New Cars/Trucks

[BBFarmer]

The sooner I can get out of the repair business the better. Wages haven't kept up with complexities and the manufacturers just design them but when it comes time to work on them, "uhh I don't know".

You and me both brother. And I'm over here dreaming DAILY what else can I do. Of course with the kids only being 9,12, and 15 I have to keep my head down and do what I only know to do.

I was 15 1/2 driving to my first shop, i'll be 41 next month, still driving to a shop. And I bet your like most on here and been going way longer than me.

Its been good. Last 10 years real good. Like, bring my NICU nurse wife home so she can pursue her dream of homeschooling and farm running good.

Our shop has been truly blessed. In 15 years we have never had an empty parking lot. Its always been the two of us with some form of third apprentice position that comes and goes. The boss has always "fed me first", all the big jobs, all the good jobs. Its why I'm here every single day for him as well as my family.

But him and his ole lady come from pretty high up families. Between that and how well his business has went over the almost 17 years he's been open now, I know all good will soon come to an end. They could retire tomorrow if they wanted to. And my fear is, any one of these crazy a$$ customers could make that happen sooner than later.

So after this, i kinda dont want to spin a wrench anymore. I mean, if the family starts getting hungry i can always roll the toolbox back out. But, I THINK, i'd rather find something I can work solo, or atleast get away from the general public. Who knows. Gotta be other things out there.

 

[RCW]

Not all start-stop technology is equal.

Toyota has been making hybrids for over 25 years and are on their 5th gen. Try driving a new Toyota hybrid like a Camry or Prius. You won't be able to detect the gas engine starting and stopping. I get better fuel mileage than my motorcycle and cheaper to insure than an EV.

I haven't tried the Toyota truck hybrids.

Interesting you mention a hybrid, from Canada no less.

A friend has an older Chevy Volt hybrid.

Real dyed-in-the-wool GM car-guy. Was a tech, service writer, service manager, etc. for 60 years. Real expert on anything GM from the '50's to current.

Among he and his grown sons, they probably have 15-20 very nice classics, all GM (I think).

When I realized he had a Volt, I was surprised. He loves it, says best car he's ever owned. I think he said lifetime mpg was about 80 mpg. Has 80k+ on it.

We can get cold in upstate New York. Says battery range can be as low as 20-30 miles on a cold winter morning, but for him that's doable.

Did have an issue with a controller/regulator-type fixture between the batteries this year but covered under warranty. Did have to go to a dealership a distance away that was certified for EV or hybrid work.

 

[RCW]

glad i don't live in the north anymore.

I keep vehicles forever. 2003 f250 I bought in 13, still have it. Just under 300,000 mi and still kicking.

repairs cost less than new vehicles for sure. I'm gonna need a transmission sooner or later, $4500 quoted locally. That's a whole lot cheaper than $64,000 for a new gas burner. Sure more stuff is going to go wrong at some point but the cost of new trucks also increases so the percentages of fix vs new doesn't change as much.

if i still lived in rust-ville my F250 would have been long gone by now (rotted out).

the complexities of newer vehicles are exactly why I don't enjoy working on cars like i used to. The sooner I can get out of the repair business the better. Wages haven't kept up with complexities and the manufacturers just design them but when it comes time to work on them, "uhh I don't know".

Yeah, "The North" creates many challenges. Not only body corrosion, but electronics, brake and fuel lines, etc., etc.,.....I think we've replaced the "park assist" harness on the Mrs. Equinox twice....

A daughter lives in Santa Cruz, California. Amazed me the older cars you see daily there as daily drivers.

 

[RCW]

Like, bring my NICU nurse wife home so she can pursue her dream of homeschooling and farm running good.

The Mrs. being a NICU nurse speaks volumes.

She can tolerate you....

Poking fun - our identical twins were born at 34 weeks.

Spent 2 weeks in NICU. I hold the highest regard for the care they had in NICU.

Many years later, one of those girls spent many years in clinical research in the NICU at The Children's Hospital of Philadelphia (CHOP). She was part of a couple papers published in the journals at the time about COVID transmission.

It takes a special person to care for those tiny infants.......

 

[The Evil Twin]

Drove a rental Camry hybrid in NV for a week in April. It was DEFINITELY noticeable. I also don't like the lack of heat or AC when the gas engine is not running.

 

[BBFarmer]

The Mrs. being a NICU nurse speaks volumes.

She can tolerate you....

Poking fun - our identical twins were born at 34 weeks.

Spent 2 weeks in NICU. I hold the highest regard for the care they had in NICU.

Many years later, one of those girls spent many years in clinical research in the NICU at The Children's Hospital of Philadelphia (CHOP). She was part of a couple papers published in the journals at the time about COVID transmission.

It takes a special person to care for those tiny infants.......

Yes sir. I had never seen inside of a nicu before.

The Mrs. had 3 natural births with a whatever you call it (not a midwife but the other one that starts with a D). We were extremely blessed to have everything happen on time and with no issues.

With the exception of my middle daughter, of whom we severely mistimed and was delivered in our bathtub, we wouldn't go to the hospital until right before the party was about to start, spend a couple days, then head out.

Walked into the nicu one day many years ago to feed the nurses and saw a baby no bigger than a large screen cell phone. I was totally speechless. More tubes and wires going to and from than I could count.

 

[lugbolt]

Yeah, "The North" creates many challenges. Not only body corrosion, but electronics, brake and fuel lines, etc., etc.,.....I think we've replaced the "park assist" harness on the Mrs. Equinox twice....

A daughter lives in Santa Cruz, California. Amazed me the older cars you see daily there as daily drivers.

live in nebraska for about 11 years. Rust-ville. If you had a car older than 5 years old, it was a miracle, or it came from off.

Did a pretty good job on an EV today. Drives fine, no cluster, no infotainment. Mfg says check fuses and relays probably gonna find your issue there. Yeah, no. Found 3 bad modules. Replaced all three at a cost to customer of $4900 for the modules and about $600 in labor.

EV's suck. But at least they're electric and not gas AND electric. I don't do hybrids, the other guys can have that mess.

 

[BBFarmer]

live in nebraska for about 11 years. Rust-ville. If you had a car older than 5 years old, it was a miracle, or it came from off.

Did a pretty good job on an EV today. Drives fine, no cluster, no infotainment. Mfg says check fuses and relays probably gonna find your issue there. Yeah, no. Found 3 bad modules. Replaced all three at a cost to customer of $4900 for the modules and about $600 in labor.

EV's suck. But at least they're electric and not gas AND electric. I don't do hybrids, the other guys can have that mess.

If you've wrenched in the northern territories, your a different breed of tech for sure. My heart goes out to you LOL.

As southern techs we have no clue about any of it. We tend to be in complete shock and awe at the things y'all see DAILY.

My first 2 years in the shop I was basically tied to a couple decade running chrysler master tech. Mr. Jamie was from Aralia or Orelia (I can say it, can't spell it) somewhere way up in Canada. And was by far the most knowledgeable tech I've ever been around still to this day. Taught me great diagnostic strategies very young in life. But I still remember all of his horror stories, that was 25 years ago.

What EVs you wrench on? They arent big around us. Rarely any hybrids seen either.

 

[mikester]

Drove a rental Camry hybrid in NV for a week in April. It was DEFINITELY noticeable. I also don't like the lack of heat or AC when the gas engine is not running.

 

[lugbolt]

If you've wrenched in the northern territories, your a different breed of tech for sure. My heart goes out to you LOL.

As southern techs we have no clue about any of it. We tend to be in complete shock and awe at the things y'all see DAILY.

My first 2 years in the shop I was basically tied to a couple decade running chrysler master tech. Mr. Jamie was from Aralia or Orelia (I can say it, can't spell it) somewhere way up in Canada. And was by far the most knowledgeable tech I've ever been around still to this day. Taught me great diagnostic strategies very young in life. But I still remember all of his horror stories, that was 25 years ago.

What EVs you wrench on? They arent big around us. Rarely any hybrids seen either.

I do Polaris stuff for a living, they have two EV ORV's that I service. The legacy EV Ranger and the new Ranger Kinetic (2023-2024). The legacy EV's were junk. The newest ones are a LOT better, for now. Problem with them is, when there is a problem, it is a whole lot more complicated to diagnose them as opposed to a ICE EFI Ranger xp 1000 for instance. I really really like the Kinetic's, and I think there is a market for them but ONLY if they can keep the cost down on them. When they were introduced in 23, they started out at I think $25,000 for the base model, and we sold about 30 of them IIRC. A year later the price went up about $8000 and guess what happened? Sales flatlined. I have a General XP and I honestly think that if there were a General with that powertrain from the EV, I might be interested. I love the quiet operation (not quite silent) and I love the power. The power is addicitive! But Ranger isn't nearly as comfortable on the trails we have here, which is why I bought our General.

back to rust....I don't see how stuff doesn't rust here. Right now I'm sitting in the house, a/c is on 76. The windows are sweating, so dewpoint has to be 75-77 degrees outside. IOW, that's pretty humid. Was in the shop working earlier and everything is sweating out there too but the a/c is set on 75 out there. Got up to 88 deg earlier today, heat index had to be around 103 or so with the humidity. Later this week is supposed to get brutal, If nothing changes and the forecast temps hold true, we're looking at heat index about 118 or so. Now you guys in the SW USA might not think 118 is terrible because y'all have little humidty, but the humidity is TERRIBLE. Soon as you step outside, the air feels like you can wear it. It's just heavy with moisture. Sweat does not evaporate so you just feel hot all the time, and around here the average wind speed this time of year, until about october, is under 1mph. So unless you have a fan, or you are moving in an open cab, its just miserable. That is the only word I can think of, miserable. You don't know unless you've experienced 3-4 months straight of it, as we do here. That's one of many reasons I quit Kubota dealer job, the boss would not put a/c in the shop (said it costs too much) and us shop techs were paying the price, and get gouged with low wages and poor working conditions (and I mean piss poor). Quit cold turkey and was gonna work for myself but got an offer at another place in 2020, a/c and heat in the shop, easier work, and about a 250% pay raise from the kubota job. Yeah I took that job. Still do some at the house here and there (but not Polaris or Yamaha, since that's what we do at work), just not very much.

 

[BBFarmer]

I do Polaris stuff for a living, they have two EV ORV's that I service. The legacy EV Ranger and the new Ranger Kinetic (2023-2024). The legacy EV's were junk. The newest ones are a LOT better, for now. Problem with them is, when there is a problem, it is a whole lot more complicated to diagnose them as opposed to a ICE EFI Ranger xp 1000 for instance. I really really like the Kinetic's, and I think there is a market for them but ONLY if they can keep the cost down on them. When they were introduced in 23, they started out at I think $25,000 for the base model, and we sold about 30 of them IIRC. A year later the price went up about $8000 and guess what happened? Sales flatlined. I have a General XP and I honestly think that if there were a General with that powertrain from the EV, I might be interested. I love the quiet operation (not quite silent) and I love the power. The power is addicitive! But Ranger isn't nearly as comfortable on the trails we have here, which is why I bought our General.

back to rust....I don't see how stuff doesn't rust here. Right now I'm sitting in the house, a/c is on 76. The windows are sweating, so dewpoint has to be 75-77 degrees outside. IOW, that's pretty humid. Was in the shop working earlier and everything is sweating out there too but the a/c is set on 75 out there. Got up to 88 deg earlier today, heat index had to be around 103 or so with the humidity. Later this week is supposed to get brutal, If nothing changes and the forecast temps hold true, we're looking at heat index about 118 or so. Now you guys in the SW USA might not think 118 is terrible because y'all have little humidty, but the humidity is TERRIBLE. Soon as you step outside, the air feels like you can wear it. It's just heavy with moisture. Sweat does not evaporate so you just feel hot all the time, and around here the average wind speed this time of year, until about october, is under 1mph. So unless you have a fan, or you are moving in an open cab, its just miserable. That is the only word I can think of, miserable. You don't know unless you've experienced 3-4 months straight of it, as we do here. That's one of many reasons I quit Kubota dealer job, the boss would not put a/c in the shop (said it costs too much) and us shop techs were paying the price, and get gouged with low wages and poor working conditions (and I mean piss poor). Quit cold turkey and was gonna work for myself but got an offer at another place in 2020, a/c and heat in the shop, easier work, and about a 250% pay raise from the kubota job. Yeah I took that job. Still do some at the house here and there (but not Polaris or Yamaha, since that's what we do at work), just not very much.

Sounds like you and I have the exact weather.

I've lived in the deep south now 30 years. But I'm originally from southern California. Frequented a couple times a year every year and would vacation there but stopped after our 2nd youngin came.

A 118 deg day in palm springs desert doesn't hold a candle to our 90 deg day in the south. Most extreme humidity i've ever felt in my life.

And like you said, the wind just goes away. I've worked outside in shops since May of 2000 and I'm getting tired. Ready for something else. 25 mississippi summers will condition anyone, but man its getting old. Get caught for more than two minutes out from in front of your fan or portacool and you'll soak a shirt in no time.

I'm glad you were able to get yourself into better working conditions. What a difference that must have made. For most shops, especially larger ones with high volume or traffic, its just not feasible to a/c. Most can run heat, like we do, and it can even be quite difficult to keep that in during winter time with lower traffic.

But when you're pulling a vehicle in and out so often having to raise massive bay doors. It just ends up being a losing battle with the a/c. And you still get to hear the boss hit the roof when the bill comes in.

I helped run a very large shop in Flowood, MS that two extremely stout successful brothers had then recently taken over. They were a pair of tire tycoons in our area with a name dating back in the 60s. They were into repair shops, automated car washes, and very heavy into commercial real estate. It was a divided 17 bay shop, 6 on a quick lube, tire side and 10 plus an alignment rack on the mechanical side. Had a large showroom in the center. Heated and cooled all the way through.

We ran the a/c for about one billing cycle. It was so bad that these deep pocketed millionaires, whom which we could always get to spend whatever on anything automotive related for the shop, said that shop a/c will never get turned on EVER again for as long as they owned the building. Never had a clue what the bill was either. But it had to be absolutely massive to make these dudes buck.

 

[chim]

Lugbolt - nice to hear about your employment good fortune.

My guess about the lack of rust is probably 90% due to the lack of super salty roads in the Winter.

Probably another 10% is due to the temperature being more stable throughout the day/night. Going from hot and humid to pretty cool is what makes non-humans sweat. I really believe there's even a component in parking over paving rather than open ground / gravel.

 

[RCW]

Lugbolt - nice to hear about your employment good fortune.

My guess about the lack of rust is probably 90% due to the lack of super salty roads in the Winter.

Probably another 10% is due to the temperature being more stable throughout the day/night. Going from hot and humid to pretty cool is what makes non-humans sweat. I really believe there's even a component in parking over paving rather than open ground / gravel.

Very true.

"Rust" isn't just the metal parts of a vehicle.

We've had a couple times when kids were away at college and couldn't have a vehicle on campus. Their vehicles were parked on our gravel driveway.

I would try to drive them routinely, but during a nasty winter opportunities can be limited.

A winter is all it takes to mess up rotors and pads.......ask me how I know.

My son's Honda Civic recently had a bunch of codes. Turns out is a transmission fluid pressure controller of some sort.

Don't know where it's located, but he drives a bunch of salty roads ........

Makes me think of the gas tank vent solenoid of GM trucks...changed a few of those. Located where they get fouled up around these parts......

 

[lugbolt]

Sounds like you and I have the exact weather.

I've lived in the deep south now 30 years. But I'm originally from southern California. Frequented a couple times a year every year and would vacation there but stopped after our 2nd youngin came.

A 118 deg day in palm springs desert doesn't hold a candle to our 90 deg day in the south. Most extreme humidity i've ever felt in my life.

And like you said, the wind just goes away. I've worked outside in shops since May of 2000 and I'm getting tired. Ready for something else. 25 mississippi summers will condition anyone, but man its getting old. Get caught for more than two minutes out from in front of your fan or portacool and you'll soak a shirt in no time.

I'm glad you were able to get yourself into better working conditions. What a difference that must have made. For most shops, especially larger ones with high volume or traffic, its just not feasible to a/c. Most can run heat, like we do, and it can even be quite difficult to keep that in during winter time with lower traffic.

But when you're pulling a vehicle in and out so often having to raise massive bay doors. It just ends up being a losing battle with the a/c. And you still get to hear the boss hit the roof when the bill comes in.

I helped run a very large shop in Flowood, MS that two extremely stout successful brothers had then recently taken over. They were a pair of tire tycoons in our area with a name dating back in the 60s. They were into repair shops, automated car washes, and very heavy into commercial real estate. It was a divided 17 bay shop, 6 on a quick lube, tire side and 10 plus an alignment rack on the mechanical side. Had a large showroom in the center. Heated and cooled all the way through.

We ran the a/c for about one billing cycle. It was so bad that these deep pocketed millionaires, whom which we could always get to spend whatever on anything automotive related for the shop, said that shop a/c will never get turned on EVER again for as long as they owned the building. Never had a clue what the bill was either. But it had to be absolutely massive to make these dudes buck.

they keep it at 80 during the day at work in the shop. It isn't terrible but I wish it was 75. It runs all the time anyway, at 80 or at 70 it just runs all day long. So the bill wouldn't change. Did 29 years at a non-air conditioned shop and that was enough of it. After I left they put a window unit in the shop office so the manager could stay nice and cool. A year later they put a 2 ton a/c in the shop. 10,000 sq ft shop, 24' ceiling and they decided to tease the guys with "A/C", which did nothing. Maybe knocked the humidity down a little (very little probably). The guys al left, last long time employee there (17 years, (took my place) left a couple weeks ago. Can't blame em. Don't know where he went. So many things I don't miss about working on kubota's and a lot of what I don't miss was due to that particular dealership's handling of, well about everything. In a nutshell us shop guys were just there because the law says we had to be there. They didn't care about us, we were just grease monkeys, and a thorn in their side-and it showed by the pay scale, how they treated us, how they talked to us, and about us behind our backs. When you're young, like I was when I got into the tractor and mower business, it isn't as bad. I'm pushing 50 now and working outside in this heat and to an extent the cold too, is just hard on the body. I'm ready to retire. All those years of it, plus not having a lift, laying on your back, using 2x4's and old tree stumps to support split tractors, takes a big toll on the body and I am certainly feeling it every single day now-and still have 15 more years to go. The good thing is, my first boss (deeere/kubota until 2018) was real good about planning for the future, set us up with a real good retirement plan. I learned a lot from him and one of many things was that someday you're gonna get tired, so make sure to invest what you can and start early so that when the day comes when it's time to go, it's not as much of a burden. I did that, and in 2020, I got sick of the 'new' (2 1/2 years) owners, walked in and quit cold turkey. Now there was more to it, I'd talked to them and upper management about a lot of issues, but they blew a lot of it off. So it shouldn't have been a surprise. Nonetheless there was enough in the bank to live on for a couple years or so, plus enough in investments to live on for about 10-12 years (comfortably, after taxes penalties and fees), so I took advantage.

so for you younger folks just getting into a job, make SURE you put some money back for retirement. Start a IRA asap, put the max amount you can into it and keep your debt low (or better yet zero). Work hard, work smart, and one day when faced with a problem, you have more freedom. IOW if the boss says something to you that you don't like, you can tell them to stuff it, and you'll be fine. And you don't need a college degree to make it happen either. A good financial planner is a great idea though.

 

[McMXi]

Drove a rental Camry hybrid in NV for a week in April. It was DEFINITELY noticeable. I also don't like the lack of heat or AC when the gas engine is not running.

I'm not a fan of that feature either. I've never owned a vehicle that automatically shuts off and restarts when stopped at a light, but I've rented quite a few cars and SUVs that do. I rent a car about every five to six weeks for work and maybe 10% to 15% have that annoying automatic feature. I never spend enough time in the vehicles to figure out if it can be defeated via a change in settings.

 

[Runs With Scissors]

back to rust....I don't see how stuff doesn't rust here.

@chim said it already. One word sums it up.

"road-salt"

The "upside" to having worked on cars here in the "Rust Belt", and aircraft that were flown in "sea salty air" is that I have become "rather good" at removing corroded fasteners and things.

If I can't get it "un-stuck", not many other people could have either.

 

[RCW]

The Mrs. retires in a couple weeks after 40 years on the job. I've been retired for several months after 37.

We'll be on a Fixed Income......(WTF does that mean - - - we were always on a fixed income )

I've been watching promotions, etc.

Most local dealerships have a bunch of new vehicles. Maybe we'll look to trade her car, or maybe both.

I think I'll sit tight for a couple months until the 2026 models come out. A couple months might help with interest rates as well.

Time will tell.......

This was something we always did as a matter of course. Obviously looked for deals, and got some good ones for rebates, etc.

The last 5 years have been very different.