B2150 won't crank, dash lights turn off when key is turned

[yodafixedmykubota]

I was out brush hogging with my B2150 on Saturday when it bogged down and died. When I went to restart it, it would not crank. When I turn the key to 'accessory' position, the dash lights up as normal. But when I turn the key to 'preheat' it kills all dash lights. I turn past preheat and no lights, no crank. When the key is turned and the lights cut out, I usually hear a click that sounds like a solenoid from under the dash, left side. (Doesn't sound as far down as the starter)

I did some "internet research", and found one cause of this could be a blown fusible link coming off the starter. I'm not able to find this fusible link. I'm not sure if it was deleted at some point. If anyone has a pic of what it looks like, I'd appreciate it.

Based on the results of my googling, I used a multimeter to determine that I have continuity and battery power from the starter to the wire that enters the ignition switch. I was about to buy a new ignition switch, but first thought to clean off the battery terminals real well. When I hooked the battery back up and turned the key I got the same results along with a fast clicking/whine (almost sounded like air being let out of a balloon). I freaked out, disconnected the battery and here I am. If anyone has a wiring diagram for a B2150 and/or any insight on what might be going on here, I thank you in advance for the help.

 

[Edke6bnl]

I think it would be good to put Multimeter on negative and positive on on starter at heavy wire and see what the voltage is with key on start and when key is in on position. To see if you have power to starter and load test of the wire to battery

 

[Henro]

I think it would be good to put Multimeter on negative and positive on on starter at heavy wire and see what the voltage is with key on start and when key is in on position. To see if you have power to starter and load test of the wire to battery

I would take it a step further and as the first check, I would put a volt meter on the terminals of the battery and see what happens when I tried to start the tractor.

Right on the terminals, not on the connectors or in the wiring elsewhere. It sounds very much like a battery problem. If the battery holds voltage and the lights go out when you try to start the engine, then it’s an issue separate from the battery and you can move on and troubleshoot it.

 

[Wayne gv]

I was out brush hogging with my B2150 on Saturday when it bogged down and died. When I went to restart it, it would not crank. When I turn the key to 'accessory' position, the dash lights up as normal. But when I turn the key to 'preheat' it kills all dash lights. I turn past preheat and no lights, no crank. When the key is turned and the lights cut out, I usually hear a click that sounds like a solenoid from under the dash, left side. (Doesn't sound as far down as the starter)

I did some "internet research", and found one cause of this could be a blown fusible link coming off the starter. I'm not able to find this fusible link. I'm not sure if it was deleted at some point. If anyone has a pic of what it looks like, I'd appreciate it.

Based on the results of my googling, I used a multimeter to determine that I have continuity and battery power from the starter to the wire that enters the ignition switch. I was about to buy a new ignition switch, but first thought to clean off the battery terminals real well. When I hooked the battery back up and turned the key I got the same results along with a fast clicking/whine (almost sounded like air being let out of a balloon). I freaked out, disconnected the battery and here I am. If anyone has a wiring diagram for a B2150 and/or any insight on what might be going on here, I thank you in advance for the help.

PTO engaged or pro safety switch bad.

 

[yodafixedmykubota]

I would take it a step further and as the first check, I would put a volt meter on the terminals of the battery and see what happens when I tried to start the tractor.

Right on the terminals, not on the connectors or in the wiring elsewhere. It sounds very much like a battery problem. If the battery holds voltage and the lights go out when you try to start the engine, then it’s an issue separate from the battery and you can move on and troubleshoot it.

But if the voltage on the battery dips while the key is turned to start then the battery's weak?

 

[yodafixedmykubota]

PTO engaged or pro safety switch bad.

PTO is disengaged. Where is the PTO safety switch located on these?

 

[PoTreeBoy]

I would take it a step further and as the first check, I would put a volt meter on the terminals of the battery and see what happens when I tried to start the tractor.

Right on the terminals, not on the connectors or in the wiring elsewhere. It sounds very much like a battery problem. If the battery holds voltage and the lights go out when you try to start the engine, then it’s an issue separate from the battery and you can move on and troubleshoot it.

Yes, either battery or battery cable/bad connection.

 

[Henro]

But if the voltage on the battery dips while the key is turned to start then the battery's weak?

Yes. If it drops enough for the dash lights to go out. If you measure a good battery when the engine is turning over, you likely would see a little drop in the measured voltage, but not enough to cause the lights to go out.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

re: I did some "internet research", and found one cause of this could be a blown fusible link coming off the starter.

This can't possibly 'kill the dash lights', so I suggest you get a new 'internet'

If it started fine recently, it's probably a bad primary battery cable,or a lousy connection
Simple test, remove battery, connect known good battery to where the primary cables are attached (NOT on the cables ! )

 

[Wull]

But if the voltage on the battery dips while the key is turned to start then the battery's weak?

unless the starter has failed and there is a short within it. To rule this out I’d apply voltage directly to the starter to see whether or not that works, if it does then the problem is elsewhere, if the starter doesn’t work then it’s the starter that has failed.

 

[Oleracer]

First check would be to test battery with a good load tester. Dont know how many customers i have had tear vehicles apart when its only the battery. They show 12.2-12.8 but under load drop under 9.

 

[Wull]

As above but also check the connections, make sure they are all good as well. If the battery checks out and the connections are good then check the starter.

 

[Henro]

First check would be to test battery with a good load tester. Dont know how many customers i have had tear vehicles apart when its only the battery. They show 12.2-12.8 but under load drop under 9.

I’m not disputing this advice.

I would point out though, that the tractor in question definitely has some kind of a problem. When you try to start the engine while measuring voltage at the battery terminals, you are essentially performing a load test on the battery. This is about the easiest first thing one can do.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

It's also testing the condition of the primary power cables...aka 'battery cables' as well as their connections.
ANY of the 3 will result in 'no start'.

 

[Ktrim]

Load test battery 1st. Sudden issues when it's been working fine generally turn out to be battery. Lost a tie bar or cell

 

[Wayne gv]

PTO is disengaged. Where is the PTO safety switch located on these?

On the left side down low. Try two things first sit on the seat turn the key on to start position then move the pro handle(s) slightly forward and backward. #2 same procedure move the hst pedal slightly in both directions. See if it try’s to start.

 

[yodafixedmykubota]

Finally got around to working on this last night. Thanks to everybody for your input so far. I haven't done a proper load test on the battery yet. But I think I'm cornering it...

When the battery has been disconnected, all lights come on in their turn but when the key is turned to "start" they all click off and the symptom resumes.
Now upon turning key, Light to middle oil pressure light comes on slowly then power light comes on.
With voltage meter on battery terminals reading is between 12 and 13 with no change when key is turned.
With voltage meter on pos and negative of starter , voltage is between 12 and 13 with key in accessory pos., when key is turned to preheat the needle drops to just above 0 (aprox 1 volt)
When key is turned to start voltage drops all the way to 0.

When I turn the key to off, there's a buzzing sound under the dash which I isolated to a relay. I googled the part number and it comes up as the starter timer relay. I called the local Kubota dealership and described the problem and explained the above. They said it's probably the "OPC timer". I gave the guy in Parts the part number and it's location on the tractor he said that's the OPC timer.

I found an very similar relay online DENSO 061700-3771 . The (very patient) guy in Kubota's part's dept. said that's properly just an updated version of the same part.

My questions to you all are:
do the symptoms seem consistent with a starter relay/opc timer swich?and does anyone know if the 061700-3771 will replace the 061700-2990?

 

[007kubotaguy]

Finally got around to working on this last night. Thanks to everybody for your input so far. I haven't done a proper load test on the battery yet. But I think I'm cornering it...

When the battery has been disconnected, all lights come on in their turn but when the key is turned to "start" they all click off and the symptom resumes.
Now upon turning key, Light to middle oil pressure light comes on slowly then power light comes on.
With voltage meter on battery terminals reading is between 12 and 13 with no change when key is turned.
With voltage meter on pos and negative of starter , voltage is between 12 and 13 with key in accessory pos., when key is turned to preheat the needle drops to just above 0 (aprox 1 volt)
When key is turned to start voltage drops all the way to 0.

When I turn the key to off, there's a buzzing sound under the dash which I isolated to a relay. I googled the part number and it comes up as the starter timer relay. I called the local Kubota dealership and described the problem and explained the above. They said it's probably the "OPC timer". I gave the guy in Parts the part number and it's location on the tractor he said that's the OPC timer.

I found an very similar relay online DENSO 061700-3771 . The (very patient) guy in Kubota's part's dept. said that's properly just an updated version of the same part.

My questions to you all are:
do the symptoms seem consistent with a starter relay/opc timer swich?and does anyone know if the 061700-3771 will replace the 061700-2990?




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Where do you have your voltmeter attached? Are you attaching it directly to the battery post for to the battery terminal for elsewhere? I would suspect dirty battery cables.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

If the primary battery cables look remotely like the wires in the picture, I suspect they're very corroded. ANY water getting into the 'core' of the cables will rot them 'inside-out' and allow 'surface' voltage to be read but not allow current to flow.
Always start at the source
... battery---> is it fully charged ? Maybe swap in a good KNOWN battery .
If battery's good,
inspect primary cables, replace if questionable. They have to pass 100s of amps,briefly, but it's still a LOT of electrons to pass.

 

[yodafixedmykubota]

I wanted to take the time to close the loop on this thread. @GreensvilleJay battery cables seemed to be the culprit. I had continuity from the starter to parts of the battery cable terminals (but not other parts.) After shining up the entire surface of the inside of the battery clamps and the wire terminals at the starter, it fired up like a champ. @Oleracer " Dont know how many customers i have had tear vehicles apart when its only the battery " I was quickly going down this road. I appreciate everyone's advice on here. I don't like having to admit being stymied by such a simple problem. But I've said in the past "public embarrassment is the best teacher". With that I thank you all, eat my crow, and go off to finish my mowing.