L4310 HST shot sparks and wont start.

[sub subsistance farm]

Hello folks,
I recently got a new to me L4310 HST wit 1900 hours, for the most part it looks like it was babied all its life. I have put around 10 hours on it.

today i tore open the large compost pile with the FEL, and put a mess of sheep guts, etc in it.

I went to start the tractor back up, and it shot sparks either from the starter area of the alt, and i now no longer have power at the key, no lights, no dash warning lights with key on. Bat is charged. i tried to jump it as well.

i only know of the one fuse box on the left under the steering wheel.

Any advice on a good place to start would be great, i would love to put the pile back together before it gets cold, i will go try to cover it by hand best i can to keep the coyotes and dogs out, then try to get the tractor going again.

thanks!

Matthew

 

[85Hokie]

Sounds like a wire (starter) is somehow hitting a ground wire - could you have hit something that would push a hot wire towards a ground? AND only when you apply current to the starter would it show itself. Either that, or something inside the starter has crapped out.

Might have cooked the fusible link or cooked a wire in half - you will have to dig and see if there is a trail left behind.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Sound like you blew the fuse or fusible link down by the starter.
Usually if it blows that fuse you have a serious short.

 

[sub subsistance farm]

Thankyou guys, the fuse is good, and i have the 13 volts at its terminal.

everything has a fine coating of dust/dirt and nothing looks disturbed by anything, like a random branch etc... though i have really just been moving rocks and compost, and digging holes for footing with the backhoe for the past couple days, it has not seen brush, or rain, etc... i did bushhog a couple weeks ago.
nothing looks scorched.

Do you guys know where i could find a wire diagram?
it does not seem to be in the user manual, or the parts manual.

all of the connections look good, and again i don't see anything obvious...

 

[Diydave]

Wool, it sounds like ewe have a serious short. Time to start checking all exposed wires, once you have elambinated wires, ewe need to check if ewe have a baaad starter alternator, or even battery. I won't go on bleating any more, with your tractor in the dock, so to speak. Good night, maybe if ewe sheep er sleep on it, ewe will find the solution...

Oh, and welcome to the herd...

 

[sub subsistance farm]

Wool, it sounds like ewe have a serious short. Time to start checking all exposed wires, once you have elambinated wires, ewe need to check if ewe have a baaad starter alternator, or even battery. I won't go on bleating any more, with your tractor in the dock, so to speak. Good night, maybe if ewe sheep er sleep on it, ewe will find the solution...

Oh, and welcome to the herd...

cute
ewe know, there is mutton funny about this.

I was hoping to find a wiring diagram, but that seems to be a no go tonight, i have dredged the internet, and i guess i will need to call a dealer tomorrow and get a scan at the least, and at most buy the service manual i probably should have anyway.
perhaps i am asking too much, but seems like a wiring diagram should be in the users manual, or at least public domain...

can you blame me for not wanting to blindly trace wires with the thing parked in the dark in a pile of hot, half finished compost, etc...? The pile will just have to get cold, and i'll get to it tomorrow...

 

[Tooljunkie]

13 volt a battery is great. Same at large post on starter and using starter housing as ground? I bet not. Bet ground cable is bad.

 

[Grandad4]

I was hoping to find a wiring diagram, but that seems to be a no go tonight, i have dredged the internet, and i guess i will need to call a dealer tomorrow and get a scan at the least, and at most buy the service manual i probably should have anyway.

Let me know if you don't have any luck with the wiring diagram. I have a shop manual and maybe we could work out a way to get you an image.

However, I would think any problem that causes the sort of sparking you describe would be really obvious, with or without the wiring schematic. Unless there were some "backyard mechanic" type modifications, the wiring is all basic and readily accessible. My tractor is virtually the same as yours; the starter is right in plain sight once you pop open the side panels, and the battery cables, etc., are also accessible when you remove the headlight/nose shroud.

 

[1970cs]

The no dash lights worries me. I makes me think you have a poor connection which would explain both problems. I would go through the connections at the starter and make sure things are tight. UNHOOK battery first.

I would agree with a short or possible bad connection! I would unhook the battery and bench test the starter. If you have a good connection and engage the solenoid. If this is the short it will spark.

Pat

 

[sub subsistance farm]

The no dash lights worries me. I makes me think you have a poor connection which would explain both problems. I would go through the connections at the starter and make sure things are tight. UNHOOK battery first.

I would agree with a short or possible bad connection! I would unhook the battery and bench test the starter. If you have a good connection and engage the solenoid. If this is the short it will spark.

Pat

alright guys, i could of done more last night but it was the end of the day if you know what i mean, everything was covered in thick dust, or plastic conduit, on the newest mechanical thing i have ever owned (i guess i assumed it was going to be more complicated)...

So, we have just under 13 volts at battery, at starter, and at alternator.

We also have it at the hot wire to the ignition switch UNTIL i turn the key to on position.

with they key on and rapping and jiggling the switch i heard the glow plug try to start on a couple times, but it wont repeat it any more.

i will try shorting across the switch later when i can have time to trace wires more and figure out the switch. i cannot spend time on it now, but in a couple hours, i will get back to it.

thankyou guys!

 

[Grandad4]

If it was giving you a fireworks show, someplace there will be evidence of it... soot, melted contacts or wire, singed/melted insulation, burned smell... something like that. Have you found that yet? Until you find that, you're kinda working in the dark, so to speak.

 

[sub subsistance farm]

talked to the service fellow at MB tractor when i got home.
he mentioned using jumper cables to jump battery negative terminal to the engine to isolate if it was frame ground issue.

I suppose the engine to frame ground is common, as it was his first guess when i told him the whole issue.

i went out to try that, but for kicks thought about just trying to start it, and it started.

The bolts near the starter that bolt to the engine through the frame were loose, probably must have been that as everything seems to work fine, and i could find no evidence of scotching, melting, etc.

i will get the WSM at some point.

thanks guys.
back to work

 

[Diydave]

Glad ewe found out it was just a bad ground. At least the dealer didn't fleece ewe...