Kubota MX5100 Nightmare!

[R1pilot83]

Weeks later, 12,000 in repairs, flared tempers, and I picked up my Kubota MX5100 with the same issue as it has had from day one. Dropping off this tractor from the install shop to the engine builder was 6+ hrs driving each time. I had 12hrs + in Dropping it off and picking it up. The trips cost me well over 1000.00 in time and diesel. I bought this tractor used at 455hrs, who would of thought that it had issues like this. The previous owner just had the turbo replaced at M&R Kubota, new injectors, and a look over.

1. 463hrs. I paid for reman Kubota engine.
2. 465hrs. Took the engine back to the local shop that installed it as it still doesn't have power.
3. They call the engine builder and tell them about the issue.
4. I take the engine back to Orrville Ohio and they check it out.
5. Engine builder says that the injection pump barrel is out of spec and that the mechanic messed with the pump.
6. Shop that installed the engine says they didn't touch barrel. Tempers rise.
7. One on one with the shop in Orville, tech says that the turbo is also bad. Turbo has 105hrs on it. 4th turbo on the tractor in 465hrs.
8. Shop adjusts pump, replaced injectors, new turbo, and only charges me for the turbo. (I'm thankful)
9. I pick tractor up a week later, tractor will barely pull itself in medium range, loses 500rpm when the hydro is pushed down, tractor never recovers.
10. Shop says that the tractor has a hydro issue.

This hydro makes zero noise, doesn't seem to get hot etc.

Guys, I am losing my mind with this tractor. I am 30,000 into a tractor that is a boat anchor. I can't get any resolution, and no-one seems to know wtf is going on. I have replaced the 4x4 shaft bushing, clutch, engine, turbo, injectors, had the injection pump recalibrate, fuel tank cleaned, and who knows what else. The only issue at this time that I have found is, the brake on the right goes to the floor like nothing exists. The left brake is full, in good working order. The engine builder seems to think that I trashes a pump with the brake debris from the right hydro.

The professionals at two places are stumped.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

I would first address the brake issue as a seized brake is going to cause all the issues you state.
Then I would find a different shop to evaluate it.
It's not really hard to tell if the engine is running properly or not.
Heck make a video of it running and of you trying to move it and some of us can probably tell you what might or might not be happening.
Does it blow any smoke?
With everything they done, does it still lead the the same results in operation?
Have you jacked it up and make sure all the wheels spin freely?
Has anyone done and HST pressure test?
Have all the fluids and filters for the HST and hydraulic been changed?

 

[R1pilot83]

I would first address the brake issue as a seized brake is going to cause all the issues you state.
Then I would find a different shop to evaluate it.
It's not really hard to tell if the engine is running properly or not.
Heck make a video of it running and of you trying to move it and some of us can probably tell you what might or might not be happening.
Does it blow any smoke?
With everything they done, does it still lead the the same results in operation?
Have you jacked it up and make sure all the wheels spin freely?
Has anyone done and HST pressure test?
Have all the fluids and filters for the HST and hydraulic been changed?

It does not blow smoke as it's still in the break in process. The filters have all been changed. The 4x4 shaft seals and bushings have been replaced due to a leak that was going into the previous motors clutch housing. No-one has done a HST pressure test. I will get a video tomorrow of me running the tractor.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

I mean smoke wise, like black smoke out exhaust.
Like it's set too rich.
Make the video and post it on YouTube and give us a link to see it.

 

[GeoHorn]

First thing which popped into mind was same as Wolfman…. seized brake.

 

[MountainMeadows]

If a break was seized wouldn't you hear the hydro whine when attempting to move the tractor?

 

[hodge]

I read your post on facebook previously, and my suggestion was going to be to post it on OTT. Lots of experienced, smart people here. Welcome.
If you have the same issue with two different engines, your problem is elsewhere. I agree with Wolfman- clear up the brake issue. With such low hours, why is one brake not functioning? That is suspect.

 

[R1pilot83]

My thoughts exactly, Ive had a tractor deadheading due to the 3 point valve being stuck. The tractor squeeled like a pig and was blowing filters off the tractor. This tractor makes zero noise.

If a break was seized wouldn't you hear the hydro whine when attempting to move the tractor?

 

[R1pilot83]

I mean smoke wise, like black smoke out exhaust.
Like it's set too rich.
Make the video and post it on YouTube and give us a link to see it.

I will get a video up today. Thank you.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

If a break was seized wouldn't you hear the hydro whine when attempting to move the tractor?

Not necessarily, these are fickle beasts!

 

[GreensvilleJay]

OK, I'm real curious...
how does a stuck right brake make all those problems ?
If I hammer on my right brake, I just drive the tractor round and round to the right .....
so what am I missing in the picture ??

 

[lugbolt]

this sounds complicated.

I'd like to know what was bad about the turbo's, they don't usually fail UNLESS they ingest dirt or run out of oil and that in itself would also account for power loss if the engine is dusted. But turbo's are often replaced because of a few things. One, operator says engine ain't got no power, and everything else "checks out", so they deem it "bad"; not knowing if it really is. Most of them aren't. Two, they eat dirt and/or rags, towels, birds, whatever. Three, they don't check the charge air system for leakage and leakage WILL cause the turbocharger to overspeed sometimes resulting in spectacular damage, and the usual complaint=low power output and/or excessive exhaust black smoke.

So did they do a manifold pressure test? If so what was the outcome? Just questioning that out loud, not expecting an answer.

You bought it used. Based on what I am reading, it almost sounds as if there was a problem from the get-go and you're trying to fix someone else's problem child? Maybe I'm wrong?

the engine. When it was replaced what engine was it replaced with? There are several that "will fit" on that tractor. Are they OEM replacement engines from Kubota? Part numbers? Or are they remans? If remans, who are you getting them from? Rebuilds? If rebuilds, that opens up a whole other set of possibilities.

Just re-read. "Kubota reman". I've never once had any good experience with their reman anything, starters alternators engines etc. I always recommend new if that is an option but we are too far into this to go that route and I probably should not have mentioned it. You do know that the 'remans' are done by facilities that are simply contracted by kubota, and they have nothing to do with kubota, right? IOW, it may be some shade-tree shop in timbuktu doing it for all we know. Or it might not be. That is, the question. Who's doing it and who did what and what is different about it than new engines and why?

 

[fried1765]

this sounds complicated.

I'd like to know what was bad about the turbo's, they don't usually fail UNLESS they ingest dirt or run out of oil and that in itself would also account for power loss if the engine is dusted. But turbo's are often replaced because of a few things. One, operator says engine ain't got no power, and everything else "checks out", so they deem it "bad"; not knowing if it really is. Most of them aren't. Two, they eat dirt and/or rags, towels, birds, whatever. Three, they don't check the charge air system for leakage and leakage WILL cause the turbocharger to overspeed sometimes resulting in spectacular damage, and the usual complaint=low power output and/or excessive exhaust black smoke.

So did they do a manifold pressure test? If so what was the outcome? Just questioning that out loud, not expecting an answer.

You bought it used. Based on what I am reading, it almost sounds as if there was a problem from the get-go and you're trying to fix someone else's problem child? Maybe I'm wrong?

the engine. When it was replaced what engine was it replaced with? There are several that "will fit" on that tractor. Are they OEM replacement engines from Kubota? Part numbers? Or are they remans? If remans, who are you getting them from? Rebuilds? If rebuilds, that opens up a whole other set of possibilities.

Just re-read. "Kubota reman". I've never once had any good experience with their reman anything, starters alternators engines etc. I always recommend new if that is an option but we are too far into this to go that route and I probably should not have mentioned it. You do know that the 'remans' are done by facilities that are simply contracted by kubota, and they have nothing to do with kubota, right? IOW, it may be some shade-tree shop in timbuktu doing it for all we know. Or it might not be. That is, the question. Who's doing it and who did what and what is different about it than new engines and why?

Once upon a time, I bought a twin engine airplane with "reman engines",..... by a generic rebuilder.
They were okay, but I often kicked myself, and wondered......
What was I thinking?

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

OK, I'm real curious...
how does a stuck right brake make all those problems ?
If I hammer on my right brake, I just drive the tractor round and round to the right .....
so what am I missing in the picture ??

We are not saying that the brake is 100% the issue.
But the fact that the right brake pedal is dropping to the floor with nothing, could mean there is a lot more going on back there then should be.
Wouldn't be the first time that I've heard of brake linings clogging up the works!

 

[cthomas]

I remember having a customer with a Ford F-150(5.4 with 47K on it) that the customer and his neighbor checked out and decided it needed a transmission(customer supplied used transmission in the bed of the truck). I pulled the truck into the shop with a HELL of a misfire, I then called the customer stating with the truck running this poorly how did they determine the transmission was bad and do you want the shop to diagnose the misfire issue. Was told no and the only reason the shop was changing the transmission was the customer and his neighbor did not have a hoist. So, I installed his transmission and made sure everything I touched and replaced was correct. He stopped into the shop, paid the bill, and within 5 minutes he was back in the shop and was telling me I did something wrong replacing the transmission as the truck still would not shift. I then asked him if he wanted the shop to diagnose it and find the real issue. Found the Camshaft phaser had failed and also had excessive back pressure on the exhaust(plugged catalytic convertor)He was so pissed that he that he left with the truck to think it over(never did pay the diag. bill, but, I later installed the original transmission(the one that "failed" in an auction truck that I bought and that transmission was fine. If you find an issue(in your case brakes) fix that and see what else it resolves. On my LX2610 If I try to move it with the parking brake on it will bog the engine down and the HST makes very little noise while doing it. HTH's

 

[R1pilot83]

Once upon a time, I bought a twin engine airplane with "reman engines",..... by a generic rebuilder.
They were okay, but I often kicked myself, and wondered......
What was I thinking?

Thats no problem, you have a spare.

5000hrs in Twin Commanders AC50
1000hrs PIC 737-800
9000tt

 

[mikester]

Weeks later, 12,000 in repairs, flared tempers, and I picked up my Kubota MX5100 with the same issue as it has had from day one. Dropping off this tractor from the install shop to the engine builder was 6+ hrs driving each time. I had 12hrs + in Dropping it off and picking it up. The trips cost me well over 1000.00 in time and diesel. I bought this tractor used at 455hrs, who would of thought that it had issues like this. The previous owner just had the turbo replaced at M&R Kubota, new injectors, and a look over.

1. 463hrs. I paid for reman Kubota engine.
2. 465hrs. Took the engine back to the local shop that installed it as it still doesn't have power.
3. They call the engine builder and tell them about the issue.
4. I take the engine back to Orrville Ohio and they check it out.
5. Engine builder says that the injection pump barrel is out of spec and that the mechanic messed with the pump.
6. Shop that installed the engine says they didn't touch barrel. Tempers rise.
7. One on one with the shop in Orville, tech says that the turbo is also bad. Turbo has 105hrs on it. 4th turbo on the tractor in 465hrs.
8. Shop adjusts pump, replaced injectors, new turbo, and only charges me for the turbo. (I'm thankful)
9. I pick tractor up a week later, tractor will barely pull itself in medium range, loses 500rpm when the hydro is pushed down, tractor never recovers.
10. Shop says that the tractor has a hydro issue.

This hydro makes zero noise, doesn't seem to get hot etc.

Guys, I am losing my mind with this tractor. I am 30,000 into a tractor that is a boat anchor. I can't get any resolution, and no-one seems to know wtf is going on. I have replaced the 4x4 shaft bushing, clutch, engine, turbo, injectors, had the injection pump recalibrate, fuel tank cleaned, and who knows what else. The only issue at this time that I have found is, the brake on the right goes to the floor like nothing exists. The left brake is full, in good working order. The engine builder seems to think that I trashes a pump with the brake debris from the right hydro. View attachment 94805 The professionals at two places are stumped.

I'm stumped too.

I've tried reading this twice and I still don't have a clue what the rant is about other than the OP spent a lot of money on misc. repairs and has no description of a problem.

 

[fried1765]

Thats no problem, you have a spare.

5000hrs in Twin Commanders AC50
1000hrs PIC 737-800
9000tt

Deleted my off topic response to this off topic post!

 

[R1pilot83]

I'm stumped too.

I've tried reading this twice and I still don't have a clue what the rant is about other than the OP spent a lot of money on misc. repairs and has no description of a problem.

A lot of others seemed to get the issue. The tractor falls on its face when the hydro pedal is used.

 

[R1pilot83]

This hydro has never made noise before until I started it today in the cold. The hydro was screaming when I let the clutch pedal out. This system is deadheading somewhere.