B8200DT Directional Valve Problem

[Crylozeus]

I bought a B8200DP tractor with 572 hours for a decent price at an auction recently. I tested it out and the machine worked great aside from needing a new battery. It has a loader and I tested it out raising it all the way up, lowering it and pushing the front end off the ground, no problem. The PTO worked great and the 3 pt hitch arms went up and down just fine. When the person delivering the machine dropped it off, he touched the directional valve and the hydraulics were very, very sluggish afterwards, I parked my tractor and fiddled with the directional valve a little more and lost all hydraulic power to my loader and my hitch arms. It also makes a quick grinding noise coming from the directional valve. The directional valve knob, that sticks out at a 45 degree angle turns indefinitely to the right or left almost like it has disengaged from the part it is supposed to be engaged with. I understand it is supposed to be locking in place after turning it to the left or right. I have an appointment set up with my local Kubota dealer to have it fixed, but if am afraid it will cost quite a bit. Any advice on how to fix this problem myself? I was thinking of removing my loader temporarily and doing some brush hogging on my property in the mean time. The PTO knob is turning just fine. I am afraid the grinding noise will be bad if I run it without it having been looked at. Thanks, Sam

P.S. Anyone have any idea of the value of a B8200DP with 572 hrs, with a loader, 3 pt hitch, lights work, PTO works, and a Ford kind of beat up but still functioning fine Brush hog? Also, is this tractor capable of handling a backhoe? Thanks for any advice, Sam

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Sam,
I'm as little confused as to your naming terms!
First it's not a B8200DT, it's a B8200DP.
Directional valve?
Are you talking about the divider block where the loader connects?
If it is that is a super easy fix, no dealer needed, unless you like being abused!

Which block do you have?




PTO Knob? That one I have no clue, explain better, or pic's.

Sounds like the grinding noise is the fluid going to bypass, no do not run it like that as the pump will burn out.

Prices vary from place t place and demand and condition.
Post some pictures and we will might be able to give you a better answer.
Prices vary from about 5K to 9K.

 

[Crylozeus]

Hi Wolfman, sorry about the terminology, new to all this. I believe it is the divider block 12064. I have included a photo of it attached. Also, here is a YouTube link I took of me turning the directional valve on the divider block. I say directional valve because there is a diagram that names it on the side of the tractor under the seat by the gear shifter. Here is the YouTube link:

http://youtu.be/k0UahYJG7uA

Sam

P.S. As for the PTO knob, I was referring to the little knob that turns all your PTO attachments such a brush hog located behind the tractor, what is the correct terminology for this part? Thanks

 

[Crylozeus]

Here's a pic of the tractor, 572 hrs, with loader, 3 pt hitch, pretty good condition, needs some paint, any idea of the value?

 

[Billdog350]

With 4wd, decent tires, and everything working as it should, I would guess that machine should be in the $5500-6500 range, plus the bush hog which should go for another $500ish..give or take. Keep in mind the HST models fetch a lot more money. You don't have an official kubota loader on there, doesn't have power steering or HST, otherwise it would be worth more.

Don't fool yourself that you have 572 hrs on that, you either have 1572, 2572, or 3572...your hour meter is like mine...it turns over after 999 and starts fresh. A machine of that age? Likely 1572 or 2572....still not bad....just plan accordingly.

 

[murky]

For the directional valve see this thread: http://www.orangetractortalks.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14342&highlight=directional+valve

It looks like you are missing the roll pins that limit the travel of that directional valve knob. It is supposed to be able to turn freely if these pins are missing. It isn't a screw, its the clock position that it is set to that matters.

From your picture it looks like it is close to the correct position for when the loader is installed. Assuming the pin stub that you can see on the left side of it isn't bent, the knob should be turned a few degrees counter-clockwise for the loader connected position.

If the roll pin stub where the hour hand on a clock, your's looks like its at about 8:30 and it should be maybe just shy of 7 O'Clock (from the base of the pin if it is bent)


The pin is supposed to be trapped in the red arc. For loader operation it should be just to the right (counterclockwise) of the red circle.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Murky point out exactly what is wrong.
This is how you break it down to replace the pins.

Drive out the pin marked in blue, removing the top nut
Drive out the pin marked in yellow.
Remove the nut marked in red, and remove valve.

You can drive out the pins on #8 nut and replace
with 2 metric roll pins / spring pins or (#3)
you can get them at a local hardware store or order the originals from below.
Then reinstall valve shaft and install 2 new roll pins (#6) in the valve bottom one like in Murky's pic, leaving it stick out to run into the 2 (#3)pins as stops, then reinstall the top nut.

If you have any issues, drop me a PM and I'll get you any more info or help you need.

2x (#3) 05411-00316
1x (#5) 67810-38160
2x (#6) 05411-00316
1x (#7) 04811-00090
1x (#8) 67850-38520

 

[Crylozeus]

Thank you both Murky and Wolfman, I appreciate the help. I will try it today, I have tried removing the pins with a nail punch, but the pin was hollow and the punch was too small, so I will bring a few different size punches and some needle nose to see what I can do, maybe tractor supply would have the parts I need? Thanks, Sam

 

[Crylozeus]

Thank you both Murky and Wolfman, I appreciate the help. I will try it today, I have tried removing the pins with a nail punch, but the pin was hollow and the punch was too small, so I will bring a few different size punches and some needle nose to see what I can do, maybe tractor supply would have the parts I need? Thanks, Sam

 

[Crylozeus]

So I removed the two pins and the nut on top of the stem. I needed a deep socket I believe 18 mm or 11/16" which fit the top nut and I hope it will fit the bottom one too. I will work on it tomorrow and update the status. Here is a picture of what it looks like so far. BTW, I'm not entirely sure what removing the valve stem and replacing some pins is going to do. It is making a grinding noise when I run it, but it is very short lived, like once a minute and for a split second. I hope that once I remove the valve stem and then put it back in place, maybe that will fix it. I understand about the limiting pin that keeps the valve from spinning indefinitely, I have tried turning it very, very slowly while also trying to raise my loader arms, and even if I do get the pin in exactly the right positional I think it might be a deeper problem. If I have to replace the whole divider block, I may do so. Any idea of the cost of a block? Thanks, Sam

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

The whole valve is P/N 67850-38104 $394.70

But if you get to that point take it off and box it up and send it to me I can rebuild it right for way cheaper!

I'm wondering if they did damage to the internals when the brazed the 2 pipe fitting into the side of it, not what I would call a brilliant move!

 

[Crylozeus]

Ok, well I took it apart. I pulled the valve out after removing the holding nut keeping it in place, after I reinserted it, there was no difference. I checked the rubber gasket on the valve stem, looked good. Here are a couple of pictures of what it looked like when I took it apart. I hope this helps maybe determining what the heck is wrong with it. After I put it back together again, it was still doing the exact same thing making the grinding noise occasionally. I turned the valve stem and there was no resistance just like before. I feel like there is no hope for my unskilled self repairing this thing and I will have to rely on the damn dealer and get raped for $500+ dollars or more to get it fixed. I looked at all the hoses and pipes leading into the divider block and it looks a little more complex and I don't think I have the right tools to even pull it apart and get it so that I can send it out for repair. I'm hoping that it's a hell of an easy fix, any advice?

Sam

 

[Crylozeus]

More pics of the valve stem and the cavity it was in, looks to be creamy colored hydraulic fluid, the black in there might just be older fluid I think.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

I think the black inside is a flat rubber gasket.
It looks like it's all distorted, use a pair of twezzers and pull it out.
It looks like the hydro fluid is getting foamed, or has water in it.
Foamed fluid is a result of air being induced before the pump, but we'll save that fix till you get this one done.

 

[Crylozeus]

Hi Wolfman and Others, I have gotten to the point of trying to determine what's wrong with the damn thing, and me not being a mechanic, nor even being able to remove the divider block without seriously messing it up, I have decided to take it to the Kubota dealer and get it done by the only guy around that knows how to fix these things. I have tried finding locals that know how to repair tractors specifically and have had no success whatsoever. My tractor needs a tune up too and some other minor fixes, but I just wanted to express my sincere gratitude for giving your advice on this problem, and if I run into anything else, I will ask for some help. Much appreciated, Sam

 

[kbrothers]

my tractor makes the same noise and the three point won't lift I tore the valve off and cleaned it up The only piece I couldn't get out was the diverter valve assembly which wouldn't move Put back on machine still no 3 point I figure problem has to be the stuck diverter valve hope this helps someone This was a month or so ago also had pulled off top of trans case to replace brken shaft for 3 point lift piston and cleaned the lift valve and replace "o" rings in it # point didn't work when got tractor with hoe last november Took hoe off found 3 pt didn't do anything ; after cleaning these valves I get a squeal type noise when try 3 pt lift I figure it to be stuck diverter valve in directional valve but with tilling done & hoe on don't want to pursue this at present Any one rebuild the directioal valves? Hope you get yours fixed Will post when and if I figure it out

 

[Crylozeus]

Hi everyone, I have an update on my directional valve problem. So the deal was that there was a knocking noise coming from my divider block and there was no power to the loader and none to the 3 pt hitch. I have no mechanical skills, so I made the decision to bring it to a Kubota dealer and let them handle it. First off, they said that there was a LOT of water in the hydraulic lines, so that might have been the problem because when you pressurize water, it bubbles, rather than staying a solid mass. So they drained all of it, dried it out and refilled with new hydraulic fluid. Still, no go and same knocking noise.
So they looked into it further and ended up ordering a new hydraulic pump at about $400, while they were removing the hydraulic pump, they discovered a "rag like" material clogging the valves for the hydraulic fluid. Once they cleaned out all of this material from the hydraulic lines, Presto!! It was fixed. No need for a new pump, whew! The fluid now could freely flow through the previously clogged hydraulic lines. They said that it might have been sucked into the hydraulic lines somehow, but not sure how.
There was also a part of the tractor that was permeable to water and it was missing a sleeve for it, so they have that sleeve on order and I should be getting it back in the next couple of days.
I will tell you what, I am very glad I let the pros do it rather than mis-diagnosing it and making it worse by pulling apart the wrong parts. I appreciate all the help you guys have given and I hope this might help someone with similar problems. Any questions, feel free to ask.

CZ