Need thoughts on "drying out" my land.

North Idaho Wolfman

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I don’t understand that comment….. “thinning trees”…. will not help. Trees suck up water… Thinning them will increase ground-water retention.

Some of the “thirstiest” trees are cedar, juniper, and cottonwoods…. which can pump up several hundred gallons-per-day.
Normally I would say yes the trees suck up water, but if the trees are there and you have a water issue, then the ground is probably choked with roots and duff and could use opening up.
Also putting extra light on the land and getting it to dry out helps further aeration and drainage.

I have family in michigan and worked the farm up there, and michigan has huge drainage issues.
The soil locks together and won't drain.
Anything to open it up and breaks it up helps.

Most of Michigan's ground water table is very high and that exasperates the issue.
Most farmers found that tiling (adding perforated drainage pipes) and getting the water to move to drainage ditches makes everything work better.
 

Runs With Scissors

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Thanks for the replies everyone.

I was looking at some videos where farmers were putting in drain pipes, and that looks like a good idea if you have some place to drain it too. I don't have any creeks or ponds to drain to, so that kind of eliminates that.

I think I am going to have to take a multifaceted approach.

I am going to look for some Topographic maps as suggested. I think that will help me to understand a little better what I am facing.

I think clearing some of the saplings might help, I am hoping that the extra ventilation/sun will help dry it up a wee bit. The area is pretty windy most of the time since we are only about a mile (as the crow flies) from Lake Huron.

Then plant either Bald Cypress and/or Weeping Willows along the trail near the "soft spots".

This is not a "Louisiana Swap" type of situation, its just some low spots that I would like to clear up and make more "usable".

Also, as suggested, I am going to look into filling in the area with some sort of "fill dirt/gravel/wood chips".

Looks like summer just got a lot busier!!!!
 

mikester

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I have been "trailblazing" a little so that my grand kids can ride the Mini-bikes and Rhino someplace other than around the cottage.

The problem is that there are quite a few areas where the ground is very wet most of the time.

Now for the occasional travel it's not too bad, but repeatedly going over those spots produces some problematic "mud holes".

The property is pretty flat, and has LOTS of small saplings. So many in fact, that it makes walking around very difficult (think jungle), but relatively few large trees. It is also insanely rocky when you dig.

I am looking to try and "dry it out" this summer.

My first thought is to start "thinning out" the saplings to allow a little more air flow, and sunlight to help dry things out a bit.

But I am not sure thinning it out will be nearly enough, as the "back yard' also has "water pockets" after it rains, and these pockets take days to dry out, despite having no trees around and getting "full sun".

I have never had a property this large; So any thoughts on how to get it to dry out ?
1712744961049.jpeg
 
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GreensvilleJay

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Hmm...once you see the 'lay of the land' you can direct the water into small 'retention ponds' ?
You'll never win trying to fight Mother Nature but you can 'help' her and claim a partial victory.
 
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Runs With Scissors

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Hmm...once you see the 'lay of the land' you can direct the water into small 'retention ponds' ?
You'll never win trying to fight Mother Nature but you can 'help' her and claim a partial victory.
Hmm....that's a possibility.

I will have to kick that around for a while. :unsure:
 

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After H.S. graduation I thought I wanted to attend Forestry School… so attended Stephen F. Austin State College in Nacogdoches, Tx, enrolled in Dendrology 101 as one of my freshman courses.

One of the lectures involved an example of “Why Hire a Forester?” … An example of which was 80 acres in Florida heavily timbered in Cottonwoods.

”LIFE” magazine paid premiums for cottonwood-pulp because it made “slick” paper which was also exceptionally lightweight….thereby making lovely paper for publishing photographs and reducing Postage Fees for mailing those magazines to subscribers.

The gentleman who owned the 80 acres was reluctant to hire a Degreed-Forester, so the story went, …. especially since it was a simple matter to check-out a book on the subject at the local Library…. which informed the man that CottonWood trees reproduce BEST when they are “Clear-Cut”….because the bulldozers, trucks, etc which harvest and then clear the land after the harvest …. leaves the ground thoroughly distrubed…… where the harvested trees seeds will have fallen on bare, mineral soil…. resulting in a hardy re-growth.

Realizing a hardy re-growth would likely produce another valuable cottonwood stand in 20 years….the man saved the fees a forester would have charged as-well….and allowed the timber company recommended by LIFE magazine to come in and Clear-Cut his 80 acres.

What was unfortunately overlooked in this lovely activity is….. the water table was only a few feet beneath the surface…. and a mature cottonwood can pump and dissipate about 120 gallons of water Daily.

Within a month of the harvest…. the man owned 80 acres of flooded Swamp-land…. and a class action lawsuit from his flooded neighbors.

Clay subsoil can add to water retention in low-lying areas and filling-in with loam, sand, and organic material may help reduce “soggy-bottom-land”.

PostScript: My parents thought they’d met my needs by sending me off to sleepy Nacogdoches, Tx for college…. resulting in a ”2-S” student-deferment from the Selective-Service Act…. as Viet Nam was quite the News in ‘67-‘68 …. and my numbnuts brother had already managed to get himself a place in the mess hall over at Fort Polk… (his plan that flunking-out of Texas A&I down in Kingsville would be no big-deal since Dad was an Appeals-Judge on the Selective Service Appeals Board).

That plan didn’t “pan-out” for him when Dad Recused-Himself from the case… and Mel ended up landing the following year in Quang-Tri during a mortar-attack.

I was equally ignorant at age 18 …. my first semester resulting in two “A”s, three ”B”s and a “C”….. but my second-semester discovering my new dormitory-room-mate held a Private Pilot’s certificate and that Nacogdoches, Tx had an Airport!

Being as STOOPID as most other boys at that age…making the Most Important Decisions of their Lives…. I stopped attending classes … spending my days at the airport washing airplanes for flight-lessons…. and trading my dormitory meal-tickets for a borrowed-car to drive to Apple Springs (across the county-line where beer could be purchased)…. and …not being smart-enough to simply “Drop” the classes at the Registrar’s Office…. my ”Plans” were interrupted when my parents received my Grades….. Five “F”s….. and yanked my young azz out of school and brought back home to Houston… where I could be better-supervised….and was enrolled at the local junior-college for 14-hours of uninteresting courses of their selection.

My student-performance did not improve (San Jacinto Jr. College also had an aviation-curriculum of which my parents were ignorant)…. next, Uncle “Sam” promptly violated me with a “Pre-Induction-Physical Examination”…. but Congressman Pirnie drew number 354 for my birthdate…so immediately “dropped” the Gov’t 101 course so-as to keep my 1-A classification (and the 354 status)…basically meaning I’d not be “drafted” unless we actually ”Declared” that we were at War with those folks who now make the tires and appliance-dolly I own.

Never did become a “Forester”…. which wasn’t the Adult-Version of Boy Scouting I had thought it’d be anyway.

Ended up messing with airplanes after-all…. continued with my “lucky-streak”….taking every wrong-turn at every Fork-in-the-career-path I could muster …. and everything turned out wonderful despite my usual inclinations. :D
 
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Runs With Scissors

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After H.S. graduation I thought I wanted to attend Forestry School… so attended Stephen F. Austin State College in Nacogdoches, Tx, enrolled in Dendrology 101 as one of my freshman courses.

One of the lectures involved an example of “Why Hire a Forester?” … An example of which was 80 acres in Florida heavily timbered in Cottonwoods.

”LIFE” magazine paid premiums for cottonwood-pulp because it made “slick” paper which was also exceptionally lightweight….thereby making lovely paper for publishing photographs and reducing Postage Fees for mailing those magazines to subscribers.

The gentleman who owned the 80 acres was reluctant to hire a Degreed-Forester, so the story went, …. especially since it was a simple matter to check-out a book on the subject at the local Library…. which informed the man that CottonWood trees reproduce BEST when they are “Clear-Cut”….because the bulldozers, trucks, etc which harvest and then clear the land after the harvest …. leaves the ground thoroughly distrubed…… where the harvested trees seeds will have fallen on bare, mineral soil…. resulting in a hardy re-growth.

Realizing a hardy re-growth would likely produce another valuable cottonwood stand in 20 years….the man saved the fees a forester would have charged as-well….and allowed the timber company recommended by LIFE magazine to come in and Clear-Cut his 80 acres.

What was unfortunately overlooked in this lovely activity is….. the water table was only a few feet beneath the surface…. and a mature cottonwood can pump and dissipate about 120 gallons of water Daily.

Within a month of the harvest…. the man owned 80 acres of flooded Swamp-land…. and a class action lawsuit from his flooded neighbors.

Clay subsoil can add to water retention in low-lying areas and filling-in with loam, sand, and organic material may help reduce “soggy-bottom-land”.

PostScript: My parents thought they’d met my needs by sending me off to sleepy Nacogdoches, Tx for college…. resulting in a ”2-S” student-deferment from the Selective-Service Act…. as Viet Nam was quite the News in ‘67-‘68 …. and my numbnuts brother had already managed to get himself a place in the mess hall over at Fort Polk… (his plan that flunking-out of Texas A&I down in Kingsville would be no big-deal since Dad was an Appeals-Judge on the Selective Service Appeals Board).

That plan didn’t “pan-out” for him when Dad Recused-Himself from the case… and Mel ended up landing the following year in Quang-Tri during a mortar-attack.

I was equally ignorant at age 18 …. my first semester resulting in two “A”s, three ”B”s and a “C”….. but my second-semester discovering my new dormitory-room-mate held a Private Pilot’s certificate and that Nacogdoches, Tx had an Airport!

Being as STOOPID as most other boys at that age…making the Most Important Decisions of their Lives…. I stopped attending classes … spending my days at the airport washing airplanes for flight-lessons…. and trading my dormitory meal-tickets for a borrowed-car to drive to Apple Springs (across the county-line where beer could be purchased)…. and …not being smart-enough to simply “Drop” the classes at the Registrar’s Office…. my ”Plans” were interrupted when my parents received my Grades….. Five “F”s….. and yanked my young azz out of school and brought back home to Houston… where I could be better-supervised….and was enrolled at the local junior-college for 14-hours of uninteresting courses of their selection.

My student-performance did not improve (San Jacinto Jr. College also had an aviation-curriculum of which my parents were ignorant)…. next, Uncle “Sam” promptly violated me with a “Pre-Induction-Physical Examination”…. but Congressman Pirnie drew number 354 for my birthdate…so immediately “dropped” the Gov’t 101 course so-as to keep my 1-A classification (and the 354 status)…basically meaning I’d not be “drafted” unless we actually ”Declared” that we were at War with those folks who now make the tires and appliance-dolly I own.

Never did become a “Forester”…. which wasn’t the Adult-Version of Boy Scouting I had thought it’d be anyway.

Ended up messing with airplanes after-all…. continued with my “lucky-streak”….taking every wrong-turn at every Fork-in-the-career-path I could muster …. and everything turned out wonderful despite my usual inclinations. :D
That's quite a story. Glad it worked out for ya.

Mine college story is similar, but my mom and dad gave me a polite "90 day notice" when they got my 2nd semester grades.

They said "If you want to be a bum, that's your decision. But we aren't subsidizing it. You have 90 days to find a place to live and get a job"

90 days later I had 70 roommates and this guy in my face 24/7.

1712923942746.png



I sure showed them 😂 😂 😂
 
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GeoHorn

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LOL… Yeah…. I ended up back in-school…. but paying for it myself…. which makes an interesting situation for a young man… When paying for the classes with money You had to earn by working…. the Grades improved significantly… (and the AirLines insisted on a college degree before interview)…. I’m not sure how a degree in History qualifies anyone to fly planes ….but that was the ticket to job interviews.
 
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