L2501 with 250hours - ??Significant?? amount of metal on magnet

[coreyperez]

Hey all,

I just hit 250 hours and was doing my Hydro service. When I pulled my (I think return filter, right side, underneath foot rest) I found what I would consider a large amount of metal shavings (looks like manufacturing due to spirals). I figured this was due to being the initial filter change, but I then recalled I had it serviced at 50hrs and they replaced the filters (originals were painted).

I had also noticed my treadle pedal had become more "resistive" in the recent 20-30hrs. Anyway, below is a picture of what the filter magnet had on it. I also use filtermags and other photo shows the "slime" and some other smaller chips that probably got pushed past the filter when it went into bypass (I live in Alaska, it gets cold here).


Is this abnormal for 250hrs? I hope the pump isn't fragging on me!

Corey

 

[coreyperez]

Results of the (external) filtermag

 

[jimh406]

I don’t know, but that sure is worth asking about to me.

 

[lugbolt]

I've seen worse although it never makes me feel good about it. Those squiggly metal chips are from drilling holes--aka part of manufacturing processes. I guess they aren't able to get it all out at the factory.

 

[Motion]

That's something that will ruin a good night's sleep! Since you just changed the fluid and filters, I'd suggest purchasing new drain plugs (all) and related gasket rings, grind the surface to ensure good adhesion and use J&B weld to attach button magnets, then on the fly, swap out one at a time, then do the same treatment on the ones removed. Then going forward you can easily monitor at the different points. Of course keep the fluid at the correct level. And as always do as you feel is best

 

[nota4re]

If that was your first change, I might not be that concerned but if this is your second, hmmmmm. I would definitely make some notes, save the pictures, and share them with the dealer and ask them if you should bring it in. At least you will have everything on record in case something goes South in the future.

 

[coreyperez]

Thanks for the replies and suggestions.

I too feel that the chips and swirls look like manufacturing debris. I REALLY feel like they should have gotten that amount cleaned up during assembly, or else they need to improve their processes.

As far as adding magnets, I use filtermags (external rare earth magnets). the filters need to be cut apart to get the images from inside the canister.

This is the 2nd filter change (250hrs), I had the first one done at 50hrs by the dealer, they replaced the filters at that time (originally painted, replaced with standard factory, unpainted filters).

I did go in and talk with the VP of the dealership I purchased it from. He isn't into the technical side of stuff, but I sent him the photos and he will talk to service on Monday and get back with me.

I ran it for a couple hours (hot and hard) mowing Saturday and everything felt fine.

Lastly, I live in Alaska. I did use the tractor quite a bit more this past year than I had previously. It is entirely possible that I ran it hard/in the cold enough that the hydro fluid was thick enough to really "scour" the ports clean. I'm leaning towards pulling filters and sending in fluid samples to blackstone labs at the end of the mowing season this year. Just to see where thing are internally.

So, thanks again all! I'll try and remember to come back to this in the fall and will post the reply from the VP next week.

Thanks,

Corey

 

[nbryan]

Lastly, I live in Alaska. I did use the tractor quite a bit more this past year than I had previously. It is entirely possible that I ran it hard/in the cold enough that the hydro fluid was thick enough to really "scour" the ports clean.

Our Manitoba winters are pretty chilly too - not sure how things compare to your situation for temps, but being out working the blower hard for hours on end after a major snow event here for years when the temps usually fall and NW winds pick up after a storm, -20C to -25C range for a daytime high. I'm at 650 hours, after 4 winter seasons. The 50 hour and 200 hour services had NOTHING like that on the filters or anywhere in the drained oil after the 400 hour change either.
I also did not use any radiator cover or engine cowl cover to aid engine or hydraulic oil temperature maintenance at a higher temp, until the 3rd year, when I put a 6-mil poly sheet with a 4" hole in it over the radiator dust pre-screen, and added a bar to the temp gauge that way.
So IMO there's maybe more than working it hard in the cold going on there with all that muck and debris in the oil. My filters were almost spotless when they got changed!

 

[coreyperez]

Our Manitoba winters are pretty chilly too - not sure how things compare to your situation for temps, but being out working the blower hard for hours on end after a major snow event here for years when the temps usually fall and NW winds pick up after a storm, -20C to -25C range for a daytime high.

I have a tendency to run mine colder than that, depending on weather events. I have constantly ran mine at -30f (-35ish C).

None the less, awaiting to hear back from Kubota on the issue.

Corey

 

[ruger1980]

I know it does not look great but it is most likely not abnormal. Also I believe the filters do not have a bypass like the engine oil filter has.

 

[eserv]

I know it does not look great but it is most likely not abnormal. Also I believe the filters do not have a bypass like the engine oil filter has.

It looks like the filter is doing it's job!

 

[coreyperez]

It looks like the filter is doing it's job!

I just got a call from the Kubota dealer. They want me to bring it in and have the mechanics look it over. I figure for the 2 hours labor it is worth the piece of mind.

I've noticed this year that they HST whines a lot more than it did previous years, the HST treadle is very resistive when pushing forward on it, almost like it is "sticking" and then it moves forward (just short of a lurch). I honestly expected more problem free years from Kubota, but I'm going to see how this plays out. I did confirm that my L2501 is outside of warranty.

I hope to know more late next week.

Corey

 

[coreyperez]

Just a quick follow up.

The Mechanic called today and we discussed a few things. He is troubleshooting per Kubota's instructions. The local dealership has gone through a few software changes and they didn't have my service history. Luckily I had kept the 50hr service receipt. They were able to look up the notes based on the invoice.

The mechanic has drained the fluids and stuck magnets into the drain plugs and found nothing. He talked about what I felt was the issue (resistive pedal going forward & HST whine). I did mention to them that it was "low" on hydraulic fluid because I had pulled a sample, which I never sent off because I can't find my test kit for Blackstone Labs.

As it stands, he was going to do pressure test today and discuss with the lead mechanic and Kubota. He was hesitant to dig into the tractor (split cases, etc), but he said if that was the route "we" chose to go, he would probably start with the differential as that is where the suction pulls from.

I do use the Diff lock a lot due to snow work and side-hilling/ditches I mow.

Just an update.

Corey

 

[Thunder chicken]

For your piece of mind, here’s my filters from my M. Changed at 500 hours as per the manual. (It’s a geared transmission)
I send these to many mechanics and 2 dealerships, neither seemed alarmed. I did drain the oil and pulled the filters again at 550 hours just to see and they were basically clean.

 

[coreyperez]

Thunder Chicken:
I just threw up in my mouth a little... Holy crap...

So, I got my L2501 back. They (mechanics) worked with Kubota to diagnosis the problem. In the end the dealership decided that they don't think there was a problem. The instruction was to pull filters in 50 hours and see what has developed. I hope I don't see what your picture shows.

Thanks for sharing,

Corey