Tractor choice?

[Viper16]

Another new guy here looking for some help in choosing a tractor. I have 20 acres with a couple acres of lawn to mow, 7-8 acres of woods to maintain, about a 300' paved sloping driveway to maintain in a Wisconsin winter along with horses and associated manure to haul/spread.

I have an old Toro lawn tractor with a 48" deck that I use for mowing and pulling a small manure spreader but the mowing takes time and I can't use it to spread manure in the snow since it is not 4WD. So I see my main uses as mowing followed by plenty of uses for a FEL to include hauling manure, wood and general maintenance around the property along with snow removal.

My neighbor has a Kubota that he is happy with and I am surrounded by many dairy farmers who have a myriad of different tractors. I initially started looking at the BX series but recently looked at the B series after, believe it or not, my wife actually thought we should go bigger on the tractor!

I have read many of the forum posts not only on here but also on JD sites and other tractor related forums along with watching many different comparison videos.

Until recently I have narrowed it down to a BX (either 23 or 26) or the JD 1025 - with a 60" deck and FEL. Like I said earlier I just threw the B 2301 into the mix.

I have driven both the BX and 2301 at the dealer but the JD dealer brought out a 1025 to my place and let me use it for a couple hours over a weekend. That was very helpful and let me see the uses I will have for it and also some limitations.

Seems like most of the JD types say the 1025 is a clear winner and the Kubota types, while less boisterous, seem to say the BX is better. The 1025 has some nice features - fwd and reverse pedals next to each other, easy on/off loader and deck and position control on 3 pt. However the BX has some advantages too. If they were the same price it would be a real tough choice but as of now, unless the JD dealer comes down, I don't think the JD advantages are worth an extra $2000.

My questions are mainly related to some of the things I have picked up on the forums and videos. I have also noticed that some of the forum members here have both machines and may be able to give a educated comparison position.

1) Metal vs. plastic - has anyone seen a problem with dents/rust on their Kubota or cracking on the JD plastic hoods/fenders?

2) Trundle pedal vs. side by side - I didn't seem to notice any big problem with the Kubota set up but wasn't doing a lot of loader work where you may be going back and forth a lot. Thoughts?

3) JD now offers a 6 year transmission warranty - any transmission problems with the Kubota?

4) Have seen some comments on the forum in regards to a HST fan that could be a problem on the Kubota - is it much of an issue?

5) The JD loader cannot curl and lift at the same time - is this a problem?

6) There is about $1000 difference between the BX 2370 and 2670 - will I notice the slight difference in HP to justify moving up to the 2670?

7) Haven't received a price yet on the B 2301 so not sure if it's a contender but any thoughts on moving up to that size? I have seen some comments about the extra weight of the B series but it seems like it is only about 100# heavier than the BX series.

Sorry about the length of the post - appreciate any comments you guys may have.

Thanks,
Dean

 

[rtgt]

To start with, I think a BX Kubota or 1 Series JD is a bit small for 20 acres.

Both are capable tractors but they have smaller tires and Limited Cat 1 3 point hitches.

A "B" Series Kubota or a 2 Series JD will have larger tires and better ground clearance. It may not seem like much, but the ground is a lot less bumpy with larger tires. When you load the tires, you get an even better ride and better traction.

Likely you will be maintaining some pasture. You are pretty much limited to a 4' rotary cutter with a smaller tractor.
Depending on your use, 4 to 4 1/2' box blade is the most effective size for a box blade on a SCUT.
My B3200 handles a 5' cutter and a 5' box blade with no problem.

You will get better hydraulics and better lift capacity with the larger frame tractor as well.

The hydro pedals are a personal comfort issue. Drive them both and decide for yourself if either is better or a deal breaker.

My last Deere was a 2305 (predecessor to the 1 series) and had a metal hood. When I looked at the 1 series, I kinda felt like the plastic hood was a bit flimsy, but that again is personal preference. Just don't drop stuff on your hood and you're good!

There are several people that start with a SCUT and later upgrade to the next size up. It may be a little bit more $ now, but in the end it won't cost as much as having to trade up.

I sounds like your wife is pretty smart.

 

[BadDog]

I'm not really qualified to offer any advice, but I will offer my current thinking regarding my own choices.

Many years ago I had a couple of 20-40 acre properties in a local area with a variety of uses. I had several different tractors including Ford, Long, and a (trashed)Case over the years, but for the main part I had an old well worn MF T35 (IIRC?) that I got a good deal on with lots of implements and it just did every thing I ever asked, never thought much about it. But all that was sold some 20 years ago when the local economy collapsed and I realized I need to be and do something else.

Now I have a small 1+ acre property in N Phoenix with plans to buy some land up N in the next few years. Heard good things about the older small Kubotas, so thinking "I don't need anything like I had before, this will do.", I bought a sad old B7100. First off, the 3 point ticked me off from day one. Here I moved to a popular tractor several decades newer than my sad old beater and it has an unbelievably (comparatively) primitive 3 point control that I could never seem to "get and keep right". And I thought I was ready to accept the enormous drop in capacity, but I didn't need to run a 8'(ish?) bush-hog mower through heavy grass/hay/silage/corn (or the like) any more. Wrong. Everything I tried to do with that little loader or the 3 point, it seemed like I was pushing or beyond the limits. Just improper expectations on my part. But I still liked the little tractor for what it does well enough (and it's small enough to get around on a little property).

Then I found a decent deal on a B2150. I thought to myself, "now here is a better compromise more in keeping with my earlier experiences". And it had the position control 3 point, which would have been a deal breaker without at this point. Cut to the chase, I still hit the limits every time I turn around. It's stronger and more capable by far, but still only manages a meager 1k lbs on the 3 point, and the loader is only slightly stronger than the B7100. So again, I made a mistake in gauging my own expectations and doing proper due diligence on actual capacity rather than assuming. Though unlike the B7100, it does run the Auger easily that gave the smaller B fits, and it came with a decent sized frame mount Backhoe that I still haven't managed to get rebuilt and in service (partly because I keep waffling on selling it to upgrade again).

So, for me, if I ever decide to get fed up and sell one or both of the 2 little tractors I have, I don't think I would ever get anything less than an L in the orange tractor line. In practical numbers, I certainly don't need another MF like my old one, but I really wish that's what I had gotten again. And the loader on that tractor, in spite of not being all that much physically larger (though much heavier) would easily lift 3+ times what this B2150 does. Is it enough, yeah, but I don't like working around limitations of my equipment or tools, preferring to have more than I need and just getting things done.

 

[bcbull378]

Buy as big a tractor as you can afford , many more people upgrade to a bigger tractor than downsize.

 

[TripleR]

We have both; long story.

1) Metal vs. plastic - has anyone seen a problem with dents/rust on their Kubota or cracking on the JD plastic hoods/fenders?

No problems with either.

2) Trundle pedal vs. side by side - I didn't seem to notice any big problem with the Kubota set up but wasn't doing a lot of loader work where you may be going back and forth a lot. Thoughts?

It's an individual thing, I can use either, my wife dislike the side by side.

3) JD now offers a 6 year transmission warranty - any transmission problems with the Kubota?

None with either, but the aluminum rear end on the predecessor 2305 had problems. Our impression, having owned a 2305, the 1025R is a much improved machine.

4) Have seen some comments on the forum in regards to a HST fan that could be a problem on the Kubota - is it much of an issue?

Not if you put Bro Tek plates on, if you don't yes.

5) The JD loader cannot curl and lift at the same time - is this a problem?

We don't have a loader on our 1025R, sorry can't help on that.

6) There is about $1000 difference between the BX 2370 and 2670 - will I notice the slight difference in HP to justify moving up to the 2670?

No

7) Haven't received a price yet on the B 2301 so not sure if it's a contender but any thoughts on moving up to that size? I have seen some comments about the extra weight of the B series but it seems like it is only about 100# heavier than the BX series.

Yes, I would go with the B2301. The only reason we can get by with SCUTs is we have several other bigger tractors handy. I wouldn't want a SCUT for your uses.

 

[Grouse Feathers]

I have a BX2370 for snow blowing, road grading and general fel work. Extra power will only show up at the pto. I could use more power for the wet heavy snow we got this year, but it wouldn't make any difference to my grader scraper or fel.

The BX is fine running around the road and lawn, but the more you get in the fields and woods the more you will wish you had bigger tires.

The BX 3 point works fine with my grader scraper, but position control on a B would be better if you are using implements that require more precise control of the 3 point (rakes, rear blades, box blades, tillers.....).

The loader bucket capacity of the BX is 4.9 cu ft. The loader capacity of the 54" B bucket is 6.7 cu ft. How many manure trips do you want to make?

 

[sheepfarmer]

I have 15 acres, a couple of horses, and sheep, and have an L size tractor. I have a small very old manure spreader, and can't imagine pulling it with a BX, or loading it for that matter. Depending on your horsekeeping arrangements and the amount of manure you want to mulch and/or spread, I would think you would want a large B or a small L.

Yes it would matter to me if the tractor wouldn't lift and curl at the same time.

 

[85Hokie]

My questions are mainly related to some of the things I have picked up on the forums and videos. I have also noticed that some of the forum members here have both machines and may be able to give a educated comparison position.

1) Metal vs. plastic - has anyone seen a problem with dents/rust on their Kubota or cracking on the JD plastic hoods/fenders?

Look at JD lawn cutters.....almost all I have seen in the past - including mine and a friend of mine, the hood did NOT last 10 years....plastic, the sun cooks it to the point of fracture! AND break up bad is an understatement !

2) Trundle pedal vs. side by side - I didn't seem to notice any big problem with the Kubota set up but wasn't doing a lot of loader work where you may be going back and forth a lot. Thoughts?

I dont like the side by side at all, reason - pure safety, you move your shoe/boot in a panic and you might not hit the correct pedal. FOR the same reason HST is far safer than clutch/gear......if you have someone near by and you are looking to ease forward a mere 6" the HST is far safer too. AND I have driven both a hellva lot - loader work is a lot easer on HST

3) JD now offers a 6 year transmission warranty - any transmission problems with the Kubota?

Never heard of one ....so far

4) Have seen some comments on the forum in regards to a HST fan that could be a problem on the Kubota - is it much of an issue?

Can be a huge issue, that is if you are NOT aware of it, now the tractors since the 2013 model year have little mini guards, but many a folk, including me, have spent a few more bucks on undercarriage insurance!


5) The JD loader cannot curl and lift at the same time - is this a problem?

O hell yes that is a problem, dont let anyone fool you either, next time you want to get something out of your fridge, move one joint at time....see if that just sucks.....and very slow too!

6) There is about $1000 difference between the BX 2370 and 2670 - will I notice the slight difference in HP to justify moving up to the 2670?

10% more power is more power, if only the 1K - I would do it -then again I cannot say that I ran out of power with my 2370. But save that 1k and move to the B series

7) Haven't received a price yet on the B 2301 so not sure if it's a contender but any thoughts on moving up to that size? I have seen some comments about the extra weight of the B series but it seems like it is only about 100# heavier than the BX series.

Yes - The B's have a higher clearance and larger tires, both are needed in the wooded areas...... my bx's Achilles heel is traction on snow/ice - larger tires helps in that area. If you can wing it - go bigger.

 

[CaveCreekRay]

I live on a 5 acre horse property and at time, my L3800 seems small for what I do! But I like the overall package "size" when it comes time to park it in the barn or maneuver in tight places.

As for the HST tranny, I spent my early years at my airline watching rampers trying to destroy Kubotas. They'd hook up to a train of five or six baggage carts and at max RPM mash the FWD pedal to the floor, burning rubber with the mains (2WD only) and then going full reverse at the other end to stop. Unbelievable. Never heard of one problem with the HSTs so I made sure to buy one when I went looking for a tractor. My wife loves it and has no problem hopping on to drive it or to pick up a heavy load and move it from here to there. Big bonus in tractor use for me. When moving boulders, I can load and unload and she can drive and look pretty.

For the size property you have, I say go as large as you possibly can, and then a tad bigger. The finance rates are low right now but qualifications for them may get tougher in the next year. Get what you need now as trading up costs a lot of $$. And get all the implements you might need. (Box scraper, rake, plow, tiller. Whatever. And don't forget a roof!!!). They give great package deals when you buy a machine...

Good luck and enjoy.

The day after you operate the machine for the first day, you will wonder how you'd ever get along without one. I think about that almost daily.

Ray

Does this wife look happy???

 

[Viper16]

Thanks for all the great advice - it is very helpful. Seems like the consensus is to go bigger.

When I first started considering the SCUT I envisioned using it in the barn/stalls but after using the JD 1025 I realized that would not be practical so the size is not as much as a factor as it was at the start. I see the advantages of having more power and ground clearance even if I won't need it all the time. So I guess it boils down to cost.

The preliminary quotes I have received so far, without any bargaining, are:
BX 2370 - $13,500
BX 2670 - $14,500
JD 1025 - $17,250
B 2301 - $ 18,500

The BX and JD include $700- $1000 implement rebates and the B 2301 includes a $300 tractor and $700 cash rebate. They all include a quick attach loader and 60" deck.

I think the difference between the JD and B series is a no brainer considering the much more capable tractor for a little more than $1000. I also don't see the JD advantages are worth $3-4000 more than the BX. So I need to decide if the $4000-$5000 difference from the BX to the B is something I want to do. I am leaning that way since it would cost me more in the long run if I went small and then regretted it as I was unable to do what I needed to or got stuck in the woods.

One other question - as far as snow removal goes can the FEL do an adequate job or do you need a rear blade to be effective? I can go with a front snow blade but it seems like a rear blade would be cheaper and would have other uses other than just snow. I think the front snow blade might be limited in other applications. Thoughts?

Thanks again for all the advice - it is real world and very helpful. Without this I wouldn't have known about getting skid plates and considering ground clearance as part of my decision process. If I end up going the Kubota route I'll be sure to visit often and hopefully contribute in the future.

 

[Grouse Feathers]

Like everything else about tractors, it depends. How much snow do you get and how much room do you have for the snow. A rear blade will handle about 6" effectively. The front end loader will pretty much handle any amount, but you have 300' of snow to dig through. Even with a front blade a deep heavy snow of 2' may require digging out a path with the fel and then widening with the blade. You could try the fel and a rear blade and later upgrade to a snowblower. A front mount blower is nice, but a rear mount is cheaper and more available used. With only 300' that would not be a lot of backing up, and a blower usually eliminates any problem of running out of room.

 

[aeronutt]

Two things come to mind immediately: 1) You only care about cost one time on the day you buy it, you care about having the right machine every time you turn the key for the whole time you own it. 2) I can't count how many times I bought a small tool to "save money" and ended up buying the bigger one soon after, which means I could have saved a LOT of money by just buying the bigger one to start with.

Now, for a few of the specific questions... I destroyed a JD hood by dropping a 2x4 on it from about 2 feet up. Steel would have been dented a bit, but not destroyed. If you're playing with trees, it's just a matter of time before something whacks the tractor so the steel hood is a clear winner in my book. For the loader operation, not being able to blend curl and lift is a 100% show stopper. I have thousands of hours experience running loaders and I just can't imagine having to stop one motion before starting the other. Unless you are running big PTO attachments, you don't need big horsepower. Something you didn't ask, but I'll throw out anyways: Try to avoid getting a tractor with DPF. It's a major PITA and a lot more money, not to mention just one more thing that will cost you maintenance and repair dollars. Lucky for you, none of the tractors you're looking at have DPF so it's already handled.