L3800 Known Starting Issue?

[CaveCreekRay]

So, I am in my dealer today buying some fuel filters...

The Service Manager overhears me ask the parts dude about a replacement seat switch and motions me into his office. He tells me they have learned of a defect in the wiring harness of the L3800. He is not too detailed (on purpose) but he says after a bunch of research and investigation, they have discovered a lone wire in the harness under the instrument bezel that is under gauge for the load, reportedly a relay. On some harnesses, this line starts to fry and the result is intermittent starting power to, I guess, the starter relay. He said they have to take the panel off and wire from (I assume) the switch block to the start relay engage terminal.

Anybody heard this? And when I asked if it was covered under the drive train warranty, he said, "Unfortunately, no."

Maybe Kubota quality isn't what we think it is...

There is also a known issue with the 3pt control valve. Some chatter as the lever is moved, bouncing the tractor pretty well.

Anyone have more details?

 

[Jim L.]

!?

Doesn't sound good.

 

[mickeyd]

I wonder if it is the same for the other L series tractors?
How many hours do you have on yours?

Anyone know where they post recalls?

 

[Burt]

So, I am in my dealer today buying some fuel filters...

The Service Manager overhears me ask the parts dude about a replacement seat switch and motions me into his office. He tells me they have learned of a defect in the wiring harness of the L3800. He is not too detailed (on purpose) but he says after a bunch of research and investigation, they have discovered a lone wire in the harness under the instrument bezel that is under gauge for the load, reportedly a relay. On some harnesses, this line starts to fry and the result is intermittent starting power to, I guess, the starter relay. He said they have to take the panel off and wire from (I assume) the switch block to the start relay engage terminal.

Anybody heard this? And when I asked if it was covered under the drive train warranty, he said, "Unfortunately, no."

Maybe Kubota quality isn't what we think it is...

There is also a known issue with the 3pt control valve. Some chatter as the lever is moved, bouncing the tractor pretty well.

Anyone have more details?

CaveCreek,

Yes, I do know about the control valve. If you research this site way back, you will find my saga. It did get solved and I posted the valve replacement number for the new one and the old one. Mine does not bounce any more and it was covered under warranty. Our tractor is the L3700SU allegedly the same as the L3800 and yet there could be some differences.

Our 3 pt was very bouncy and the dealer tried to tell me that it was normal and they all did that. Once he realized this was not my first rodeo and I was not going away, it all changed.

The bottom line was that I had to INSIST strongly on talking with the factory rep who eventually gave me the straight scoop. They do know about this issue.

Do bear in mind that these dealers do not want you to talk with their factory reps.

The wiring harness issue is a new one and I have not heard of it nor of any hard starting or not starting issues on this site yet. Try reaching the factory rep on this one if you can.

Maybe someone else has heard of it...anyone?

Burt

 

[ShaunRH]

Mistaking a load level over a period of time on a wire is an electrical engineer's 'oops'. Of course, the engineer's spec sheet may have been correct but a factory integration tech may have said "Hey, we're running the wire loom with 20ga for all those other runs, I think this one calling for 14ga is a mistake, I'll just correct that...". Welcome to recall central. This kind of garbage happens all the time and it's the left hand not talking to the right hand in a company.

If it's a known issue, Kubota should have issued a recall for it, and the dealers should be doing the repair for free. Kubota should foot the bill, it's their oops.

Now, if the issue is someone just laying on the starter and cranking and cranking and cranking, then the relay wire overheats, that's an abuse issue and not necessarily Kubota's. It means their engineer designed for intermittent full load capacity of a wire, and not 'continuous'. It's legit, but generally not recommended (knowing that some people will just lay into a starter forever, even though it destroys the starter.) They would have been better served to put all full gauge wire on it with a thermal breaker, but I didn't design the thing, so I don't know what was going on, maybe too much sake at lunch.

Regardless, I would tell the dealer, call Kubota, fix it, and I'm not paying a dime for it. They should put in a recall. If they gripe, take it up the food chain. Show them the posts her, show the bad 'press', you'll get it done.

 

[CaveCreekRay]

Mickey,

I have 170 hours on my L3800. Its been doing this off and on for the whole time I have owned it. Originally, I thought it was a bad alternator/battery but then replaced the battery and had the alternator tested. I have since moved on to the seat switch.

I cleaned the seat switch plug contacts as they seemed dirty. Came back a day later. The weird thing is, after a clacking start attempt, I bounce up and down in the seat a few times and the next start is OK. I am still thinking of changing the seat switch. All it takes is a floating speck of spooge to make a low-current contact. I'll double-check by bypassing the seat switch for a couple days to see if it reoccurs. Then, if it is still acting up, I'll get a hold of the regional guy.

I don't suppose you can get the regional rep phone numbers from Kubota Inc? Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Clearly, my dealer doesn't want me rocking the boat because they make 2 hours labor for each problem they get to see.

PS-I am also going to throw in a new set of starter contacts and make sure the starter solenoid is moving smoothly. If that action isn't consistent, you will get exactly what I am experiencing. The first start attempt will usually warm up the contacts and they expand a little, making the second contact better, no matter how many times you bounce the seat!!!

 

[Bluegill]

I have at least 170 hrs on my L3800 and never a problem.

The quality is just fine...

 

[avi8tor]

I may not know what I'm talking about, but I don't have to sit on the seat to crank my L2800. I don't see the seat switch being the problem. It may be a coincidence that it starts after you bounce on the seat. Bypassing the seat switch would help narrow the problem and eliminate the seat switch. It does however sound electrical related, possibly the starter solenoid or relay. I also think your dealer should cover it under warranty as it sounds like a defect and not something that you caused. Just my 2 cents.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[roadracer86]

I have at least 170 hrs on my L3800 and never a problem.

The quality is just fine...

That may be your experience blugill; I've got a 2012 L3800 with 208 hours with a leaking power steering box a month out of warranty. I've been talking with the dealer warranty person for 4 weeks now with no resolution or movement just efforts to stall and hope I go away.

Forget about talking to a factory rep; they seem to hide behind their anonymity. I've tried and all I get is his first name.

I also had the switch problem for the seat; mine would shut off when I stood up off the seat. I fixed it by bending the metal tab on the seat down a bit and adjusted the rocker switch on the HST pedal.

I haven't heard about a wire roast situation but if that's the case Kubota should issue a recall or at least a service campaign.

I work for an auto manufacturer who discusses, researches, and provides a toll free number for customer care for mechanical issues for their customers (not a domestic manufacturer) and uses that information to research and fix the problems going forward. Try to find a customer care number for Kubota! I'm beginning to think Kubota has other ideas on how to handle customer concerns.

Anyhow I lifted this off their global website; Code of Conduct.

1. Responding to Customer Requests and Complaints
***8226; When we receive requests or complaints from our customers, we place ourselves in their situation and respond promptly and accurately.
***8226; We work on customer requests and complaints to improve quality and avoid future customer dissatisfaction, and we also make appropriate disclosures of necessary information regarding serious quality problems.

http://www.kubota-global.net/c-data/conduct.html.

Doesn't seem to me like they are serious about their statements considering my recent experience.

 

[BeRad]

Mickey,

I have 170 hours on my L3800. Its been doing this off and on for the whole time I have owned it. Originally, I thought it was a bad alternator/battery but then replaced the battery and had the alternator tested. I have since moved on to the seat switch.

I cleaned the seat switch plug contacts as they seemed dirty. Came back a day later. The weird thing is, after a clacking start attempt, I bounce up and down in the seat a few times and the next start is OK. I am still thinking of changing the seat switch. All it takes is a floating speck of spooge to make a low-current contact. I'll double-check by bypassing the seat switch for a couple days to see if it reoccurs. Then, if it is still acting up, I'll get a hold of the regional guy.

I don't suppose you can get the regional rep phone numbers from Kubota Inc? Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Clearly, my dealer doesn't want me rocking the boat because they make 2 hours labor for each problem they get to see.

PS-I am also going to throw in a new set of starter contacts and make sure the starter solenoid is moving smoothly. If that action isn't consistent, you will get exactly what I am experiencing. The first start attempt will usually warm up the contacts and they expand a little, making the second contact better, no matter how many times you bounce the seat!!!

Hi CaveCreekRay,

I know this thread has been dead for a long time but did you figure out the issue? I bought a used L3800 and I'm having intermittent power problems. No glow plugs, no lights, no starter solenoid clicking. I tightened a loose negative battery cable and it started working again, thought I had it licked but then it came back.

 

[BigG]

Hi CaveCreekRay,

I know this thread has been dead for a long time but did you figure out the issue? I bought a used L3800 and I'm having intermittent power problems. No glow plugs, no lights, no starter solenoid clicking. I tightened a loose negative battery cable and it started working again, thought I had it licked but then it came back.

Replace the negative battery cable after you clean the terminals and the attachment point. It might help due to internal corrosion of the cable.

 

[Dave_eng]

Hi CaveCreekRay,

I know this thread has been dead for a long time but did you figure out the issue? I bought a used L3800 and I'm having intermittent power problems. No glow plugs, no lights, no starter solenoid clicking. I tightened a loose negative battery cable and it started working again, thought I had it licked but then it came back.

Did you remove the other end of the negative cable and clean where it attaches to the engine?

Dave

 

[lugbolt]

it's an old post but I've never heard of or seen a wiring "defect" on an L3800

plenty of hst neutral switches out of adjustment but never a defective harness, ever, and I worked on/sold them from the day they came out until present--and that may change soon as I'm eyeing a career change. Sick and tired of Kubota (and Deere as well) dictating what I (a tech) can and can't do even on my own time, among many other things

 

[BeRad]

I checked the hst switch, cleaned positive and negative terminals at the battery, tried to clean the negative terminal at the connection to the frame but snapped the bolt. I drilled a new hole and reconnected but still no juice. Initially, the negative battery terminal was loose at the battery so I tightened, it worked and I thought it was sorted. After another day, it started acting up again. Now I get nothing. Is internal cable corrosion a known issue?

 

[BigG]

I had a pickup that had an intermittent starting problem. After cleaning the connections, replacing the battery and the alternator I still had problems. Jumping the battery would not let the truck start until the right words were said and I stood on my left foot facing the northern lights. Replaced the negative cable after reading about the starting problem on a truck forum. Three years later I have not had a problem starting the truck since replacing the entire cable.

I did cut the cable open and the wires were intact but the green corrosion was under the insulation and did not show at either end of the cable.

If you buy the cable from the auto parts store it will be a few bucks. I did not think it would work but it did work for me.

 

[BeRad]

I had a pickup that had an intermittent starting problem. After cleaning the connections, replacing the battery and the alternator I still had problems. Jumping the battery would not let the truck start until the right words were said and I stood on my left foot facing the northern lights. Replaced the negative cable after reading about the starting problem on a truck forum. Three years later I have not had a problem starting the truck since replacing the entire cable.

I did cut the cable open and the wires were intact but the green corrosion was under the insulation and did not show at either end of the cable.

If you buy the cable from the auto parts store it will be a few bucks. I did not think it would work but it did work for me.

I’ll pick one up this morning and try it out. Thanks!

 

[whitetiger]

Is internal cable corrosion a known issue?

It has been a known issue for over 100 years now.

 

[BeRad]

I installed a new cable and...success! Thanks for the help. When I opened up the cable it didn’t look corroded at all. I suppose the connection between the frame and the cable was corroded enough to be the problem. Either way, it’s all cleaned up with a new cable, a freshly tapped and sanded connection to the frame and a larger bolt for more surface area to conduct through.

I’ve added dielectric grease to all the connection points. Does anyone have any other ideas to keep that shiny metal rust and corrosion free? I’m thinking of trying the NCP spray they sell at autozone.

 

[Russell King]

I’ve started using stainless steel bolt and flat washers. I put one washer underneath the terminal and another on top so it is sandwiched between the washers.

I don’t know how effective it works but have not been having trouble. I haven’t inspected the wiring either since I have started the method.

 

[BeRad]

I’ve started using stainless steel bolt and flat washers. I put one washer underneath the terminal and another on top so it is sandwiched between the washers.

I don’t know how effective it works but have not been having trouble. I haven’t inspected the wiring either since I have started the method.

I used stainless too, same method although the nut is welded to the bottom of the frame so no opportunity for a bottom washer.