A question about counter weights when using just a backhoe.

[Rob]

hi all,
I have a question regarding the fitting of a counter weight on my B7100 and B8200 when using a backhoe.
neither machine has a FEL fitted so i need to sort out some counter weights for the front, backhoe weights in at approx 315Kg without any bucket , so add on a decent 24" digging bucket full of rock, what are we looking at to counter that lot.


Any ideas guys on an appropiate weight without going over the top and lossing the ability to move the steering wheel

rgds
rob

 

[B7100]

Judging by my experience with a B7100 with fel and backhoe I would think you will be hard pressed to get enough weight out front. I have to load the fel bucket with weights to keep the front end on the ground when going up hill.
Dave

 

[Rob]

thanks for the reply Dave, i know what you mean .
It's a bit mad really as they allway recommend FEL in conjuction with a backhoe for stability etc, that really works then

I may need to pic your brains on the lewis dave if thats ok

rob

 

[Lil Foot]

All I can think of is suitcase weights & front wheel weights, as pictured in these links:
http://www.orangetractortalks.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9444&page=3

http://www.orangetractortalks.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5172

 

[B7100]

It's a bit mad really as they allway recommend FEL in conjuction with a backhoe for stability etc, that really works then

I may need to pic your brains on the lewis dave if thats ok

rob

I guess why they recommend the fel is, one can level the machine when pointing down hill which makes it much easier to dig level.
Also the ground contact of the fel bucket means more down force can be applied by the hoe bucket before the rear wheels and legs lift off the ground. When the latter happens,without the fel bucket in contact or no fel on the tractor it can take off down hill pretty quick,I have the tee shirt

I see from your other thread you are going to buy a new two stick control valve? I have a two stick one on mine and it doesn't look a too difficult job to modify a piano key type to two stick as the only difference appears to be the pivot arrangement to make one lever operate two adjacent spools.
I can get you pics if required?
Dave

 

[Lil Foot]

I see from your other thread you are going to buy a new two stick control valve? I have a two stick one on mine and it doesn't look a too difficult job to modify a piano key type to two stick as the only difference appears to be the pivot arrangement to make one lever operate two adjacent spools.
I can get you pics if required?

I'd like to see that even if Rob does not.... thanks!

 

[hodge]

I guess why they recommend the fel is, one can level the machine when pointing down hill which makes it much easier to dig level.
Also the ground contact of the fel bucket means more down force can be applied by the hoe bucket before the rear wheels and legs lift off the ground. When the latter happens,without the fel bucket in contact or no fel on the tractor it can take off down hill pretty quick,I have the tee shirt

I see from your other thread you are going to buy a new two stick control valve? I have a two stick one on mine and it doesn't look a too difficult job to modify a piano key type to two stick as the only difference appears to be the pivot arrangement to make one lever operate two adjacent spools.
I can get you pics if required?
Dave

A loader may be better on the tractor- the counterweight is distributed by the loader frame, instead of being focused on the front of the tractor. If you can get enough weight mounted on the front, you are going to stress the tractor frame when you load the backhoe.

 

[B7100]

I'd like to see that even if Rob does not.... thanks!

I can do some more pics of it taken apart if This is not clear enough?
dave

 

[Lil Foot]

Very clear, thanks for posting!

 

[Rob]

Thanks for the replies guys, thanks also dave for the vid, anychance you can email me some closer still pics ofthe linkages.
I spoke with mr Lewis last week about the chances of converting from the earlier 4 stick to the 2 stick, he said is was an easy job as they can supply me with just the linkages and sticks etc to change over the system, the spool is the same item on both versions, but not excessively expensive, but not really cheap, so if i could fab a similar setup that would be better.

rgds
rob

 

[kubotasam]

hi all,
I have a question regarding the fitting of a counter weight on my B7100 and B8200 when using a backhoe.
neither machine has a FEL fitted so i need to sort out some counter weights for the front, backhoe weights in at approx 315Kg without any bucket , so add on a decent 24" digging bucket full of rock, what are we looking at to counter that lot.


Any ideas guys on an appropiate weight without going over the top and lossing the ability to move the steering wheel

rgds
rob

I have a b7100 with A Woods BH750 backhoe. I do have a FEL. I also fitted the front wheels with weights. I think 50 lbs each. I just looked in the Woods manual about weight on the front of the tractor and all it says is if a backhoe is fitted on a tractor without a FEL the front of the tractor will need to be ballasted so 20% of the total weight is on the front wheels. I really think you will want a loader. The ability to plant the front bucket to stabilize the tractor is a big deal when using the backhoe. I always raise all 4 wheels of the ground when using my hoe. It keeps the strain off the axles and keeps it on the loader and backhoe subframe.

 

[B7100]

any chance you can email me some closer still pics of the linkages.


rgds
rob

Will take apart and snap when I get a spare 1/2 hour.
dave

 

[Lil Foot]

After reading these replies, I must admit I had not considered the obvious advantages of stability offered by the FEL on the ground when digging with the backhoe. I think you could counter balance the weight of the hoe by adding weight to the front, but you are not going to get the stability of an FEL firmly planted when digging. It's almost like another set of stabilizers on the front. I have moved my tractor (unintentionally) with the FEL planted while digging, and would assume the tractor would move all over without the FEL on the ground. Maybe it would work in very soft soil with no rocks or roots, but not out here. After thinking it over, I don't think I've ever seen a backhoe without the FEL. My setup also has the backhoe subframe attached to the tractor and the FEL subframe- got to add a lot of strength. Just some things to think about.

 

[Rob]

I do plan on fittting a FEL, but they are very hard to come by for b8200's, well decent ones that is.
so until ones comes up i will be using the backhoe only but with a decent subframe which goes pretty well the full lenght of the tactor chassis, no chance of flexing etc but i may need to use wheel weights also. i have approx 80kg for the front , so another 10kg on each wheel may suffice.

David, sent you an email.
thanks
rob

 

[Russell King]

Rob,

Another idea migh be to add some weight to the backhoes sub frame if there is room. May need to make it detachable (spelling?) and install it when you get to your area for digging. Use the back hoe to carry the weight?

At least that way it would not always be on the front end axle load like suitcase weights can be reomved if not needed.

From what I have seen, you have the skills to do something interesting.