Loader valve power beyond M6800

[Haytown Farm]

We bought this m6800 years ago. It came with a woods loader that was run off the two auxiliary hydraulic levers (next to the 3pt lever). Wanted to add a grapple function so we bought a prince 3 spool valve, 25gpm with power beyond. My neighbor has the same tractor with a different 3 spool loader valve and we copied the way his hydraulic lines were run. The feed comes from the front of the manifold that leads to the auxiliary hydraulic valves, return goes to a plug above the pto and a third line I assumed was power beyond goes to the bottom of the auxiliary hydraulic manifold.

We have that all setup matching his tractor. The loader valve functions fine but the auxiliary hydraulics and 3pt arms have no power. If I engage one of the loader valve functions then the auxiliary hydraulics will work, but only while the loader valve in engaged and it seems like they are fighting each other. The 3pt arms went up but won’t go down. Not sure if I'm sending power beyond to the wrong place, if there is too much flow/pressure or an air lock or something? Or maybe there is a different place I should have tapped into the hydraulics? We don’t really need the auxiliary hydraulics so I'm tempted to remove those valves and just use the cover plate and see if that solves the problem?

Next to where we took the hydraulic feed on that manifold there is a valve that is turned with a straight screwdriver. Was originally to the left. There is only hydraulic flow to the loader valve when this is turned to the right and my neighbors tractor that we are copying is turned to the right. 3pt and auxiliary hydraulics don’t work in either the left or right position now. Any advice on what I’m doing wrong would be appreciated.

 

[TheOldHokie]

We bought this m6800 years ago. It came with a woods loader that was run off the two auxiliary hydraulic levers (next to the 3pt lever). Wanted to add a grapple function so we bought a prince 3 spool valve, 25gpm with power beyond. My neighbor has the same tractor with a different 3 spool loader valve and we copied the way his hydraulic lines were run. The feed comes from the front of the manifold that leads to the auxiliary hydraulic valves, return goes to a plug above the pto and a third line I assumed was power beyond goes to the bottom of the auxiliary hydraulic manifold.

We have that all setup matching his tractor. The loader valve functions fine but the auxiliary hydraulics and 3pt arms have no power. If I engage one of the loader valve functions then the auxiliary hydraulics will work, but only while the loader valve in engaged and it seems like they are fighting each other. The 3pt arms went up but won’t go down. Not sure if I'm sending power beyond to the wrong place, if there is too much flow/pressure or an air lock or something? Or maybe there is a different place I should have tapped into the hydraulics? We don’t really need the auxiliary hydraulics so I'm tempted to remove those valves and just use the cover plate and see if that solves the problem?

Next to where we took the hydraulic feed on that manifold there is a valve that is turned with a straight screwdriver. Was originally to the left. There is only hydraulic flow to the loader valve when this is turned to the right and my neighbors tractor that we are copying is turned to the right. 3pt and auxiliary hydraulics don’t work in either the left or right position now. Any advice on what I’m doing wrong would be appreciated.

The feed from the manifold goes to the loader valve and the power beyond on the loader valve comes back to the manifold where it continues to the remotes. The manifold port connections and selector valve operation are described in the operators manual.

Dan

 

[Haytown Farm]

Can you see in the pictures I posted if I’m tapping into the wrong places in the manifold? Or maybe I need to take the pin out of that screwdriver valve and have it more opened or closed. I don’t have the manual, will need to search for an online version. I looked through the hydraulic section of the shop manual online and couldn’t find anything about that screwdriver valve.

 

[Fedup]

In your photo the ports labeled on your new valve appear to be correct. The one labeled PB. Does that have a true power beyond sleeve, or is that just an adapter? From your description it sounds like all the oil from this valve is going to sump.

 

[Haytown Farm]

It’s possible it’s just a regular adaptor not power beyond. The valve came with power behind adaptor, I gave it to the hydraulic guy that was doing the fittings and lines a couple months ago and he just got everything together and made this week. Maybe it got lost or mixed up and he just put in a regular adaptor? I did pull that line off earlier and start the tractor, and there is a full flow out of that power beyond port all the time.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Can you see in the pictures I posted if I’m tapping into the wrong places in the manifold? Or maybe I need to take the pin out of that screwdriver valve and have it more opened or closed. I don’t have the manual, will need to search for an online version. I looked through the hydraulic section of the shop manual online and couldn’t find anything about that screwdriver valve.

Do not mess with the pin - it needs to be in place.

I can't find any documentation on that tractor but looking at the parts diagrams I would GUESS the hose you have marked as "feed" should be going to IN on the loader valve and the hose marked as power beyond should be coming FROM the power beyond port on the loader valve.

With the loader connected the selector valve should be placed in the position that routes pressurized oil out the port marked as "feed".

Fedup makes a good point. If the power beyond port on the loader valve is not properly configured nothing downstream of the loader valve is going to work. However there appears to be a sleeve installed in that port and then a 90 degree elbow is installed in the sleeve.

Dan

 

[PoTreeBoy]

Fedup may be right, but if you didn't have the PB adapter, I don't think the rears would ever work. I think you have the T and PB reversed.

 

[Fedup]

If the lines were reversed then the lift would operate while the loader was being used and stop again when the spools return to neutral. I'm betting the sleeve is not there, and it's just a fitting. A power beyond sleeve is usually longer than what I see in the photo. Could be the "plumber" who put it all together wasn't all that sharp.

 

[Haytown Farm]

Just got home and opened up fitting at the power beyond port. Like you guys thought it seems to be wide open, no power beyond sleeve. Thank you so much for the advice! I spent hours this morning swapping lines, playing with that selector valve, going up to my neighbors barn to crawl under his tractor, I had no clue why everything was acting so weird. Going to order a new sleeve tonight, hopefully with that it will be good!

Had a mobile repair guy we had used for a couple things before make up the lines and fittings. I think he was in over his head, took 3 months and a lot of chasing him down to get it done. Power beyond plug was in a separate little box from the valve so I’m sure it’s lost in his truck or shop somewhere. Also noticed small leaks where the new lines meet the old hard lines for the loader. I’m going to call him tomorrow, should there be sealant on those threads?

 

[Haytown Farm]

I don’t know now, looked at the prince power beyond sleeve and I think that’s what’s in there. If I run the tractor with the power beyond hose off there is a steady stream of fluid out that port, like a garden hose. Is that how it should be, maybe this isn’t the problem?

 

[TheOldHokie]

I don’t know now, looked at the prince power beyond sleeve and I think that’s what’s in there. If I run the tractor with the power beyond hose off there is a steady stream of fluid out that port, like a garden hose. Is that how it should be, maybe this isn’t the problem?

You will get fluid out of the port with or without the sleeve. The difference is that with the sleeve the fluid is pressurized from the pump. Without the sleeve the port is also open to tank so there is no pressure. You can easily ID whats in the port by removing it. Some prince valves do not useca power beyond sleeve - just an internal plug in the bottom of the port. What is the model number of your valve?

Dan

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Take the big fitting on the left out of the valve body, that looks like a PB adapter to me.
If you take it out it will match the picture you posted.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Next to where we took the hydraulic feed on that manifold there is a valve that is turned with a straight screwdriver. Was originally to the left. There is only hydraulic flow to the loader valve when this is turned to the right and my neighbors tractor that we are copying is turned to the right. 3pt and auxiliary hydraulics don’t work in either the left or right position now. Any advice on what I’m doing wrong would be appreciated.

Looked at all your connections and they look right to me.
The only real possibility is that feed and PB could be swapped as I don't have documentation on which port is which.

If you turn the selector valve (slotted top valve) to the left does the three point and auxiliary valves work properly?

 

[TheOldHokie]

I reread your problem description:

We have that all setup matching his tractor. The loader valve functions fine but the auxiliary hydraulics and 3pt arms have no power. If I engage one of the loader valve functions then the auxiliary hydraulics will work, but only while the loader valve in engaged and it seems like they are fighting each other. The 3pt arms went up but won’t go down.

That sounds like you may have power beyond and tank return lines reversed. Check your hose routing.

Dan

 

[Haytown Farm]

Dan thank you for staying with me one this. The lines were mixed up! I thought the first thing I did was was trace the lines back, but they are all zip tied and tucked next to fuel tank so I missed it. So yes, like fedup said I had a bad plumber. All good now, just need to find a way to better rout that line when I get home from work, it has a hard 90 at a weird angle. Thank you guys so much!

Another thing I ran into, just fyi for anyone reading this. Once I got the lines right everything was working but the 3pt arms still wouldn’t go down. After some looking around, ended up being the flow control knob under the seat, I had turned it all the way closed when taking it off or putting the knob back on after removing the body panels.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Dan thank you for staying with me one this. The lines were mixed up! I thought the first thing I did was was trace the lines back, but they are all zip tied and tucked next to fuel tank so I missed it. So yes, like fedup said I had a bad plumber. All good now, just need to find a way to better rout that line when I get home from work, it has a hard 90 at a weird angle. Thank you guys so much!

Another thing I ran into, just fyi for anyone reading this. Once I got the lines right everything was working but the 3pt arms still wouldn’t go down. After some looking around, ended up being the flow control knob under the seat, I had turned it all the way closed when taking it off or putting the knob back on after removing the body panels.

Success is sweet!

Dan