the diversity and like the cherries

Hindsite & lessons learned:

1. I should have bound it after Plan A where I got it pulled straight back up & unstuck with the rope puller, then tied it off and gone to conventional methods with the saw & felling. I guess I had the tractor and wanted to "use it"
2. I have to upgrade my line "arsenal" and get a snatch block for direction at least... Thus the post/survey here.

FYI: There is a lot of info on skidding logs with tractors out there (OTT archives & check out arboristsite.com forums) with various levels and ways to do it. 3 point/chain, skidding shield, all the way to homemade or purchased log arches.

 

[Captain13]

On your snatch blocks, I have the Tractor supply ones with a 17,000 lb rating. The only thing I don’t like about them is that the line has to be threaded through the sheave. Thats a pain if you are already set up but need to redirect a line for some reason. I wannt to get a couple of blocks where the side plates swing open. Also, consider getting a snatch block with a becket on the bottom in case you need to connect a second block or pulley to it.

 

[OntheRidge]

A great source of ropes/rigging, etc.

Sherrilltree | Arborist Supplies & Tree Climbing Gear | Lower Promo

Sherrilltree | Arborist Supplies & Tree Climbing Gear | Lower Promo

sherrilltree.com

 

[Captain13]

Sherrill Tree is a good source. I use a place in Jacksonville, FL. Walk in and they have everything Stihl and Husky plus any arborist gear you might need. Plus, they will advise and help configure mechanical advantage systems. Shaw is also a big tree service company that does tree clearing so they use what they sell and their prices are good. I just felled a oak from my brother in law that had a 9’ lean away from where it needed to go. I had the gear but need some tips on stabilizing the tree and getting it to “pull over” and these guys made some good suggestions on redirects and dropping techniques. It worked out great.

 

[MapleLeafFarmer]

I wouldn't recommend synthetic as it breaks easily if knicked. Its sensitive and IMHO ok for occasional use for guys that have lots of money.

For a L47 I would go cable (3/8 or larger depending on grade). It is what comes std. on most logging winches, hydro or electric recovery winches etc... Commercial loggers and tow truck drivers use cable for many reasons. 3/8 should suffice or larger if you prefer.

A couple hundred feet of 3/8" 7-19 galvanized cable going to cost you less than a couple of hundred dollars plus ends, last a lifetime, weigh less than 50 pounds, and have breaking strength near 15,000 pounds, etc...

 

[bbxlr8]

I wouldn't recommend synthetic as it breaks easily if knicked. Its sensitive and IMHO ok for occasional use for guys that have lots of money.

For a L47 I would go cable (3/8 or larger depending on grade). It is what comes std. on most logging winches, hydro or electric recovery winches etc... Commercial loggers and tow truck drivers use cable for many reasons. 3/8 should suffice or larger if you prefer.

A couple hundred feet of 3/8" 7-19 galvanized cable going to cost you less than a couple of hundred dollars plus ends, last a lifetime, weigh less than 50 pounds, and have breaking strength near 15,000 pounds, etc...

Thanks - I did not know that about synthetic and prefer things that can take the abuse (or occasion misuse in my case ) Budget is a factor, but value more so than total cost.

 

[NCL4701]

I wouldn't recommend synthetic as it breaks easily if knicked. Its sensitive and IMHO ok for occasional use for guys that have lots of money.

For a L47 I would go cable (3/8 or larger depending on grade). It is what comes std. on most logging winches, hydro or electric recovery winches etc... Commercial loggers and tow truck drivers use cable for many reasons. 3/8 should suffice or larger if you prefer.

A couple hundred feet of 3/8" 7-19 galvanized cable going to cost you less than a couple of hundred dollars plus ends, last a lifetime, weigh less than 50 pounds, and have breaking strength near 15,000 pounds, etc...

Agree. If I was routinely using it, I would have a skidding winch with wire rope. Wire rope is much more durable than synthetic.

 

[rc51stierhoff]

Agree. If I was routinely using it, I would have a skidding winch with wire rope. Wire rope is much more durable than synthetic.

Synthetic is susceptible to dry rot as well as UV light. If you have it keep in a black bag. It’s similar to climbing rope in that it should be switched out after aged (has a short shelf life - hard to tell by looking at it) or damage. Steel is superior over long term (general durability) IMO, however weight and potential to sling shot if snapped are a trade off IMO.

 

[rc51stierhoff]

What is everyone’s thoughts on hydraulic logging winch vs PTO?

 

[Captain13]

My opinion is the PTO driven winch would be a little harder to finesse. Hydraulic or electric gives a little more ”fine” control, as in tensioning a line. Depending on your safety switches, you would have to be on and off the tractor more just to operate the winch. For ease of operation and installation, I would like a good electric winch, but unless there is a rear mounting option, it would be on the front which would be hard for skidding.

 

[pjoh784350]

E-rigging.com https://www.e-rigging.com/ has good prices and the whole package of supplies.

 

[rc51stierhoff]

My opinion is the PTO driven winch would be a little harder to finesse. Hydraulic or electric gives a little more ”fine” control, as in tensioning a line. Depending on your safety switches, you would have to be on and off the tractor more just to operate the winch. For ease of operation and installation, I would like a good electric winch, but unless there is a rear mounting option, it would be on the front which would be hard for skidding.

I sort of agree. I wonder with an electric winch how much it would drain the battery for the tractor if doing multiple trees…or would you opt for a second dedicated battery. On my vehicle I only ever had to do not more than two winches back to back so it’s never been an issue. I am not sure how quickly the ac generator on the tractor charge recovers the battery though.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

Use a dedicated 2nd (optional 3rd) battery WITH charging from the alternator.
If you only have the tractor battery and something goes wrong(winch meltdown...kills battery) , tractor may stop running..and it's always a long,long walk to get a new battery....
Winches do take a LOT of amps when pulling heavy loads, so a 2nd battery helps with reliability .Space usually isn't a problem, just get two identical batteries(same mfr/make/model) !

 

[rc51stierhoff]

Use a dedicated 2nd (optional 3rd) battery WITH charging from the alternator.
If you only have the tractor battery and something goes wrong(winch meltdown...kills battery) , tractor may stop running..and it's always a long,long walk to get a new battery....
Winches do take a LOT of amps when pulling heavy loads, so a 2nd battery helps with reliability .Space usually isn't a problem, just get two identical batteries(same mfr/make/model) !

I agree. I made this set up for my MX off the base part for a back blade….it’s modular so I can use for a variety of functions. I plan to skid logs (as well as other home made items that fit in the 2inch hitch tree) with it however I have not yet used with the electric winch. I have not decided on the batter but I suspect I will add a platform for spare battery.

 

[BruceP]

I used to help a buddy pull deadwood out of the woods. (firewood for boiling Maple sap)

I can tell you that using a bulldozer with winch takes finesse. .... If pulled around a corner too sharp, a 2 foot diameter oak can be snapped like a toothpick.

 

[RalphVa]

Whatever you use, prepare for if it breaks. Dad was pulling our car once with our tractor using a chain. The chain broke and wrapped back across the hood of the car, fortunately just shy of the windshield. Left a nice imprint on the hood of the car.

On the tractor, you need some protection behind the seat should a chain break, if pulling from the rear.

For logs and such, I'd be inclined to use a boom pole to get the chain or whatever out away from the tractor.

 

[SDT]

Hi all - Think this is the right section for this... I need recommendations for pulling with the Kubota.

I do a lot of tree work on my own property only and do everything except climb. I have the gamut of saws, rope puller, come-along and PPE. Have experience in taking down some pretty big trees, hung ones, against the lean, 20 blown down & tangled after Sandy etc.

I had an unusual situation with a problem tree yesterday & got it on the ground safely, but not without some issues. Midway, I decided to use the L2501 (why not right...?) and promptly busted the rope. I have previously used my small tractor, mostly my jeep and occasionally my big truck without breaking this same size line (have several sections).

FWIW The rope is rigging line- 3 strand & rated to 5,700 lbs, so light duty in the grand scheme of things. And I threaded it under the BH and attached it to the drawbar hitch point

SO, What do you all use or recommend where you need length for pulling?
Yes! It is a matter of safety, but I need some practicality when it comes to cost.

Options I am aware of:

1. I needed about 100' to get clear and this is way more than my current chain .
2. Recovery pull strap is only 30'
3. Heavier bull rope?
4. I see newer winches and off-roaders are using synthetic line, but that gets really pricy.
5. Maybe cable, but that is a good way to get hurt fast when something lets go.

Thanks in advance!

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[bbxlr8]

I occasionally have someone film but is my goal to keep out of those epic fail highlight reels

Here's what not to do.

https://www.facebook.com/Edward1Lebron/videos/2915245288766068/?fs=e&s=cl

Totally agree & the main idea for the thread. Why I use a long line and now going to upgraded line & snatch block(s).

Thanks again to all those who chimed in - I learn something new all the time!