Suspicious of Regen

[Buffalo]

I have a 2014 L3901 with about 65 hours on it. It has "regen"ed about
three times.

When the panel lights up with the "puffer picture" I follow the directions,
parking the tractor and raising the RPM until the appropriate light goes out.
The "puffer" keeps blinking, and will do so indefinitely.

If I give the tractor a little work to do, it apparently heats up a bit and
the "puffer" quits blinking, and the "regen" apparently then completes
as it is supposed to.

I am suspicious that the mechanism that starts the actual regen is not
quite adjusted properly, since from all that I read the thing should regen
under the conditions of setting the parking brake and advancing the
throttle until the RPM light goes out.

I have not been able to initiate a regen at all using the "parked regen procedure" (the
one that raises the RPM automagically).

I'm a little suspicious. What am I doing wrong ?

 

[Blondie70]

You are doing it right. Just keep on working when it wants to regen. Raise the RPM until it is happy and keep on boogying on. It will stop when it is finished. You are OK !
I have never done a parked regen. When the light comes on I just rock and roll until it's happy.

 

[sheepfarmer]

The directions are confusing. If you see the regen indicator blinking you should just increase the rpm and go on working as long as you have enabled auto regen. The tractor can't do a parked regen until after it has reached level 2.

 

[KuB2650]

Best thing you can do when it starts to auto regen is don't shut it off and run it hard, the hotter the better. We rarely do a parked regen on our L, but we run things harder than a homeowner. Honestly, I think the first parked regen on our L3901 was at almost 200 hrs.


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[lugbolt]

The instructions are confusing.

Normally when it wants to regen, 2 lights come on. The top one (puffer light) and then one below it with a pic of an engine, with an arrow through it pointing "up"...that means do nothing other than rev the engine, wide open works. As long as it's above 2300 RPM, it'll regen.

There is no adjustment of any of the mechanisms; it's 100% electronic and everything is programmed into the ECU, and Kubota does not offer any electronic adjustment to speak of.

 

[skeets]

I have heard,, so take it with a grain of salt,, when at the dealers a fellow came in with the same question,, I over heard the service manager tell him when the lights come on run it like you stole it. He said things need to get really warm ( hot) and when they do it all works like it is suppose to. These machines were not built to be babied they are built to work and work hard. So use it and yes I know it is a big investment , but sometimes ya just have to use things for what they were designed for so they work like they are suppose to work

 

[scdeerslayer]

I wouldn't try a parked regen unless I had to. I've had 3 so far, the first I had to delay a little while then let it run while I was moving stuff around with the forks, I just had to keep the rpms higher. The second was while mowing and I didn't know it was happening until I noticed the exhaust smell was different, then I saw the light in the dash. The third I had to delay a little while then let it run while travelling on the paved road and then mowing. I figure if it doesn't regen while working there's always something I need to move or brush that needs to be pushed up and I can do that while it regens.

 

[bywaterdustin2]

Sorry for the dumb question but what is a regen? I am new to the tractor world I have a 1990 Kubota M6950DTS

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[nickelplated5s]

Sorry for the dumb question but what is a regen? I am new to the tractor world I have a 1990 Kubota M6950DTS

You don't have to worry about it. It's emission equipment added to, I believe, 2014 and newer tractors above 26 HP. There was a big uptick in sales of 'over the road' trucks before this requirement went into effect.

 

[lugbolt]

You don't have to worry about it. It's emission equipment added to, I believe, 2014 and newer tractors above 26 HP. There was a big uptick in sales of 'over the road' trucks before this requirement went into effect.

And dealers were marking the prices up a little too. Scalping. Then when the Tier IV trucks came out, DPF and DEF, it was deemed to be much ado about nothing. The systems work and work pretty good (most of the time). Actually on trucks, you don't even know it's in it's cycle unless you see the lamp come on in the dash. Thing is, though, trucks have MUCH larger engines that generate enough heat at much lower RPM to get the cycle to work; as opposed to the little 1.7 (?) liter 3 cylinder of the L3301 which doesn't make nearly as much heat. I think one cylinder of many big trucks is "bigger" than the entire L3301 engine if that tells you anything. Heat is how the cycle works. The DPF if a metal screen that catches soot. The electronically controlled system injects fuel at just the right time, which goes into the exhaust system and burns-causing the screen (DPF) to get really hot, which turns the soot that's caught in it into ash. On bigger engines, there's enough heat that it doesn't need to run wide open. On smaller ones, you have to raise the engine speed to make enough heat and air/exhaust flow to get the DPF hot enough for the cycle to "work".

The downsides: if you get poor quality fuel, it'll clog the DPF quicker, and have more frequent regen cycles. If you idle around and/or lug the engine, it'll regen more often. If an operator rolls the tractor over and oil gets into the DPF, it has to be replaced-or at the least professionally cleaned. Oil contaminates it and it'll never work properly with oil on it. Overfilling can do the same thing.

To many it's just more stuff to go wrong-and they're not wrong in that thinking. But it does work, and used properly, lasts a long time and is basically trouble free for the most part. It does, however, add expense when it comes time to maintain the systems. I've only had to deal with ONE, out of about 300 sold, and it was a customer-induced issue. Light came on at 247 hours, operator didn't know what it was and kept running the tractor. At 560 hours, the tractor had been in a stage 5 regen failure for a LONG time. Stage 5 means that the DPF is plugged nearly solid and when this happens, it's basically like stuffing a tater in the exhaust pipe..meaning it leads to pistons melting, etc. Which is exactly what happened. Estimate to repair was over $15,000 (L3901). Insurance company stepped in and totaled it, but when they total them, they don't buy you a new tractor. They give you a check for x amount and then you can do whatever with it.

 

[skeets]

So the customer did not understand what it was about, to me that would mean the sales person that sold it didnt do a very good job. Just MHO

 

[sheepfarmer]

So the customer did not understand what it was about, to me that would mean the sales person that sold it didnt do a very good job. Just MHO

That is exactly the problem. Many sales people have not had the occasion to own one of the new tractors, and the different models differ from each other in how they work. Add to that new owners don't know anything about how they work, and furthermore many of them are not used to using equipment that you have to pay attention to. With the exception of the B3350, the new owners that have the attitude that, for better or worse, these tractors have this feature and they had best take care of their investment, do fine. I actually like my 3560. I wouldn't trade it for an older tractor like an L3800 which was what my dealer priced out first. But I didn't know didly about tier IV and he didn't tell me either. I had to dig out the information with help from the Kubota customer satisfaction email service.

The L tractors have an entirely different method of regenerating and indeed running than the B3350. The regen method of the B is roughly 5 times more complicated, and is way more sensitive to temperature. The sales guys don't have this information, the directions are poorly written in all the manuals, and it is a recipe for trouble.

 

[sheepfarmer]

Added thought: and it is easy to be critical, and I shouldn't be mean, but the guy that lugbolt describes shouldn't have been allowed to adopt a nice orange tractor. His troubles were of his own making.

 

[Buffalo]

My bottom line seems to be that the tractor does not quite get hot enough to regen with the
throttle wide open, but the machine parked. To me, it probably should, and that is what prompted my suspicion about possible adjustment (or misadjustment) of the regen parameters.

If I let the tractor move, that seems to generate enough heat to complete the
requirements. It's that close. Moving ten feet does it.

I guess the problem is solved, but it bothers me a bit. I'm worried what it will be doing twenty years down the road, and I'm worried about who will work on it then.

Seeing how badly the government regulators have screwed up the yellow diesel can spouts, I am really short of confidence in yet another gimmick in response to some environmental standard.

Oh well. I do love the tractor !

 

[sheepfarmer]

Buffalo, I think your tractor is probably just fine. It is just not possible to make it do a parked regen until it has passed into level 2 and you can tell it is in level 2 if it is beeping at you. I am not sure what is happening that it would start a regen when you moved it forward, but moving it at all if it were trying to do a parked regen will normally interrupt it. Turning the key off and back on again will also restore the default condition for the auto regens, see below.

In addition to the directions being confusing there may be a mistake about pushing the auto regen inhibit button in parked regen mode in the L-01 manuals. Without going into all those complexities, to start with follow the suggestions the guys have made above for auto regens:

1. When you start your tractor make sure it is in "allow auto regen mode". On older tractors you push a button that says auto and a light comes on in the button. On newer models, auto regen is the default and you don't have to do anything, and the button has a diagonal line through the puffer symbol. That button is then called in your manual the "dpf inhibit" button. Its light should be off.

2. Do your work as usual.

3. If you see the regen indicator BLINKING on your dash, also look at the indicator below it, an engine symbol with an up arrow. Increase your rpm until the engine symbol goes off, full throttle is fine but may not be necessary.

4. Continue working and the blinking regen indicator should then change to being on steadily. Regeneration has started. Don't drop the throttle or turn the engine off until it is done, about 15 min, and the light goes out. Keep working or stand still, doesn't matter.

That will work 99% of the time. If it is interrupted, or you don't see the light, and it starts to beep at you, then you need to understand the parked regen procedure.

Next time it asks for a regen let us know how it works out.

 

[lescarpentier]

My last regen interval was less than 2 hours and still no parked regen.Sparks were coming out this time too for the first time.

 

[Buffalo]

Thank you. I'll watch for it, and I"ll keep notes next time.

 

[sheepfarmer]

My last regen interval was less than 2 hours and still no parked regen.Sparks were coming out this time too for the first time.

The B3350 has a couple of different things in the regen procedure. I have the OM and the WSM for the 2650 and it includes the regen procedures for the 3350, but I don't have any practical experience. If you look in your owner's manual on p16 it says when the regeneration interval is less than 4 hrs a parked regen will be required. I don't know if this means you should inhibit auto regen and force it to beep at you so you can do a parked regen or what. The shop manual describes something called a DOC regeneration, and the intervals for that are 9 hrs, 9 hrs, 3 hrs, 2 hrs, and then it will request a DOC regen which as near as I can tell would be like the dpf regen. If you come to understand this from your tractor I'd sure like to know. This DOC regen is only mentioned in the 3350 manual. Maybe yours did it, and that was the sparks?

 

[Swampcollie]

i have had my MX5800 since august. It has gone through 2 regens in that time. In neither case did I see the light come on. I smelled it and looked down. I just kept on working and it did its thing. It was really no big deal.

 

[Buffalo]

sheepfarmer, you are doing a real service ! Thanks for becoming an authority on the regen stuff. I, for one at least, really appreciate it !