SUDT replacement ?

[mikester]

 

[Smokeydog]

I’ve been in the OEM camp. Since I do the maintenance try to use top shelf products.

Do use Shell rotella synthetic in the tractor engines instead of Kubota oil.

Hydraulic/transmission oil change in both tractors takes five, 5gallon buckets so almost $500 difference in cost. Local dealer is high and shipping is expensive. Probably stick with Kubota SUDT for piece of mind. Changing oil and filters timely is as important as oil brand.

Did order a gallon of synthetic Triax for the Suzuki Kingquad transmission to try instead of Mobil 134. Wet clutch and brake.

 

[TheOldHokie]

I’ve been in the OEM camp. Since I do the maintenance try to use top shelf products.

Do use Shell rotella synthetic in the tractor engines instead of Kubota oil.

Hydraulic/transmission oil change in both tractors takes five, 5gallon buckets so almost $500 difference in cost. Local dealer is high and shipping is expensive. Probably stick with Kubota SUDT for piece of mind. Changing oil and filters timely is as important as oil brand.

Did order a gallon of synthetic Triax for the Suzuki Kingquad transmission to try instead of Mobil 134. Wet clutch and brake.

The last time I purchased the local dealer price for SUDT2 was $140 per pail. At that price there is no way to get $500 savings on 5 pails of anything. How the heck much are you paying for SUDT2?

Dan

 

[Eodman]

Recently when I purchased my used M7 152 Deluxe tractor, I did and exhaustive amount of research on Kubota UDT and the Super UDT2 fluid.

Valvoline actually manufactures this fluid for Kubota based on their requirements/specifications. I was looking for a suitable substitute only because of the price seemed to be unreasonable at my local dealership.

My tractor has a German ZF 16 transmission which is used in many other platforms other than Kubota. I also researched the other models and their Hydraulic fluid requirements for this transmission.

I realize it may seem like I was in the weeds just because of hydraulic fluid, but truthfully this cost wasn't as much of my issue but finding the absolute best fluid I could that would provide the protection needed for my transmission.

I did purchase (13) 5-gallon jugs of Cam2's premium Hydraulic fluid, and my intent was to drain every drop of fluid from my tractor and do a complete replacement of all the fluid or a least as much as I could reasonably get out, and that includes all 4 filters and the oil in housings that had filter elements.

Well after all that and going through all the info I could find about recommended fluids for these super expensive transmissions I kept thinking about all the equipment I have on my ranch that I used my remotes on, I.E. (2615 Bush Hog, Hay Baler, Kuhn trailed hay cutter, Kewanee folding disc, "new" Kubota Hay Rake RA212CR and my older M&W Hay rake), I'm sure I am forgetting a few more, but the point is to be completely safe all of this equipment would have to have all the hydraulic fluid removed. If not as soon as I attached to any of them, I would contaminate my Tractors Hydraulic Reservoir.

With all that rambling, I think I will be changing my Hydraulic fluid and replacing it with Kubota's Super UDT2 and just hope the hydraulic filters on the tractor do what they are supposed to do.

When the Engineers designed this equipment, they knew that at some point there will be Hydraulic fluid that intermingles from ancillary equipment, it cannot be helped. And draining all my equipment hydraulic fluid including my other tractor (NH TD5050) is crazy.

Kind of a crazy first post, but yesterday, I had a buddy that is the Head Service Tech from my local Kubota Dealer come to the Ranch. We hooked his KOBD up to the Tractor and uploaded the latest software to all the various computers and re-calibrated every component on this tractor, I did purchase it used, and it didn't appear to have been updated since it left the Factory in France.

There is definitely a noticeable difference in operation, even though it was smooth before. I wish we as end users could easily purchase these connectors and software, but who knows maybe someday.

I will use what Kubota recommends, if nothing else but to try and protect my investment, it has to be fairly decent, since the rep I contacted at Lucas Oil, told me Kubota's Super UDT2 is one of the only Hydraulic Fluids they cannot recommend a Lucas product as a replacement.

I told you I really got into the weeds.

At the end of the day, you can pay a little more now or a heck of a lot more later.

Hope you all had a wonderful Thanksgiving, and an even better Christmas.

V/r,

C

 

[TheOldHokie]

Recently when I purchased my used M7 152 Deluxe tractor, I did and exhaustive amount of research on Kubota UDT and the Super UDT2 fluid.

Valvoline actually manufactures this fluid for Kubota based on their requirements/specifications. I was looking for a suitable substitute only because of the price seemed to be unreasonable at my local dealership.

My tractor has a German ZF 16 transmission which is used in many other platforms other than Kubota. I also researched the other models and their Hydraulic fluid requirements for this transmission.

I realize it may seem like I was in the weeds just because of hydraulic fluid, but truthfully this cost wasn't as much of my issue but finding the absolute best fluid I could that would provide the protection needed for my transmission.

I did purchase (13) 5-gallon jugs of Cam2's premium Hydraulic fluid, and my intent was to drain every drop of fluid from my tractor and do a complete replacement of all the fluid or a least as much as I could reasonably get out, and that includes all 4 filters and the oil in housings that had filter elements.

Well after all that and going through all the info I could find about recommended fluids for these super expensive transmissions I kept thinking about all the equipment I have on my ranch that I used my remotes on, I.E. (2615 Bush Hog, Hay Baler, Kuhn trailed hay cutter, Kewanee folding disc, "new" Kubota Hay Rake RA212CR and my older M&W Hay rake), I'm sure I am forgetting a few more, but the point is to be completely safe all of this equipment would have to have all the hydraulic fluid removed. If not as soon as I attached to any of them, I would contaminate my Tractors Hydraulic Reservoir.

With all that rambling, I think I will be changing my Hydraulic fluid and replacing it with Kubota's Super UDT2 and just hope the hydraulic filters on the tractor do what they are supposed to do.

When the Engineers designed this equipment, they knew that at some point there will be Hydraulic fluid that intermingles from ancillary equipment, it cannot be helped. And draining all my equipment hydraulic fluid including my other tractor (NH TD5050) is crazy.

Kind of a crazy first post, but yesterday, I had a buddy that is the Head Service Tech from my local Kubota Dealer come to the Ranch. We hooked his KOBD up to the Tractor and uploaded the latest software to all the various computers and re-calibrated every component on this tractor, I did purchase it used, and it didn't appear to have been updated since it left the Factory in France.

There is definitely a noticeable difference in operation, even though it was smooth before. I wish we as end users could easily purchase these connectors and software, but who knows maybe someday.

I will use what Kubota recommends, if nothing else but to try and protect my investment, it has to be fairly decent, since the rep I contacted at Lucas Oil, told me Kubota's Super UDT2 is one of the only Hydraulic Fluids they cannot recommend a Lucas product as a replacement.

I told you I really got into the weeds.

At the end of the day, you can pay a little more now or a heck of a lot more later.

Hope you all had a wonderful Thanksgiving, and an even better Christmas.

V/r,

C

An SDS does not even qualify as long grrass let alone "the weeds".

How much of this did you find in that SDS?

1997-09-08
Development of High Performance Transmission/Hydraulic Fluid (KUBOTA Super-UDT)

Establishing the Specification and New Test Method 972788

 

[Eodman]

Very little testing data listed in the MSDS, it was just how I looked up the company (Valvoline) that was making it for Kubota.

Found some of their test data later, but since it didn't compare and contrast with other fluid, it really didn't seem that it was that important since it was already proven as a superior fluid for Kubota Equipment. Though in their testing between their own fluids, they didn't seem to change much from UDT to SUDT except for the viscosity Index and the pour point which is directly affected by viscosity.

The engineer I spoke with at Lucas stated the reason he didn't have anything he could recommend was due to the High Viscosity Index of the Super UDT. It appeared to him that Kubota was tweaking the original formula to accommodate equipment in colder climates.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Very little testing data listed in the MSDS, it was just how I looked up the company (Valvoline) that was making it for Kubota.

Found some of their test data later, but since it didn't compare and contrast with other fluid, it really didn't seem that it was that important since it was already proven as a superior fluid for Kubota Equipment. Though in their testing between their own fluids, they didn't seem to change much from UDT to SUDT except for the viscosity Index and the pour point which is directly affected by viscosity.

The engineer I spoke with at Lucas stated the reason he didn't have anything he could recommend was due to the High Viscosity Index of the Super UDT. It appeared to him that Kubota was tweaking the original formula to accommodate equipment in colder climates.

The Amsoil engineer is partially correct. If you read Kubotas .test report they tweaked the formulation in two areas;

They lowered the base kinematic viscosity slightly (both KV40 and KV100) while increasing the viscosity index The goal qas to increase low temperature flow through the hydraulic system at cold startup. The qualifying test is a 5 minutec timed flow through a hydraulic filter at extremely low temperarure.

They added a water tolerance requirement which seemed to be aimed at humid climates. They specifically mentioned Asia and rice paddies

There are multiple qualifying tests for water tolerance

1. The oil has to absorb 1% by weight water without emulsifying, additive percipitation, or forming free water.
2. The oil has to pass a longer humidity cabinet test.
3. The oil has to pass the SAE brake chatter test after being mixed with 2% by weight water

Dan

 

[mikester]

The last time I purchased the local dealer price for SUDT2 was $140 per pail. At that price there is no way to get $500 savings on 5 pails of anything. How the heck much are you paying for SUDT2?

Dan

It costs me $1K to change all the fluids and filters on a major service interval. Cost of doing business. Cheaper than buying a new machine.

 

[TheOldHokie]

It costs me $1K to change all the fluids and filters on a major service interval. Cost of doing business. Cheaper than buying a new machine.

That EXACTLY the type of faIse equivalency that permeates these discussions.

Dan