BX2380 Hydraulic Top Link

[Shuswap]

I am looking at an hydraulic top link for my BX2380. The existing link has a range of 14-3/4” to 21-3/4”. I’m looking at Spare Parts Holland which seems to have the broadest range of hydraulic top links. There is one with a range of 14-3/16” to 18-1/2” and another with a range of 16-1/8” to 22-7/16”. On the first I lose range at the top end. On the second I lose range at the bottom end. I’m interested in which one you would choose. BTW its primary use will be for a box blade.

 

[Daferris]

I have one of those links on my LX but Because it's a bigger tractor I used the longer one...
In your case I would mount the box blade then using your existing link. Set it at the 14.187 and 18.5" lengths and set how the box blade sets with those extremes. Then try the 16.125 & 21.75 settings and see how the box blade sets. Whatever link lets you get the best practical range of travel for using your box blade is the one to chose. Also the Spare parts Holland fittings on the hose are too big and a non-standard thread for the US ( they are British Pipe thread can't remember if its straight or tapered) Because the hoses that came with it were too long anyway I cut the one end off each and went to NAPA to have them crimp on a pair of 1/4" NPT male fittings for the couplers that came with my LX. I did a write up on it back in early 2022 on the top and side links

 

[GreensvilleJay]

Neither
I'd go to Princess Auto and have them make up EXACTLY what would be perfect.

 

[Shuswap]

I have one of those links on my LX but Because it's a bigger tractor I used the longer one...
In your case I would mount the box blade then using your existing link. Set it at the 14.187 and 18.5" lengths and set how the box blade sets with those extremes. Then try the 16.125 & 21.75 settings and see how the box blade sets. Whatever link lets you get the best practical range of travel for using your box blade is the one to chose. Also the Spare parts Holland fittings on the hose are too big and a non-standard thread for the US ( they are British Pipe thread can't remember if its straight or tapered) Because the hoses that came with it were too long anyway I cut the one end off each and went to NAPA to have them crimp on a pair of 1/4" NPT male fittings for the couplers that came with my LX. I did a write up on it back in early 2022 on the top and side links

I'll do that - thanks!

 

[Vigo]

In my experience being able to tilt the box forward is mostly useful for increasing my ‘departure angle’ when traversing crazy terrain while carrying the box blade.. Maybe not a likely scenario for many people, but since i used my box blade as loader counterweight it tends to go with me everywhere.

The main advantage of tilting it back is how well you can ‘smooth’ with the rear blade while driving forward. More is better there because it puts more weight on the blade and makes it way steeper in angle so its not as likely to just ‘ride up over’ something and leave a big hump in an area you were trying to drag smooth. It also makes the rear blade more aggressive if you are trying to use a lightweight box blade as a ‘dozer’ blade when pushing in reverse. That approach has some big caveats on bigger machines but you wont be messing up any Cat1 hardware doing that with a BX.. So id say extension is a little more valuable than retraction, for most people, in my opinion.

But you really cant give better advice than ‘go set it up both ways and see’ as Daferris said.. Im just throwing in some generalities of what to expect.

 

[Shuswap]

Neither
I'd go to Princess Auto and have them make up EXACTLY what would be perfect.

Looked at their website and no hydraulic top links BUT I am following this video to get remotes to the rear

The video not only shows the installation but identifies each part that he bought at PA by description and sku number. One of the best diy videos I have seen. My PA is just 45 minutes from me.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

They sell premade HTLs but longer than 20" minimum,3 sizes.. I checked sizes online before I posted..
PA WILL custom make them for you. I got 2 custom dbl act cylinders made for LESS than price to rebuild 1 OEM unit.

 

[Shuswap]

They sell premade HTLs but longer than 20" minimum,3 sizes.. I checked sizes online before I posted..
PA WILL custom make them for you. I got 2 custom dbl act cylinders made for LESS than price to rebuild 1 OEM unit.

Thanks for that - I'll check it out when I go in next week to pick up parts for the rear hydraulics setup.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

Princess Auto has the BEST staff of ANY company... ALWAYS friendly and helpful. I've taken stuff back (unused...) 9-12 months later, got 100% refund.
Had snowplow cylinder hoses made while I waited,installed in their parking lot and carried on !

 

[Shuswap]

Princess Auto has the BEST staff of ANY company... ALWAYS friendly and helpful. I've taken stuff back (unused...) 9-12 months later, got 100% refund.
Had snowplow cylinder hoses made while I waited,installed in their parking lot and carried on !

I've been a PA customer so long that I used to go to the Red Deer store before they opened in BC - yeah I'm that old

 

[TheOldHokie]

Looked at their website and no hydraulic top links BUT I am following this video to get remotes to the rear

The video not only shows the installation but identifies each part that he bought at PA by description and sku number. One of the best diy videos I have seen. My PA is just 45 minutes from me.

He needs to rethink power beyond.

Dan

 

[TheOldHokie]

I am looking at an hydraulic top link for my BX2380. The existing link has a range of 14-3/4” to 21-3/4”. I’m looking at Spare Parts Holland which seems to have the broadest range of hydraulic top links. There is one with a range of 14-3/16” to 18-1/2” and another with a range of 16-1/8” to 22-7/16”. On the first I lose range at the top end. On the second I lose range at the bottom end. I’m interested in which one you would choose. BTW its primary use will be for a box blade.

If those are the choices the longer one. Its 1.375 longer fully retracted - how often do you shorten the OEM link that much?

Dan

 

[DustyRusty]

He needs to rethink power beyond.

Dan

I understand how he has thought this out, and there was a similar type of rear auxiliary valve for the BX22 TLB around 2005, but it did have a return to the side of the transmission case. I removed it from my BX22 TLB when there was a valve failure and I couldn't get parts. I think that I still have the OEM instructions and will post them to this thread when I find them.

Did a quick search of my inbox and found them. If anyone knows of a parts breakdown of the valve, I would greatly appreciate it. There was a plug that developed a hole in the top of the hex head, and I got one from the Parker dealer that he thought would work, but it didn't. About a year later I had a problem with the hydraulics, and it turned out to be that valve was malfunctioning which was resolved when I removed all of the plumbing from the tractor that was associated with that valve. The Tech Data Specialist at Kubota that sent me the instructions said he couldn't even find the valve in the system. This was in 2016, and the kit came out in 2003.

 

[DustyRusty]

Since I can't sleep, I started digging in some old posts and found this explanation by someone that understood this better than I. Here is his explanation of how the BX22 & 23 are plumbed.

On a Kubota, oil is sucked from the sump by the pump and sent to the loader valve. The loader valve has a high pressure Power Beyond port which sends the oil to the next valve in the series circuit and a seperate return port line which goes back to the sump.

The loader's high pressure PB line now goes to any tractor mounted valve, which like the loader valve, has a PB out port and its own return to sump port.

The tractor mounted valve's high pressure PB line now goes to the 3pt, which is the last valve in the series circuit. The 3pt has no PB line and its return to sump port is internally plumbed.

If you have no tractor mounted valve then the loader valve's PB port goes directly to the 3pt. The 3pt is not connected directly to the pump but is the last valve in the series circuit.

Since a backhoe typically has no power beyond, it must be the last working valve in the circuit. Some installations have the loader's PB line connected to the backhoe and the backhoe outlet connected back into the main circuit but the 3pt and any tractor mounted valve must be disabled when the backhoe is connected. These type of installations will usually require that the 2 backhoe QD's be looped together whenever the backhoe is not attached.

Then after reading further I found this information.

It seems to me that the challenges that BX22 and BX23 owners once faced when trying to add a rear hydraulic remote valve to their tractors have been considerably reduced with the advent of the BX24.

If you take a look at the hydraulic plumbing at the back of the BX24 (going from the tractor to the BT601 backhoe) you will no longer find only two connectors but three. There are as follows:
1) Outlet hose
2) Return pipe, and
3) Power Beyond pipe.

In other words, the owner can now mount a rear remote using only the plumbing connectors found at the rear of the BX24, without the need to run a long return hose towards the front of the tractor as was required on the earlier BX22 and BX23.

Both of these quotes were written more than 15 years ago by 2 very well-respected people that understood the hydraulics of the BX tractors of that time period.

I also located the following pictures.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Since I can't sleep, I started digging in some old posts and found this explanation by someone that understood this better than I. Here is his explanation of how the BX22 & 23 are plumbed.


Then after reading further I found this information.



Both of these quotes were written more than 15 years ago by 2 very well-respected people that understood the hydraulics of the BX tractors of that time period.

I also located the following pictures.

I miss your point. The gentleman in the video is mistaken. His add on valve IS NOT the last valve in the circuit as he claims. His add on valve is ahead of and supplying pressure to the 3pt valve. He should be using the power beyond sleeve he originslly purchased and later discarded for that connection.

Then he needs to add a third line for tank return. Unlike most of Kubotas backhoe setups the BT602 backhoe already has that third connection point at the back of the tractor and for a "proper' installation he should be using it.

I will also add that when properly plumbed there is no need to remove or disconnect the AUX valve when the backhoe is mounted. It can be installed as a permanent part of the circuit and used with or without the backhoe.

Dan

 

[TheOldHokie]

Since I can't sleep, I started digging in some old posts and found this explanation by someone that understood this better than I. Here is his explanation of how the BX22 & 23 are plumbed.


Then after reading further I found this information.



Both of these quotes were written more than 15 years ago by 2 very well-respected people that understood the hydraulics of the BX tractors of that time period.

I also located the following pictures.

After looking at some parts diagrams its worse than I initially thought. On a BX25D the backhoe is plumbed straight off the pump and the FEL and 3pt valves are BOTH downstream of the backhoe. That's undoubtedly why Kubota switched to a three hose connection.

Dan

 

[DustyRusty]

Could you please explain the correct plumbing of the valve for the BX23S or even better yet, draw what goes where when it is properly plumbed? Thanks

 

[TheOldHokie]

Could you please explain the correct plumbing of the valve for the BX23S or even better yet, draw what goes where when it is properly plumbed? Thanks

The BX23S and th BX25D appear to be identical.:

The pump feeds the backhoe. This diagram shows the supply circuit with the backhoe disconnected. Hose 130 is pressure coming from the pump and coupler 140 is the pressure supply into the tractor's hydraulic system. To connect the backhoe you would plug hose 130 into the inlet on the backhoe and plug the the power beyond return from the backhoe valve into coupler 140.

Here is another page from the parts manual showing the same power beyond return (circled) and the third backhoe coupler and pipe going to tank.

And finally here is the loader valve connections. The loader valve is fed off a hydraulic block (circled) on the side of the tractor case. It is downstream of the backhoe return and upstream of the 3pt valve. The hydraulic block has a pressure out port to supply the loader and a power beyond return port used to supply the 3pt. There is also a third dedicated tank return for the loader valve.

So now that we are clear on how the tractor side works where do we add the AUX valve? There are multiple possibilities but it would seem the easiest is directly AFTER the backhoe valve. The backhoe will feed AUX valve, AUX valve will feed loader, loader will feed 3pt valve:

1. Remove the female quick coupler from the backhoe retun pipe and put it on the IN port of the AUX valve. This is going to be the new connection point for the backhoe power beyond return.
2. Using a new hose connect the power beyond port on the AUX valve to the pipe where we removed the coupler.
3. Using another hose and tee connect the tank port on the AUX valve to any of the existing tank returns. The male tip on the pipe used by the backhoe would be my choice but you could do it at the return from the loader valve if you wanted

All told you have two new hoses and a tee. The AUX valve is always in the circuit and can be used with or without the backhoe being mounted. When you remove the backhoe you loop the supply hose back to the IN port on the AUX valve just like you did when it was on the pipe. Simple, neat and inexpensive.

Dan

 

[DustyRusty]

Thank you for the instructions, and hopefully, this will be of great use to all the other BX23S owners that desire to add the rear function valve and do it correctly. I think that I understand this, but I will probably be back to visit this later when warm weather arrives and I am actually doing the installation. At that point, I will attempt to put together a list of parts needed and work up a schematic showing all the connections. Hydraulics isn't my strong point, but I am good at following instructions.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Thank you for the instructions, and hopefully, this will be of great use to all the other BX23S owners that desire to add the rear function valve and do it correctly.

You are quite welcome. I think this is the third thread in the last couple weeks on this topic.

Dan