Clutch Failure

[kajnjim]

I have an L3301 purchased last March. Clutch failed in less than 5 hours. Took it back to dealer and after alot of back and forth between them and Kubota, Kubota agreed to pay for warranty repair. (dealer never divulged what the repair was specifically) Shortly thereafter (not sure exact hours) it started failing again and they “adjusted” the clutch. Failed again at 100 hours. Took it back to the dealer and of course I got the “wearable item not covered by warranty” response from them and the Kubota service rep who happened to be visiting while the tractor was there. I expressed my opinion to them that something has to be causing it to wear out prematurely. I explained to them that the tractor I owned previous to this one ran for 16 years before the clutch wore out, so their argument that I was operating the tractor improperly had no validity and the problem has to be something mechanical with the tractor. Their only response was to give me a $4080 quote to repair again. I am curious if anyone here may have had the same problem and were successful with having Kubota make good concerning the situation and if so, what steps were taken to get it resolved.

 

[jaxs]

Surely there's more to it than what you have said here.

Is all these statements correct?
It is a 2022 or earlier build that was sold to you as new with Kubota's customary warranty in March of 2023.
It is not used for commercial purposes.
You did not buy extended warranty.

In addition to above;
What reason did dealer give you that it was neccassary to "go back and forth" with Kubota when clutch failed at 5 hours?
I don't have copies of warranties but I've heard warranty terms are different for each model/series. Does your copy say that clutch is covered? Did dealer and rep say outright they feel failure was caused by operator error?

 

[kajnjim]

Surely there's more to it than what you have said here.

Is all these statements correct?
It is a 2022 or earlier build that was sold to you as new with Kubota's customary warranty in March of 2023.
It is not used for commercial purposes.
You did not buy extended warranty.

In addition to above;
What reason did dealer give you that it was neccassary to "go back and forth" with Kubota when clutch failed at 5 hours?
I don't have copies of warranties but I've heard warranty terms are different for each model/series. Does your copy say that clutch is covered? Did dealer and rep say outright they feel failure was caused by operator error?

The first 3 statements are correct (haven’t confirmed manufacture date, but assume you are correct. As for the 4th statement, I was not made aware of the reasoning it took so long and required so much effort on the dealer’s part to have Kubota approve the repair. Clutch is not covered as it is a “wearable” component. The Kubota customer service rep I spoke to on the phone read to me the dealer’s report from the initial repair that actually stated that damage could have been caused by improper usage by owner.

 

[jaxs]

IDK what the wording is but exclusion of "wearable component" sounds like a get out of jail free card for Kubota. I'm troubled by the fact you didn't receive a copy of same report rep read to you on phone. Too many unanswered questions to form opinion with any degree of conviction but one possibility comes to mind and it's wilder and wagerer than a wag. "IF" this dealer makes a habit of milking corporate the delay at 5 hours might be attributed to dealer concocting something to pad bill and had a hard time getting corporate to swallow it. That would account for you not getting a report. That could be a poison pill when and if a second failure occurred ,which it has. Let's say something was bent, or mounted wrong that makes proper adjustment difficult or impossible to maintain. If dealer wasn't sharp enough to catch it,split tractor and found clutch in perfect condition ,they aren't going to admit the oversite so they bill for new clutch to avoid eating labor. Looking at it from corporate's position , they aren't going to pay for a second clutch after only a few hours. Considering ambiguity of warranty, another possibility is that after a warranty repair responsibility shifts to dealer going forward. I realize that sounds like condemning the dealer without facts to go on but I think we can agree there's a gentleman with questionable ancestors hiding in the barn here so dealer is as good of suspect as any. Pending input from those who have read warranty on their new tractors ,you very well may have to get a second dealer involved on your dime. What I'm saying is corporate might agree to revisit if a second dealer finds something dramatically different but you must up front money until that proves out. Let me reiterate I have no experience with Kubota warranty and what I've said is food for thought,NOT something to act on. You are correct in conferring with experienced owners that might offer ways to get audience with corporate.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

IDK what the wording is but exclusion of "wearable component" sounds like a get out of jail free card for Kubota. I'm troubled by the fact you didn't receive a copy of same report rep read to you on phone. Too many unanswered questions to form opinion with any degree of conviction but one possibility comes to mind and it's wilder and wagerer than a wag. "IF" this dealer makes a habit of milking corporate the delay at 5 hours might be attributed to dealer concocting something to pad bill and had a hard time getting corporate to swallow it. That would account for you not getting a report. That could be a poison pill when and if a second failure occurred ,which it has. Let's say something was bent, or mounted wrong that makes proper adjustment difficult or impossible to maintain. If dealer wasn't sharp enough to catch it,split tractor and found clutch in perfect condition ,they aren't going to admit the oversite so they bill for new clutch to avoid eating labor. Looking at it from corporate's position , they aren't going to pay for a second clutch after only a few hours. Considering ambiguity of warranty, another possibility is that after a warranty repair responsibility shifts to dealer going forward. I realize that sounds like condemning the dealer without facts to go on but I think we can agree there's a gentleman with questionable ancestors hiding in the barn here so dealer is as good of suspect as any. Pending input from those who have read warranty on their new tractors ,you very well may have to get a second dealer involved on your dime. What I'm saying is corporate might agree to revisit if a second dealer finds something dramatically different but you must up front money until that proves out. Let me reiterate I have no experience with Kubota warranty and what I've said is food for thought,NOT something to act on. You are correct in conferring with experienced owners that might offer ways to get audience with corporate.

Hitting the enter key every now and then, and breaking up your thoughts a little, would make it a much easier read.

 

[GrizBota]

Two clutches in 100 hour and the first one lasted 5 hours? If it’s not user error (which I presuming it is not), it just about has to be something’s not right with the clutch.

I think the only time I use the clutch on my HST L is when I start it. Oh, and when it’s not moving with the engine running and I change L/M/H range. I’ll bet the clutch is actually only being used about less than one half of one percent of the time.

 

[TheOldHokie]

The first 3 statements are correct (haven’t confirmed manufacture date, but assume you are correct. As for the 4th statement, I was not made aware of the reasoning it took so long and required so much effort on the dealer’s part to have Kubota approve the repair. Clutch is not covered as it is a “wearable” component. The Kubota customer service rep I spoke to on the phone read to me the dealer’s report from the initial repair that actually stated that damage could have been caused by improper usage by owner.

Wear items like brakes and clutches are excluded items in most OEM warranties.

That said you seem to be experiencing unusuially short clutch life. Is this an HST or gear drive machine?

Dan

 

[mikester]

After 40+ years and tens of thousands of hours and a million miles driven I've only had to replace a clutch on one dump truck after the clutch seized on after the truck was sitting 6 months over winter. I've owned cars, tractors, trucks, motorcycles, heavy equipment all with clutches.

Since the op managed to replace a previous tractor clutch after 16 years and two more on a new machine I suspect an operator problem. There could be an issue on the new machine. IMHO odds are its an operator issue like the OP drives constantly with both feet. Are you one of those car drivers that manage to drive with their brake lights on while going up hill?

Some people manage to break everything they touch and it's always someone elses fault.

 

[GeoHorn]

JAXS’s comments mirror an experience my family had with a new car back in the mid-70’s.

Father-in-Law bought a new car with Goodyear Tires. Tires were “wear” items not covered by vehicle mfr’s warranty….. (tire and batts covered by individual maker’s warranty).

Two tires began to shed their tread/belts in only 400 miles. FIL took it back to the selling-Dealer who installed two new tires.
Five month’s later…at only 1200 miles…. the other two tires shed their belts. FIL goes back to the dealer….who refuses to provide further warranty…… Quoting the “Wear Items” clause in the vehicle-warranty.

BUT…. FIL has a close neighbor and friend who is a Goodyear Store Manager…. Who suggests FIL bring the car to his Store. FIL does so….and the Goodyear Tire Store replaces All-Four ….. and FIL is now happy.

One week later… Good Neighbor reports to FIL that …HE, the Goodyear Tire Store Manager…. is having to EAT THOSE FOUR TIRES…!
WHY?
Because the selling Dealer…when he replaced the first Two Failed Tires….. ACTUALLY submitted a Claim to Goodyear via General Motors for FIVE NEW TIRES.…..(including the Full-Sized Spare in the Trunk!)

Therefore, from Goodyears Point of View…. THAT car had Already enjoyed a FULL REPLACEMENT SET of tires! The Selling Dealer was stealing from Goodyear.


Another Example I witnessed as a new Toyota-Dealer mechanic in the early ‘70s:
The Problem from BATT/TIRE….”wear items”…. mfr’rs point-of-view is that the BATT/TIRE have no control over the storage-conditions of new cars. A vehicle moved on the dealer lot and left with the Dome-Light “on”…will deeply discharge a new battery causing internal damage….k

The Service Dept (me) re-charged that battery using the shop-floor charger….and returned the car to the Lot. It was sold the following week.

The new owner who experienced a batt which won’t recharge or hold a charge…. and was accused of having left “something” …. “on”…. And the dealer refused to warranty that battery.

Exasperated… the new owner ordered a new battery…. which the Service Dept …(me)…. installed.
I RECOGNIZED that car!… as the one I’d recharged the battery the previous week due to our “make ready“ dept-worker had left the Dome Light “on”.

I informed the new owner. New Owner rages with the General Manager…and got the Invoice Cancelled for the new battery.

I got fired (next day) for conversing Directly with the Customer…. instead of only with my Service Writer/Mgr.

(Got a new job same afternoon at a competing Toyota Dealership closer to home.)

addendum: I’m not saying the Kubota dealer is crooked…. but only that clerical errors…or misbehavior…is possible. @kajnjim Don’t Give Up. Good luck!

 

[fried1765]

Hitting the enter key every now and then, and breaking up your thoughts a little, would make it a much easier read.

Yup....in grade school that was called "paragraphing"!

 

[lugbolt]

I have an L3301 purchased last March. Clutch failed in less than 5 hours. Took it back to dealer and after alot of back and forth between them and Kubota, Kubota agreed to pay for warranty repair. (dealer never divulged what the repair was specifically) Shortly thereafter (not sure exact hours) it started failing again and they “adjusted” the clutch. Failed again at 100 hours. Took it back to the dealer and of course I got the “wearable item not covered by warranty” response from them and the Kubota service rep who happened to be visiting while the tractor was there. I expressed my opinion to them that something has to be causing it to wear out prematurely. I explained to them that the tractor I owned previous to this one ran for 16 years before the clutch wore out, so their argument that I was operating the tractor improperly had no validity and the problem has to be something mechanical with the tractor. Their only response was to give me a $4080 quote to repair again. I am curious if anyone here may have had the same problem and were successful with having Kubota make good concerning the situation and if so, what steps were taken to get it resolved.

I've done my share of clutches, some real low hour units.

In every one of them, they had a loader on them, and they are/were gear-drive tractors. I only put 2 clutches in HST tractors in 30 years (or just shy of 30...close enough). And HST clutches are dirt cheap in comparison (usually) to the dual stage DT clutches used in the 3901's and such.

"Something is causing the clutch to fail". Well, yes, there is always a "something". What is it? That-is the question.

I'm not pointing a finger here (yet) because I have not seen YOUR clutch or your tractor. With that said, the VAST majority of clutch failures on these DT tractors is due to riding the clutch while pushing the loader bucket into a pile of dirt/gravel/etc or using the clutch to pull trailers or slipping it excessively in stops and starts (such as directional changes) or using the clutch to vary the speed and torque to the wheels while trying to pull things, rocks, vehicles, trees, logs, other tractors, bulldozers, OR sometimes I saw where the user was using their DT tractor to push trees and such, slipping the clutch the whole time.

Those are just the things I knew of, I'm sure there were other instances that I didn't know about. Owner never tells you this stuff UNTIL they get their way, or maybe on a forum or group.

Clutches do not fail unless slippage happens. The question is, why is it slipping? Is this user-related, or is there another problem? If there's another problem, it's almost always obvious. Fork lever sticking in the bellhousing is an easy one, and generally if that's the case, you can barely push the clutch pedal down and it will barely return itself back up. Or if the springs in the pressure plate are failing, and if that's the case, the clutch will slip the minute it's put into service. Or maybe it won't disengage when you push the pedal down, depends on how they (or it, in the case of a diaphragm style clutch) fails.

Again I'd have to see the old clutch to know, but the vast majority of the time it's user-related. YOu have to let the gears do the work not the clutch, and it's VERY easy to let the clutch do the work via slipping it; and a lot of times you don't even know you're doing it. I'm guilty too and I catch myself every once in a while doing the same on my little massey ferguson.

your 16 year old tractor wasn't this one, so that arguement means nothing to anyone. It only means you had another tractor for 16 years, it doesn't say what kind, brand, style, model, type. Again that argument is quite common, and holds little value to the people you're arguing with.

they bought you one clutch and you expect them to buy another one. Good luck. They'll often give you one goodwill, and I'm highly suprised they gave you that one. Clutches are wear items, it's a specific exclusion in the warranty booklet that used to come with all tractors. Most people wipe their butt with it and go one with life, then gripe about "my clutch ain't under warranty? What kind of company is this?" I sold JD for a while too, was no different. Clutches are excluded from warranty because they are wear items.

You used up one goodwill. Next time it might be something else it needs and you've used up a good will. I'd be careful about this situation. Dealers have ways to communicate with each other, and if you showed up at another dealer with a separate problem later on, they may know your prior situation already. Kubota looks at prior claims as well and they can use those to determine how the unit is used, which can play into potential warranty claim processing and how the dealer is compensated.

 

[whitetiger]

I have an L3301 purchased last March. Clutch failed in less than 5 hours.

Is your L3301 a mechanical gear drive transmission?

 

[kajnjim]

Wear items like brakes and clutches are excluded items in most OEM warranties.

That said you seem to be experiencing unusuially short clutch life. Is this an HST or gear drive machine?

Dan

Single stage manual clutch.

 

[kajnjim]

Is your L3301 a mechanical gear drive transmission?

Yup