Advice from experts on M4500DT : Rebuild or DIY or Sell

[sanjeevtyagi]

Hi Friends

I am new to tractor world and got myself m4500DT with a 1810 Loader and a RES125 Rototiller for a 8.5K Tag, given all the prices of used tractors i thought that
was quite some deal untill i realized that the blowby tube has a significant blowby, i see white smoke which is consistent and it doesnt stop as the tractor warms up. Glow plugs maybe weak so it starts tough in cold weather but once it starts and warms up starting again is not problem it starts right up, loader works good and tractor doesnt seem to bog down under load. I bought all the oil changes and filters to be able to start afresh including all hydraulic and gear box oils for tractor and tiller and hyrdaulics for tractor and loader. Now i am not sure if this is worth holding onto,My FIL who is a farmer in Michigan suggested even if its a rebuild job it would cost somewhere around 5K which would still make a 55HP tractor pretty reasonable at 13.5K with lots of life ahead of it. I am very handy and looking at workshop manual i could probably open it up and try to cheap out on Aliexpress / Ebay Rebuild kits but am i underestimating the work as the engine block is huge in this(its by no means a small tractor). I have a mechanic coming soon to inspect as he thinks it might be injectors issue before i think its a piston rings issue, I am not sure. Should i go ahead and do 15W40 Oil change + all Filters + all Hyradulics and maybe glow plugs and injectors and expect the best. Or expect this definitely is a rebuild job and i am wasting money on early oil changes.

I also tried searching for reman engines S2600A but there seems to be none and i don't know how much do they go for?

With this forums's expertise i want to open up and understand all viewpoints and then take a decision. Kindly let me know what do you all think ?

 

[Motion]

How many hours on the tractor? You're already in the game another thousand changing fluids/filters, new glow plugs, injectors, set valves, perform a compression test pending results perform a leak down test oil pressure, drain fuel tank, change fuel filter. it certainly won't hurt to get additional information and perserve the status quo. From there you can come up with a game plan but right now you've got a pre emission tractor that runs and going forward you'll know what's condition it's in. Good luck

 

[GreensvilleJay]

'white smoke' is usually a sign of water(coolant) getting into cylinders, so perhaps it's just a head gasket ?
I don't know that tractor or engine but hopefully the 'guys who know' will reply soon.
'black smoke' as blowby can be rings or valves, THAT I have in spades with my Buda diesel forklift ! For me, it's NOT worth the 5K$ rebuild (AFTER I get engine out....),as I only use the forklift a few hours every month and I have free oil.

Since you have the oils and filters, I'd change them now. Then you KNOW where you're starting from !

 

[TheOldHokie]

Hi Friends

I am new to tractor world and got myself m4500DT with a 1810 Loader and a RES125 Rototiller for a 8.5K Tag, given all the prices of used tractors i thought that
was quite some deal untill i realized that the blowby tube has a significant blowby, i see white smoke which is consistent and it doesnt stop as the tractor warms up. Glow plugs maybe weak so it starts tough in cold weather but once it starts and warms up starting again is not problem it starts right up, loader works good and tractor doesnt seem to bog down under load. I bought all the oil changes and filters to be able to start afresh including all hydraulic and gear box oils for tractor and tiller and hyrdaulics for tractor and loader. Now i am not sure if this is worth holding onto,My FIL who is a farmer in Michigan suggested even if its a rebuild job it would cost somewhere around 5K which would still make a 55HP tractor pretty reasonable at 13.5K with lots of life ahead of it. I am very handy and looking at workshop manual i could probably open it up and try to cheap out on Aliexpress / Ebay Rebuild kits but am i underestimating the work as the engine block is huge in this(its by no means a small tractor). I have a mechanic coming soon to inspect as he thinks it might be injectors issue before i think its a piston rings issue, I am not sure. Should i go ahead and do 15W40 Oil change + all Filters + all Hyradulics and maybe glow plugs and injectors and expect the best. Or expect this definitely is a rebuild job and i am wasting money on early oil changes.

I also tried searching for reman engines S2600A but there seems to be none and i don't know how much do they go for?

With this forums's expertise i want to open up and understand all viewpoints and then take a decision. Kindly let me know what do you all think ?

If it runs OK, doesn't use a lot of oil, and has good power just use it. Fix it when it actually breaks.

Dan

 

[GeoHorn]

If the compressions are good… and the glow plugs work properly for starting…(NEVER use starting fluid or ether on this engine)…. and it runs good after it starts up…. then USE it and let it do it’s job like it was intended.

Avoid throwing money and amateur labor down the drain on it.

 

[sanjeevtyagi]

If the compressions are good… and the glow plugs work properly for starting…(NEVER use starting fluid or ether on this engine)…. and it runs good after it starts up…. then USE it and let it do it’s job like it was intended.

Avoid throwing money and amateur labor down the drain on it.

Thanks a lot for your reply , i am not sure about the compression at this point i will have to buy the compression tester and check , but right now the amount of smoke it blows from the breather tube gives a headache so i may have to reroute it to the back in order to be able to sit on it

 

[sanjeevtyagi]

How many hours on the tractor? You're already in the game another thousand changing fluids/filters, new glow plugs, injectors, set valves, perform a compression test pending results perform a leak down test oil pressure, drain fuel tank, change fuel filter. it certainly won't hurt to get additional information and perserve the status quo. From there you can come up with a game plan but right now you've got a pre emission tractor that runs and going forward you'll know what's condition it's in. Good luck

The Hour meter seems to be broken i opened the panel up and i see the cable is dislodged from it, it showed 2600 on it i am assuming it close to atleast 3000 as per seller. I will buy a compression tester kit and perform the compression test and post those results here

 

[GreensvilleJay]

check the coolant level,keep an eye on it, often...again 'white smoke' usually means 'water' , coolant entering cylinders....

 

[sanjeevtyagi]

check the coolant level,keep an eye on it, often...again 'white smoke' usually means 'water' , coolant entering cylinders....

Thanks a lot i haven't seen the coolant level getting low last time

 

[GeoHorn]

Did the “seller” from whom you purchased it…use it in Real Actual Farming…?? or more like “hobby-farmers“…?

The M4500DT is a ”Real” farmer workhorse..and if it were used for the last few years as a “hobby” tractor…it may not have been worked-hard…and may have idled a lot or run at low-rpm. These engines, if only lightly used, may be “slobbering” or have lost it’s ring/cyl-wall seal…it may have “glazed” cyls. If so, run it Hard…at higher RPM and avoid long periods of low RPM or idling.
That 6-cyl engine is known for smoothness and longevity.

Also, don’t forget to give it a new clean air-filter. Diesels hate dirty air.

 

[sanjeevtyagi]

Did the “seller” from whom you purchased it…use it in Real Actual Farming…?? or more like “hobby-farmers“…?

The M4500DT is a ”Real” farmer workhorse..and if it were used for the last few years as a “hobby” tractor…it may not have been worked-hard…and may have idled a lot or run at low-rpm. These engines, if only lightly used, may be “slobbering” or have lost it’s ring/cyl-wall seal…it may have “glazed” cyls. If so, run it Hard…at higher RPM and avoid long periods of low RPM or idling.
That 6-cyl engine is known for smoothness and longevity.

Also, don’t forget to give it a new clean air-filter. Diesels hate dirty air.

Thanks a lot Geo, i will confirm with seller i think it wasn't used a lot in last few years. I have already changed the air filter to brand new , will be doing Oil changes within this week and oil filter and fuel filter after i change the engine oil. Thanks i will try to make it work as you suggested and see if it bogs down

 

[sanjeevtyagi]

Did the “seller” from whom you purchased it…use it in Real Actual Farming…?? or more like “hobby-farmers“…?

The M4500DT is a ”Real” farmer workhorse..and if it were used for the last few years as a “hobby” tractor…it may not have been worked-hard…and may have idled a lot or run at low-rpm. These engines, if only lightly used, may be “slobbering” or have lost it’s ring/cyl-wall seal…it may have “glazed” cyls. If so, run it Hard…at higher RPM and avoid long periods of low RPM or idling.
That 6-cyl engine is known for smoothness and longevity.

Also, don’t forget to give it a new clean air-filter. Diesels hate dirty air.

Any Ideas on how to handle the smoke coming out of breather tube as it becomes too overpowering to breathe at times, can it be routed upwards like towards exhaust ?

 

[sanjeevtyagi]

After all the oil changes , my tractor took the longest to start but i think i had too much air trapped within the fuel line which eventually with my consistent bleeding the line finally cleared and tractor started , now the 3 point hitch wont raise at all, can anyone guide me what am i doing wrong , i did all the oil changes and now i am unable to lift the 3 point hitch which was working before all oil changes, is there a specific switch/setting or something in m4500DT which can help reset the 3 point hitch

 

[whitetiger]

Does the loader raise? If not, rev it up for a couple of seconds and see if they will raise. If they do not, check that your hyd filter is in fact tight.

 

[007kubotaguy]

Your hydraulic pump has lost its prime. Remove the suction line from the top of the pump and dump some hydraulic oil in the pump. It should pick up the oil and start pumping. Your tractor has two pumps. It will be the front pump on the right side of the engine. The line you remove is the one attached to the suction filter. I assume the power steering is working.

 

[sanjeevtyagi]

Thanks for the suggestions my FEL works great without any issues but I guess as Kubota guy suggested

Your hydraulic pump has lost its prime. Remove the suction line from the top of the pump and dump some hydraulic oil in the pump. It should pick up the oil and start pumping. Your tractor has two pumps. It will be the front pump on the right side of the engine. The line you remove is the one attached to the suction filter. I assume the power steering is working.

Thanks for such a directed answer , so m4500dt has 2 pumps , I think I kind of know where is this pump u are talking about and I will try your suggestion , power steering and FEL both are working fine without any issues

 

[sanjeevtyagi]

Does the loader raise? If not, rev it up for a couple of seconds and see if they will raise. If they do not, check that your hyd filter is in fact tight.

FEL and power Steering works good

 

[sanjeevtyagi]

A few more point just to ask the experts to throw to see if i have done anything else
1. Changed Hydraulic/Tranmissions Fluid
2. Opened and inspected the Hydraulic Filter , Filter looked good and used the same O ring and put it back
3. Used Anti Rust on the Draft+Lift Control Levers as my Draft control was stuck so i sprayed the area

Could i have messed up something anti rust sprat on the controls are there any other controls underneath those levers which could have been affected by anti rust spray

Could using the same O ring (old one) also cause this non functioning of 3PT hitch

I guess i am asking too many questions but i thought i will add whatever i did before which the 3PT hitch was working just to make sure iam diagnosing the issue, as per kubotaguys suggestion i will go try to prime the Hyrdraulic Pump now and see if this brings it back to life

 

[GeoHorn]

I don’t imagine re-using the old O-ring wojuld cause a parallel failure…but Generally Speaking… RE-using an O-ring is bad practice. O-rings are cheap and when reused they commonly fail.

 

[sanjeevtyagi]

@007kubotaguy i am assuming you are referring to this pump and I presume I can only dump oil on top inlet on left coz the bottom inlet won't allow me to do anything against gravity