Crossed injector wire on 9960
- Thread starter Kubota9969
- Start date
Engine has 3500 hours
I use this tractor for a living. I keep up on all the maintenance
All my tractors are maintained where they are all leak and are stored inside.
I try to replace things before it breaks because I cannot afford to be broke down in my peak season
I use this tractor for a living. I keep up on all the maintenance
All my tractors are maintained where they are all leak and are stored inside.
I try to replace things before it breaks because I cannot afford to be broke down in my peak season
North Idaho Wolfman
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Equipment
L3450DT-GST, Woods FEL, B7100 HSD, FEL, 60" SB, 743 Bobcat with V2203, and more
How far did they tear the motor down?
And has it been put back together?
Do you have exact compression numbers or did they just say in the 300 range?
They have it torn down to the heads and has not been put back together.
They said the pistons have slop in them but would the pistons be wore out and still have compression and it drove just fine to my shop beforehand.
They didn’t give me the exact compression number they just said all cylinders are at 300
Before tearing it down, it would have been nice if they did a leakdown test to better determine if the leakage was through the valves, between cylinders (head gasket) or past rings.
What is the plan forward?
At this point in time it's almost irrelevant how compression became below spec. The short term focus needs to be in determining what it's going to take to restore compression and get the tractor back up and running.
I'd be a bit upset if they tore down the engine without some type of prior approval, but that doesn't help in getting the tractor functional again.
What is the plan forward?
At this point in time it's almost irrelevant how compression became below spec. The short term focus needs to be in determining what it's going to take to restore compression and get the tractor back up and running.
I'd be a bit upset if they tore down the engine without some type of prior approval, but that doesn't help in getting the tractor functional again.
I kind of surmised it wasn't new from the get go. Interesting yours leak. Neither of mine do and I have basically the same engine in both mine that you do minus the emissions junk and one less valve. 4000 on one and 2000 on the other and neither leak and I farm with mine so they get worked.
Well, I do have a front timing case seal weeping but that will be addressed shortly.
Something went seriously wrong internally. Is it at a dealer or some shade tree mechanic place?
Myself, I cannot get it to add up. Something is missing somewhere.
I'll keep reading along....
This tractor is at a Kubota dealer.
I understand the compression is low but I have talked to several diesel mechanics around my area and they all say 300 is low but it should still run.
They did not have my approval to tear into the motor and they know that. They are going to cover all the labor and to put it back together which I think they should.
Whatever the problem may be if it did lose compression. I still don’t understand how switching the wires around on one injector could cause all these problems when this tractor drove perfect fine down the highway 10 miles and into my shop right before my guys started to change the valve cover gasket. We did not tear into the motor or mess with any timing the only thing was two wires were put on backwards.
How could one injector with the wires flipped cause low compression which isn’t the best compression but it’s there? And the cylinder pressure is equal across all 4 cylinders. I just can’t comprehend how just two wires caused all of this
I understand the compression is low but I have talked to several diesel mechanics around my area and they all say 300 is low but it should still run.
They did not have my approval to tear into the motor and they know that. They are going to cover all the labor and to put it back together which I think they should.
Whatever the problem may be if it did lose compression. I still don’t understand how switching the wires around on one injector could cause all these problems when this tractor drove perfect fine down the highway 10 miles and into my shop right before my guys started to change the valve cover gasket. We did not tear into the motor or mess with any timing the only thing was two wires were put on backwards.
How could one injector with the wires flipped cause low compression which isn’t the best compression but it’s there? And the cylinder pressure is equal across all 4 cylinders. I just can’t comprehend how just two wires caused all of this
frankly, neither can I. Something else is wonky, very wonky.
Interestingly, when one of mine goes to the dealer for work (rarely), I give the head tech a sheet of what I want addressed and if there is anything else he finds, I get a call and have to give my okay before it's done, no exceptions.
Never drove mine to the dealer, they pick up and deliver, no charge. Besides, take me a couple hours to get there. 45 miles from the farm.
Like I said, something don't add up.
Interestingly, when one of mine goes to the dealer for work (rarely), I give the head tech a sheet of what I want addressed and if there is anything else he finds, I get a call and have to give my okay before it's done, no exceptions.
Never drove mine to the dealer, they pick up and deliver, no charge. Besides, take me a couple hours to get there. 45 miles from the farm.
Like I said, something don't add up.
Maybe the crossed wires did not cause the low compression, but did fry something in the CPU to prevent it from starting.
I'm actually surprised the electrical connections are not designed to prevent reverse installation, especially if it can cause damage.
While the head is off, it might be worth negotiating checking it for cracks or any other possible checks/fixes before reinstalling... Just thinking there are plenty of hours on the machine and it might make sense to take advantage of the situation.
I'm actually surprised the electrical connections are not designed to prevent reverse installation, especially if it can cause damage.
While the head is off, it might be worth negotiating checking it for cracks or any other possible checks/fixes before reinstalling... Just thinking there are plenty of hours on the machine and it might make sense to take advantage of the situation.
In as much as it is basically the same engine I have in my 2 M's minus the electronic and emissions junk, the physical engine itself should go at least 6000 hours with nothing other than routine maintenance and valve adjustments... So long as it was properly maintained from the get go... and much longer with proper care. I fully expect both mine to outlast me. Why I bought them in the first place.
North Idaho Wolfman
Moderator
Staff member
Lifetime Member
Equipment
L3450DT-GST, Woods FEL, B7100 HSD, FEL, 60" SB, 743 Bobcat with V2203, and more
I seriously doubt that swapping the direction of the wires did anything adverse except maybe trip the computer, as looking at all the specs on the injectors they do not appear to be polarized.
Even if they are there are safeties in place to protect system components in the event of component failures.
The dealer not documenting the exact compression numbers is seriously questionable as there is a huge difference between 300 psi and 399 psi!
Did they do any other troubleshooting before they tore it down, and why would they jump to that?
I know it's a hard thing to do, but I would get another opinion considering the dealer isn't giving you concrete numbers, and did some serious tear down without authorization, I would be furious!
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Maybe it didn’t seem important or was missed in the general discussion but you did not answer my previous question: When your “guys” were inside that valve-cover are you certain they did not mess with head bolts/studs?
If they were re-torqued or adjusted in any way it could have blown a head gasket.
None of your “guys” are unhappy employees, are they?
I have said we did nothing but take the valve covers off. Did not mess with any adjustments. Just took valve cover off and took injector wires off and flipped one injector wire that’s it. We did not mess with anything mechanical with the engine.
And my guys work with me because they want to and enjoy the work environment we are in
Due to the fact that I served 13 yrs as a farm equip. dealer service manager I find it difficult to believe the dealership technician disassembled the engine without the ""tractor owners prior approval"" unless this engine disassembly(repair) would be covered under the tractor warranty
They did not ask for approval and the manger there admitted it. So they said they were going to cover all the labor they have in it and going to cover the cost of putting it back together.
It sounds like some of y’all have good Kubota Dealerships next to y’all. The ones around me will sell you a tractor in a heartbeat but the service side is pretty poor. I have had good luck with my Kubota but for the service being so poor I will probably never buy one again
I’m watching this thread with interest.
Here’s what we know.
1 The engine only has 2500 hrs, shouldn’t have much wear.
2 The dealer says the engine is trashed with only 300psi in all cylinders. Cylinders are loose.
3 It was running fine before a valve cover gasket change.
4 After reassembly from valve cover gasket change, it was run for 5 seconds with cylinder 3 injector wired backwards. Smoke came out the intake.
Everyone wants to know how the engine got trashed.
No one has an explanation as to why running for 5 seconds with one injector wired backwards can trash the engine. A suggestion was made that maybe it caused hydro lock. But doesn’t seem to me an injector would inject enough fuel to hydro lock, that’s a lot of fuel. And doesn’t seem possible to affect all cylinders.
If the engine was trash before the gasket change, it seems like at 300 psi it would have been obvious it was way down on power and something was wrong. The owner said it was running fine.
The owner is certain that nothing else was done to the engine before taking it to the dealer other than gasket change and running for 5 sec with reversed injector wire.
Total mystery.
What does the dealer mean when he says the cyclers are loose, pistons worn out, cylinder sleeves, rod connection worn? How can that can’t happen in 5 seconds?
Am I missing anything?
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Here’s what we know.
1 The engine only has 2500 hrs, shouldn’t have much wear.
2 The dealer says the engine is trashed with only 300psi in all cylinders. Cylinders are loose.
3 It was running fine before a valve cover gasket change.
4 After reassembly from valve cover gasket change, it was run for 5 seconds with cylinder 3 injector wired backwards. Smoke came out the intake.
Everyone wants to know how the engine got trashed.
No one has an explanation as to why running for 5 seconds with one injector wired backwards can trash the engine. A suggestion was made that maybe it caused hydro lock. But doesn’t seem to me an injector would inject enough fuel to hydro lock, that’s a lot of fuel. And doesn’t seem possible to affect all cylinders.
If the engine was trash before the gasket change, it seems like at 300 psi it would have been obvious it was way down on power and something was wrong. The owner said it was running fine.
The owner is certain that nothing else was done to the engine before taking it to the dealer other than gasket change and running for 5 sec with reversed injector wire.
Total mystery.
What does the dealer mean when he says the cyclers are loose, pistons worn out, cylinder sleeves, rod connection worn? How can that can’t happen in 5 seconds?
Am I missing anything?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
I'm not familiar with that tractor or engine, but was the air intake opened up to remove the valve cover?
If so, was a rag possibly stuffed in the intake to keep any debris out, and forgotten?
IF, what the OP has related is true, sounds like the dealer is trying to screw him over to make some money off him.
The saga continues...
If so, was a rag possibly stuffed in the intake to keep any debris out, and forgotten?
IF, what the OP has related is true, sounds like the dealer is trying to screw him over to make some money off him.
The saga continues...
No sir you have everything right.
I am driving to the Kubota dealer today and going to talk to this mechanic face to face because he seems to not to want to talk to me on the phone.
I don’t want to be rude to the mechanic but I think there’s going to be some tension because I don’t see how this motor is trashed. I think this mechanic is trying to find a easy way out