Are we experiencing the death of the Diesel engine (small non commercial diesels)

[mikester]

I can't see small diesels disappearing from the market.

I can see small ICE gasoline motors being slowly replaced by battery-electric. For the average "homeowner" a battery chainsaw or weedeater will do the job.

In general I dislike small gas engines due to issues brought on with ethanol gasoline. I really dislike the ass wipes with loud exhaust systems, especially the ones operating their modded UTV's after 11pm.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

Decades ago B&S offered a 'lo-tone' muffler for the 8HP units. REALLY worked you could talk and cut at the same time. It did use up almost 1HP though, and on those engines that was very noticeable !!!

I HATE loud exhausts, wear protection when using my BX23S and never understood why 'hogs' get an exemption from the LAW.

CC tried a battery rider, as have others, dismal failure. Twice the initial cost, expensive batteries to replace,lousy REAL run time and LONG recharge time.

 

[WI_Hedgehog]

....The idea of higher costs is true of everything. My last gas tractor went up $500 a year and came with less stuff, cheaper transaxle, cheaper everything. I love steal tractors. Not much plastic on my b8200. ....

Taxes, government spending, regulations, and government printing money not backed by tangible assets (therefore devaluing the dollar), and then on the back side taxes and regulations again makes us more poor. Things don't cost "more" to make nowadays as technology is greatly advanced it's that taxes and forced inflation to pay for those who are leeches on society via welfare are robbing us blind.

Why compare only gas and diesel. Electric is starting to be the way to go for low hp / use items. A couple solar panels and no more fuel cost. No oil changes, problems from sitting like old fuel issues or emissions. Instant torque and no belts and gears for mower decks. I think Electric tractor sales will overtake the under 40hp machines in the not to distant future.

Because none of that is real, if it were people would heat their homes with electric instead of natural gas because it was more efficient, but in reality even for stationary applications where there are no batteries to haul nor the cost of maintaining batteries electricity is 3x more expensive than natural gas, and if we were still using oil it's 6x cheaper, and coal is 8x to 10x cheaper including the labor to maintain a coal burner.

The above spread in cost is much greater when you consider mobile applications and the cost of storing and converting one form of energy to another. There's a "sweet spot" on the source fuel curve: coal (toward the rudimentary end) burning tractors and trains are not as efficient as diesel because of the overhead of carrying the equipment to convert one form of energy to another, electric which is toward the other end of the scale (technologically advanced) is similarly expensive. The sweet spot lies in the simplicity in processing the fuel, and the simplicity in burning the fuel--where those two simplicites are maximized is where cost is minimal.

 

[Scm]

My personal opinion regarding "small engine choices" it is not really about what "We the people" want as much as it is what ".GOV" shoves down our collective throats,.......through regulations and taxes.

And since I no longer believe that we live in a "free market" , these companies have a vested interest in making things so that we can't work on or modify them.

Money = Power, so ALWAYS follow the money......

unfortunately, Kubota supports the UN SDGs (fossil fuels are bad), and the WEF (You'll own nothing and be happy) agenda, and if you dig a little Blackrock shows up

 

[The Evil Twin]

I'll consider the switch to electric when the entire federal fleet does. They don't believe their own song and dance. Do as we say. Not as we do.
Hell, the USDA deletes their own diesels.

 

[GrassLakeRon]

Taxes, government spending, regulations, and government printing money not backed by tangible assets (therefore devaluing the dollar), and then on the back side taxes and regulations again makes us more poor. Things don't cost "more" to make nowadays as technology is greatly advanced it's that taxes and forced inflation to pay for those who are leeches on society via welfare are robbing us blind.

Making a product with cheaper materials to maximize profits is not due to the government. It is due to GREED! Im not going to touch the anti-government BS.

 

[Scm]

It is due to GREED!

Blackrock, ($11.5 TRILLION market cap) a major investor in Kubota, via Aristotale; already basically controls our currency, they do not need more "money" (greed), They are after POWER. Providing you crappy products you cant fix perfectly fits into the "By 2030, You will own nothing and be happy" theme.

 

[The Evil Twin]

Blackrock, ($11.5 TRILLION market cap) a major investor in Kubota, via Aristotale; already basically controls our currency, they do not need more "money" (greed), They are after POWER. Providing you crappy products you cant fix perfectly fits into the "By 2030, You will own nothing and be happy" theme.

Try not paying your taxes and find out what you "own" now

 

[Scm]

Try not paying your taxes and find out what you "own" now

There are ways. Taxes ARE voluntary. Its all in WHO they apply too. When you understand that, they ARE voluntary.

 

[GrassLakeRon]

Blackrock, ($11.5 TRILLION market cap) a major investor in Kubota, via Aristotale; already basically controls our currency, they do not need more "money" (greed), They are after POWER. Providing you crappy products you cant fix perfectly fits into the "By 2030, You will own nothing and be happy" theme.

And Lizards run the government.....

Business always wants more money. Look at Apple.....

 

[Scm]

And Lizards run the government.....

Business always wants more money. Look at Apple.....

If Blackrock needs more money, they are the only non-banking company that can get free money directly from the federal reserve, they will just go there. Its easier than marketing to the people.

And no, its puppets that pretend to run the gov.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

It's a mute point that 'electric heat is more efficient'. 'more' ? OK , in theory it's 100%, but you must consider the cost to buy/install a plenum heater, upgrade the panel/service. My old furnace was 98% eff.So electric MIGHT gain 2%. Calculate how long it'll take the 'savings' to pay FOR the switch over.
I replaced a 97% eff gas furnace with a 94% one, 2 years ago.,80KBTU. I don't really see 'huge increase' in cost of gas and the house/vehicle insurances went down HUGE !!

 

[GreensvilleJay]

And Lizards run the government.....

Business always wants more money. Look at Apple.....

yup, make a phone for <$50, sell for $1,000 !!!! AND they've CONvinced you NEED to upgrade every year !!!!
Nice, scammers. I've got 40 year old laptops still working, doing what they were designed for....

 

[mikester]

Decades ago B&S offered a 'lo-tone' muffler for the 8HP units. REALLY worked you could talk and cut at the same time. It did use up almost 1HP though, and on those engines that was very noticeable !!!

I HATE loud exhausts, wear protection when using my BX23S and never understood why 'hogs' get an exemption from the LAW.

CC tried a battery rider, as have others, dismal failure. Twice the initial cost, expensive batteries to replace,lousy REAL run time and LONG recharge time.

Manufacturers need to be forced to a battery standard with certain sizes/capacities compatible with all manufacturers. Proprietary batteries with disabling tech should be illegal IMHO. That's the only way we are going to get widespread adoption - through standardization.

Having to carry Milwaukee, Dewalt, Stihl, etc batteries and chargers is a complete waste of money and an endless source of frustration.

Same goes with EV's. Time to stop playing silly buggers with cables, plugs, proprietary protocols, voltages, frequencies, etc

 

[Moose7060]

Blackrock, ($11.5 TRILLION market cap) a major investor in Kubota, via Aristotale; already basically controls our currency, they do not need more "money" (greed), They are after POWER. Providing you crappy products you cant fix perfectly fits into the "By 2030, You will own nothing and be happy" theme.

Blackrock market cap is 165 Billion. The assets under their management is 11.5 Trillion. Big difference.

 

[Tractor Gal]

My only response: Follow the money.

Tractor Gal

 

[Scm]

Blackrock market cap is 165 Billion. The assets under their management is 11.5 Trillion. Big difference.

You are correct, but does it make much difference? They still CONTROL 11.5 trillion of assets.
"He once said that companies “have to force behavior.”"

 

[Moose7060]

You are correct, but does it make much difference? They still CONTROL 11.5 trillion of assets.
"He once said that companies “have to force behavior.”"

Not to be argumentative but it does make some difference. Assets under management (AUM) does not necessarily give control. For example, if you held one million dollars of mutual funds and or stocks through an investment firm or bank, those assets would be considered AUM, but you control the buying and selling of them, not the firm or bank.

I would agree with you and the point you were making is that very large companies, and there are a lot more with higher market caps than blackrock, seem to have too much influence on policy and direction that governments around the world make. Money is power and power is influence.

 

[RCW]

Try not paying your taxes and find out what you "own" now

Isn't that the truth.....I just finished my first draft of our 2024 Federal/State Income taxes for the Mrs. and I.

Sad part is you get a look at your total personal tax liability for a year. The $$ figure is scary.

Given the timing, your note struck a chord with me........

Never seen anything voluntary about it....

To get back to the topic, I still think there's more motivation to eliminating smaller gasoline power plants than there is diesel.

I understand there's limitations to electrification in cold climates (where I am), but it doesn't seem to slow/halt the transition.

While outside of the smaller-HP equipment scenario, in NYS there's a mandate that all school buses be electric in the next few years.

I don't see them being useable in hilly rural areas (where I am), but the mandate still exists, as much as a mess it promises to be...... Vehicles are also 200-300% more than diesel-powered.

 

[Scm]

Not to be argumentative but it does make some difference. Assets under management (AUM) does not necessarily give control.

Maybe not direct control. but a company that is struggling, will change their policies if it means they will get someone to invest a lifeline in them. Its very hard to deny that happens.