SpokaneDude
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BX2350, FM 125 tiller, Land Pride blade, BotaProducts fuel & HST filter mods
BX2350: just installed a Kubota Engine Block heater; how long can I leave it on without burning the element?
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85Hokie
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What you really want to know, is at WHAT point is the cooling equaling the heating?
I do not have a masters in thermal dynamics - but I bet you this, after an hour there about, the heating of the water will not longer be effective.
AS the water is heated, THAT heat is transferred to block and though convection all the metal parts will start to absorb the heat of the water - NOW at that point the cold air is sucking the heat right of those metal parts.
Even as the water "moves" through the system slowly I might add, it will reach a point where the heating will be almost worthless and a waste of electricity.
My advice - get you a infrared thermometer and take measurements after an hour then 2 hours and so on, only then will you see where the cut off is - all this depends ON HOW COLD it is too!!! The colder the air, the longer you will need to burn the heating coil.
I do not have a masters in thermal dynamics - but I bet you this, after an hour there about, the heating of the water will not longer be effective.
AS the water is heated, THAT heat is transferred to block and though convection all the metal parts will start to absorb the heat of the water - NOW at that point the cold air is sucking the heat right of those metal parts.
Even as the water "moves" through the system slowly I might add, it will reach a point where the heating will be almost worthless and a waste of electricity.
My advice - get you a infrared thermometer and take measurements after an hour then 2 hours and so on, only then will you see where the cut off is - all this depends ON HOW COLD it is too!!! The colder the air, the longer you will need to burn the heating coil.
GreensvilleJay
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BX23-S,57 A-C D-14,58 A-C D-14, 57 A-C D-14,tiller,cults,Millcreek 25G spreader,
your question requires several more questions before a reasonable answer can posted
1st is tractor in a garage or out in the open
2nd is tractor surrounded by sheets of plywood to block the wind
3rd is tractor covered with a quilt or similar covering
4th tractor temperature when parked
5th ambient temperature of surrounding air
6th any wind in the area
7th bare tractor or covered in ice/snow
8th power rating of the 'block heater'
9th antifreeze/water ratio
10 there's a lot more,some subtle but important.
generally speaking, if your tractor is in an unheated but draft free garage,1-4 hours before using the tractor should be OK. There's a lot of 'math' involved after you get 'real world data' to get the exact amount of time needed for optimum result, ie warm engine without wasting electrons.
I used to remotely 'setback thermostats' in small to medium sized companies3 decades ago. it took some time, but I could 'tweak' the units to get clients 35% fuel cost savings.
1st is tractor in a garage or out in the open
2nd is tractor surrounded by sheets of plywood to block the wind
3rd is tractor covered with a quilt or similar covering
4th tractor temperature when parked
5th ambient temperature of surrounding air
6th any wind in the area
7th bare tractor or covered in ice/snow
8th power rating of the 'block heater'
9th antifreeze/water ratio
10 there's a lot more,some subtle but important.
generally speaking, if your tractor is in an unheated but draft free garage,1-4 hours before using the tractor should be OK. There's a lot of 'math' involved after you get 'real world data' to get the exact amount of time needed for optimum result, ie warm engine without wasting electrons.
I used to remotely 'setback thermostats' in small to medium sized companies3 decades ago. it took some time, but I could 'tweak' the units to get clients 35% fuel cost savings.
I have a B3030 and installed a block heater right after I got it. It's really a "coolant" heater, where the heated coolant warms the block, thus warming oil as well. I've found during winter months with temps in the 20's, after 30-45 mins with the heater plugged in, and an 8 count on the glow, it starts pretty much like a summer start. The tractor is in an unheated garage, so it is protected from the elements.
I have a Bluetooth outlet that lets me switch the heater on before I plan to use it. As others have mentioned, the block will continue to absorb the heat from the heated coolant. With sub freezing temps, the cold air is drawing the heat from the block. I would bet that as long as there's coolant in the block, you're fine.
I have a Bluetooth outlet that lets me switch the heater on before I plan to use it. As others have mentioned, the block will continue to absorb the heat from the heated coolant. With sub freezing temps, the cold air is drawing the heat from the block. I would bet that as long as there's coolant in the block, you're fine.
I’ve found that three to five hours prior to start works for me. I’m talking cold soaked in Alaska as well as Michigan. I used a timer most of the time. You might consider doing a trial run on the circuit that you are going to use.
If you don't have a Bluetooth outlet, the Meross Wi-Fi plug in switches have worked well for me for years. You can set a routine for a time to turn off. I set it for 3 hours for the truck heater. When I turn it on, it stays on for 3 hours. That way, if I see a squirrel, I don't have to remember to unplug it.
My first two questions would be how big is the engine and how many watts is the heater
North Idaho Wolfman
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SpokaneDude
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BX2350, FM 125 tiller, Land Pride blade, BotaProducts fuel & HST filter mods
Thank you everybody for responding... I'm going to go with 1 hour, feeling the hose from the radiator and go on the safe side... it's an old tractor and don't want any more repair bills...
Sounds good. In the end....you'll find out what works for you.
Your title suggests you are concerned with 'burning out' the heater element, but the thread ultimately addressed the most 'efficient' run time.
With respect to longevity of the heater: It is a Direct Resistance Element (no different than in your typical water heater), so it will eventually wear out. Of most importance is that it is ALWAYS submerged in coolant. Otherwise it 'can' burn out in minutes.
As has already been discussed there is a threshold of run time (mostly temperature dependent) that will provide adequate heat to help start the engine vs. unnecessary waste of running full time.
Conditions (temp, wind, etc) and the possible inconvenience of you 'tending' the run time will dictate what each person chooses to do. But I wouldn't worry about burning the element out....provided it is NEVER dry (when running).
SpokaneDude
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BX2350, FM 125 tiller, Land Pride blade, BotaProducts fuel & HST filter mods
Interesting,., that's what the repair tech also told me make sure the fluid level is at the top of the radiator, and he showed me how to squeeze the outlet from the radiator to test the heat.....
Thanks for the info.
GreensvilleJay
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BX23-S,57 A-C D-14,58 A-C D-14, 57 A-C D-14,tiller,cults,Millcreek 25G spreader,
I could only get a year and half out of the block heaters , the longest time left on would be an hour and a half, went through two and then installed a timer that allows it to turn on for twenty minutes then off for five, can turn it on remotely from the house . Also installed a an ammeter so I can see if and when it fails.
This year I installed a battery blanket, combined they draw less than 4 amps.
This year I installed a battery blanket, combined they draw less than 4 amps.
I had a block heater installed in my BX22 when I purchased it in 2002 or 2003, and and used it every winter till I sold the tractor in 2020. I would plug it in when I knew it was going to snow overnight and leave it plugged in till I went out to snowblow. Don't know if the one that I got was the best of the batch or if I was just lucky. My block heater never burned out. Possibly I have better electrons at my home than other people have at their home. Do better electrons lead to a longer life?
ve9aa
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TG1860, BX2380 -backblade, bx2830 snowblower, fel, weight box,pallet forks,etc
How long is a piece of string? 
OK, OK, seriously...you'll figure it out. An hour or so it what I've used for some of my old diesels. I always put them on a timer to start an hour or two before I was due to head out in the morning (then shut off after) and that way if I was sick, vacation day, weekend, whatever, I'd only use an hour of electricity.
YMMV
OK, OK, seriously...you'll figure it out. An hour or so it what I've used for some of my old diesels. I always put them on a timer to start an hour or two before I was due to head out in the morning (then shut off after) and that way if I was sick, vacation day, weekend, whatever, I'd only use an hour of electricity.
YMMV
GreensvilleJay
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BX23-S,57 A-C D-14,58 A-C D-14, 57 A-C D-14,tiller,cults,Millcreek 25G spreader,
OK, 'less than 4 amps' kinda confirms the 400 Watt value I suggested. probably 300 watt as battery blanket may draw an amp .
It's really sad these block heaters don't last at least 10-15 years. properly designed and built with correct materials they would. Be interesting to see WHY they failed.
It's really sad these block heaters don't last at least 10-15 years. properly designed and built with correct materials they would. Be interesting to see WHY they failed.
I sure wish my tractor was kept close enough I could use a Bluetooth plug. That sounds like the best option. I use a plug timer and once the snow is around or a big dump is predicted I set it to run for 2 hrs 8am-10am and then anytime after 9am coffee is go time. If I don’t need to blow snow it just shuts off at 10am. If it’s a random time I need it I try and give it an hour to heat up but to be honest I’ve never really had a hard start from cold weather with my m7060. My old Ford 5600 is a different story. I’m not in Alaska kind of temps but we do see some cold weeks in Ontario. Less these days then 10 years ago. For me I’m just looking to add a bit of heat plus the glow plugs. It always still runs for a bit before I start to work it. I know others who just plug it in and let it stay plugged in when not in use during the winter.
twice the distance from one end to its mid-point.How long is a piece of string?