John Deere three bottom turnover plow - at least 60 years old!!

[MountainMeadows]

There's nothing like a great project and the learning that goes along with it!

 

[mcmxi]

Reach out to the Plow Guy that you put the link in from. He may know of or have the coulters and brackets you need. He has been buying and selling used JD plows for years plus providing new parts he has had made. Really good guy and has done a lot of research on the various models.

Yes, I was thinking of doing that so I appreciate the reminder. I'll send him an email today. I've been taking screenshots of the 825 parts manual that John Deere has online. It's an invaluable resource.

Looking at the schematic below it's obvious that I don't have bracket #15 but could fabricate something fairly easily. Finding brackets #6, #10 and #12 will be a challenge, not to mention the complete coulters. I don't have to get everything wrapped up before I use it for the first time, but I'll certainly try.

 

[mcmxi]

I've never been a fan of the disposable society that we find ourselves in today, and I really enjoy the antithesis of that which is keeping old things running well ... myself included! There's something really cool about using a piece of equipment that was made before I was born, an implement that can do today what it did more than 60 years ago. It's one of the things that I like about firearms, and why I've never had a problem spending money on them since they don't decay the way that so much of today's disposable garbage does. All of these pseudo "woke" companies such as Apple bringing out new versions of their crap every year with forced obsolescence.

I plan on having the MX and M until the end, whenever that day comes for me, along with the implements I've bought over the years.

 

[mcmxi]

There's another John Deere 825 three bottom turnover plow for sale near me. I'm going to look at it tomorrow assuming that it hasn't already been sold. It appears to have four of the six coulters and maybe better (less worn) components. The landside wear pads and landside inner plates look be in better condition than mine which might mean that the frogs are in better condition too. It also has trash boards on each bottom. Worth a look I think.

 

[mcmxi]

I drove out to the farm this afternoon to look at the John Deere 835 plow that's on Craigslist. The seller was asking $2,500, and after a thorough inspection I offered $2k and we shook on it. I left $100 as a show of good faith and will be back over there tomorrow afternoon with a trailer and $1,900.

So why did I buy it? Well, after looking over the 825 which I still think was an awesome deal, I realized that many of the wear items could/should be replaced. I don't know how well the plow would work as is, but after pricing moldboards, shins, shares, inner and outer wear plates, and trashboards, which would be around $2k delivered, not to mention the missing coulters and brackets, I figure that between the two plows I can make one really good plow. Plus I'll have lots of spare parts that are very hard to find such as the vane cylinder and other parts. I'm not sure how much of the infrastructure is cross compatible, but all of the wear parts are the same so I'm already in a good spot.

There are some differences between the two. For example, the 835 uses shear bolts rather than the trip system that's on the 825, the wheels are much better on the 835, and there's considerably less wear of the frogs on the 835. In fact, all of the wear parts on the 835 are in excellent shape and in considerably better shape than the 825. The moldboard shown below is typical. They're almost knife sharp on the 825. All in all I think these two for a combined price of $3,200 is a great deal and no doubt they'll last me many, many years.

Running total: $3,275.90
John Deere 825 three bottom turnover plow - $1,200
Two new hoses with NPT and Pioneer fittings - $75.90
John Deere F835 three bottom turnover plow - $2,000

 

[S-G-R]

Not too bad dollar wise for the pair. We will need a video of it in action this fall.

 

[mcmxi]

Not too bad dollar wise for the pair. We will need a video of it in action this fall.

When you think of the cost of a new implement today I think it's incredible value for money to invest in rugged and proven older equipment. EA's 14" two-bottom plow with colters is almost $2,500. It's nowhere near as stout, isn't a turnover model, and only has two bottoms.

Other than finding (or fabricating) another pair of coulter brackets and coulters, and possibly replacing the existing coulters and bearings I should be good to go this September/October. I'll definitely post some videos and photos.

 

[D2Cat]

The coulters cut the sod/grass to make it easier to turn over. You may not even need them. Or find a scrapper who has some old pull type two bottom plows and get the coulters off off them. They clamp on, I think.

 

[leveraddict]

When you think of the cost of a new implement today I think it's incredible value for money to invest in rugged and proven older equipment. EA's 14" two-bottom plow with colters is almost $2,500. It's nowhere near as stout, isn't a turnover model, and only has two bottoms.

Other than finding (or fabricating) another pair of coulter brackets and coulters, and possibly replacing the existing coulters and bearings I should be good to go this September/October. I'll definitely post some videos and photos.

I have EA's one bottom for sub compact tractors. They are near $1300 with all the goodies! I lucked out and found one on craigslist. It was never used. $900. You got a deal!

 

[GreensvilleJay]

re: coulters
My first veggie plot ( 1/3 acre) was turned over using a friends Ford with 7' cultivators on it. Yes, it took a lot of passes, but the lawn was transformed form a huge lawn into a garden over a long weekend.
Since then I planted 'winter rye' and a 3 furrow plow easily turned over the field every spring
If you 'shine up' the moldboards and adjust the plow right, it should dig right in and fold over the sod just fine. The 'fun' is getting nice ,even straight, parallel furrows !

 

[Tx Jim]

Nice plows. Which type standards do each have (shear bolt or safety trip)? F835 should be shear bolt standards

 

[mcmxi]

Nice plows. Which type standards do each have (shear bolt or safety trip)? F835 should be shear bolt standards

The 825 has the safety trips whereas the F835 has shear bolts. To be honest, I don't know how much of the two plows are interchangeable beyond the wear items. If the hydraulic vane cylinders are the same that would be great because those can't be easy to find.

Once I get the 835 home I can start to figure out which one I want to build up to use this fall. I like the idea of the safety trips on the 825 so my thought at the moment is to try to get that one complete.

 

[mcmxi]

I have EA's one bottom for sub compact tractors. They are near $1300 with all the goodies! I lucked out and found one on craigslist. It was never used. $900. You got a deal!

I agree. Both of these plows are 16" models and the steel in them is impressive. The fact that they're turnover models is even better. Consider that a new Kuhn 3-bottom turnover plow is $28,000, and how much better could it be? Like I said, this is money well spent and it's unlikely that I'll need to put any significant amount of money into this plowing venture for the next 20 years. I'm not going to wear out the steel plowing 10 acres once or twice a year.

 

[Tx Jim]

The rotator vanes are the same part # (F1697R @ $17.02) that are utilized in JD 2 cylinder tractors with option of factory power steering. Other similar 2 cylinder power steering parts are identical on these plows

https://partscatalog.deere.com/jdrc/sidebyside/equipment/81691/referrer/navigation/pgId/56988

 

[mcmxi]

The rotator vanes are the same part # (F1697R @ $17.02) that are utilized in JD 2 cylinder tractors with option of factory power steering. Other similar 2 cylinder power steering parts are identical on these plows

https://partscatalog.deere.com/jdrc/sidebyside/equipment/81691/referrer/navigation/pgId/56988

The John Deere website has the manuals for both plows but you can't download them. Last night I spent about an hour using the zoom tool, print screen, paste to Photoshop, cut, paste again etc., to put together two pdf files for each plow. It was a pain in the butt, but worth it.

I've been looking at cross compatibility, and the hydraulic vane cylinders and associated parts are the same so that's good.

Here's the 825A schematic

and the F835 schematic

 

[mcmxi]

The front coulter shanks and brackets are the same for both the 825A and F835 so that's another plus, and the discs themselves are interchangeable, but that's where the factory coulter compatibility ends in terms of brackets and shanks. I'm still on the lookout for coulters and brackets, and another trip to St. Ignatius is in the cards. They have a lot of parts down there and now that I have a better idea of what I'm looking at I can most likely figure out an elegant solution.

The manuals don't show any of the ground engaging wear parts so I can't tell if the frogs can be switched around. In case this term isn't familiar to some, the frog is the large piece of steel that bolts to the standards, and to which most if not all of the wear parts connect to, such as the moldboard, shin, landside wear plates, shares etc. The frog is shown below as part #1 in the top illustration and it bolts to part #15 or #16 in the bottom schematic.

The question is whether or not the holes of both sets of frogs are in the same location. If they are, then I will have the option to move them around since the frogs on the 825A are considerably more worn than on the F835.

 

[mcmxi]

I hope this thread is proving to be interesting and informative. I enjoy this stuff as well as the learning curve, so bear with me as I go from a complete plowing novice to being capable of doing a consistently good job on my friend's field.

The ultimate goal here is to end up with a really nice 10+ acre field of clover, sunflowers, grass, a combination, or something entirely different. This plow is just a way for me (and a couple of friends) to learn something new, have some fun and ultimately get to enjoy our tractors even more. This is not an historically accurate restoration thread, so to all those John Deere enthusiasts who will have a seizure when they see a bright orange Frankenstein of an 825A/F835 plow behind an M6060 I suggest you tune out early in the process.

 

[mcmxi]

I picked the F835 up today and got it home without incident. It's way bigger than the 825, being 10" wider and 10" taller, but interestingly it's set up as a 3x14" rather than a 3x16" like the 825. These plows can be configured for either set up but I think I'd need some parts to change them around.

The frogs are interchangeable, but it wouldn't do me much good to move the 14" moldboards and associated hardware over to the 825 unless I reconfigure it to be a 3x14". I think it would be a sweet set up to get the 825 configured that way but I have to do some more investigation and study the schematics. I'm sure I could make up the brackets to do the switch. The 825 has the safety-trip standards which I like over the shear bolt standards on the 835.

The guy that I bought this plow from purchased it about seven years ago but never used it. He has a neighbor farm his property and they split the profits. That explains why he didn't know much about it.

 

[Tx Jim]

Do you realize moldboard plow bottoms are listed in a separate parts catalog # PC1308?

 

[mcmxi]

Do you realize moldboard plow bottoms are listed in a separate parts catalog # PC1308?

No, I hadn't realized that but thanks very much for pointing it out. I'll try to find that.

After pouring over the parts manuals for both plows, it's not a simple task to switch the 825 from 3x16" to 3x14" since it requires the parts highlighted in orange to be changed over. I would either have to source those alternative 14" brackets or fabricate them and it's not worth the effort and cost at this time.

My plan now is to sort out the coulters on the F835 by replacing some of the discs/bearings and either sourcing a set for the second row of bottoms or Frankensteining (should be a verb) something so that I can run the plow this fall. In some ways this is working out for the best since the Kubota M6060 manual lists a 3x14" as being the maximum rated plow size for the tractor, and it'd be a lot less work for me since I wouldn't need to move parts back and forth. I'll flush out the vane cylinder and move the new hoses from the 825 to the 835 and get started on going through it. The standards and many bolts are likely frozen in place so those will need to be addressed.

Arguably the 835 is a better plow than the 825, not only in terms of the condition as I bought them with the 835 being far more complete, but also the design. I would have preferred safety-trip standards but I will live with shear bolts for the time being. The shear bolt system is definitely a simpler design, and if I don't break a bolt this fall I'll probably be lauding shear bolts over safety-trips.

The journey continues.