Possible DEF shortages

[DaveFromMi]

Speaking again about California, they are affecting interstate commerce by not allowing truckers into their ports. California's barriers are unconstitutional. Congress has the responsibility to regulate commerce between the states.
Other states need to fight this in court; they should have a good case.

 

[fried1765]

Speaking again about California, they are affecting interstate commerce by not allowing truckers into their ports. California's barriers are unconstitutional. Congress has the responsibility to regulate commerce between the states.
Other states need to fight this in court; they should have a good case.

It certainly would seem that California has every right to control intrastate commerce.
Interstate commerce is a different animal.
All freight/cargo picked up at California seaports is likely considered intrastate until it crosses state lines.
I do not believe that Congress has, or should have, any control over intrastate commerce.

I very seriously doubt that other states "should have a good case" against California.

 

[aaluck]

I do not believe that Congress has, or should have, any control over intrastate commerce.

Everything is interstate commerce today, everything. Has been since 1964, Katzenbach v. McClung.

 

[aaluck]

All freight/cargo picked up at California seaports is likely considered intrastate until it crosses state lines.

That's not how it works. Everything in those ports is headed not only to California but the entire country. Any action taken by Cali that stops that movement of goods effects interstate commerce. Preventing trucks from entering or leaving Cali is the definition of interstate commerce.

 

[fried1765]

That's not how it works. Everything in those ports is headed not only to California but the entire country. Any action taken by Cali that stops that movement of goods effects interstate commerce. Preventing trucks from entering or leaving Cali is the definition of interstate commerce.

So,..... you are stating that a ratty looking, Louisiana registered, coal rolling, 1963 B61 Mack, can simply pull into the Long Beach port, pick up a load,..... and head right back to Louisiana, no questions asked?

 

[DustyRusty]

Even the Federal Government is afraid of California. I know of a case where a Federally owned truck didn't meet the California Air Resource Board standards, and it had to be removed by a low bed from Twentynine Palms Base, to the DERMO yard to be sold, and then transported out of California the same way. Once it arrived in Arizona, it could be driven to its final destination.

 

[aaluck]

So,..... you are stating that a ratty looking, Louisiana registered, coal rolling, 1963 B61 Mack, can simply pull into the Long Beach port, pick up a load,..... and head right back to Louisiana, no questions asked?

I'm not saying it, Article VI, Paragraph 2 of the Constitution is.

 

[fried1765]

I'm not saying it, Article VI, Paragraph 2 of the Constitution is.

The constitution regulates individual state anti-pollution requirements?
I learn something new every day!

 

[aaluck]

The constitution regulates individual state anti-pollution requirements?

Not to get too far off into the weeds... The interstate commerce clause prevents states from restricting interstate commerce, hence the name. Art. VI, Para 2, states that federal laws (such as the ICC) trump state laws. So yes, that's what I am saying.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

hmm.. CA isn't 'restricting' the commerce, just that YOU have to obey THEIR envirolaws....
Frankly this could be settled PDQ, simply remove CA from the USA, then King Newsom and his minions can do what they want. Have ALL ships head to Port of Washington or Oregon. Cut the power feeds that supply CA with 'dirty' power.
hmmm2. Wonder what CA people will say when nonCA EPA rated vehicles try to come to the 'big one', to help those trapped in buildings and such, and are turned away by the CA EPA enforcers?

 

[DustyRusty]

hmm.. CA isn't 'restricting' the commerce, just that YOU have to obey THEIR envirolaws....
Frankly this could be settled PDQ, simply remove CA from the USA, then King Newsom and his minions can do what they want. Have ALL ships head to Port of Washington or Oregon. Cut the power feeds that supply CA with 'dirty' power.
hmmm2. Wonder what CA people will say when nonCA EPA rated vehicles try to come to the 'big one', to help those trapped in buildings and such, and are turned away by the CA EPA enforcers?

Does that mean that Pelosi will be gone from Washing Done?

 

[fried1765]

Not to get too far off into the weeds... The interstate commerce clause prevents states from restricting interstate commerce, hence the name. Art. VI, Para 2, states that federal laws (such as the ICC) trump state laws. So yes, that's what I am saying.

I am quite certain that California, and other state environmental rules, take precedence over the ICC rules.
If CA says you don't meet their vehicle pollution requirements, it means that you do not operate on CA highways, until/unless you modify your vehicle to comply. I suspect that the CHP will assist in determining compliance, such as not permitting port entry..
Similar to: If you buy an older Mercedes made to European standards, you cannot operate it in the USA until/unless it meets USA standards for safety (glass) and pollution.

 

[aaluck]

I am quite certain that California, or other state environmental rules, take precedence over the ICC rules.
If CA says you don't meet their vehicle pollution requirements, it means that you do not operate on CA highways, until/unless you modify your vehicle to comply. I suspect that the CHP will assist in determining compliance.
Similar to: If you buy an older Mercedes made to European standards, you cannot operate it in the USA until/unless it meets USA standards for safety (glass) and polution.

Okay.

 

[DaveFromMi]

So,..... you are stating that a ratty looking, Louisiana registered, coal rolling, 1963 B61 Mack, can simply pull into the Long Beach port, pick up a load,..... and head right back to Louisiana, no questions asked?

Sounds like an argument California would use in court.
Deflection....

 

[DaveFromMi]

California is requiring phase in of "zero emission" semi trucks in 2024.
Only problem is that they don't exist.
Would like to see the charging station for one of those.

 

[jyoutz]

It also shows how STUPID it is to depend on one state to forward the goods to rest.

How many states border on the Pacific Ocean?

 

[lynnmor]

How many states border on the Pacific Ocean?

There is at least one that needs to be bypassed.

 

[DaveFromMi]

Why hasn't anyone brought suit against California for violating the Constitution, putting up these trade barriers?
This is one of the main causes of the manufactured supply chain disruption and I believe it is being done for that reason.

 

[sheepfarmer]

California is requiring phase in of "zero emission" semi trucks in 2024.
Only problem is that they don't exist.
Would like to see the charging station for one of those.

They exist, seems like I read a review by a trucker trying one out about a year ago. Up side much easier to drive in LA traffic, had about enough charge, 6 to 8 hrs, to make one round trip to port and back to their warehouse. Down side obviously not enough charge for long trips. I don't remember the recharge time.

Another one of those "useful for some people" things. But not impossible to start introducing. Seems like a company could distribute their trucks across the country so a trucker could switch the trailer to a fully charged one and leave the other to be recharged for the next load. A la pony express.

 

[DaveFromMi]

Tesla has at least one prototype truck driving on the road.

Tesla releases video of its new electric semi truck prototype on test track

Tesla has released a video of its new Tesla Semi electric truck prototype on the test track. The new prototype...

electrek.co

I hope they are successful.
They had better have a full charge when driving into Ca.