Do you have a certificate of Origin?

[DustyRusty]

Just wondering how many people who own their tractors outright (not financed) have asked their dealer for the Certificate of Origin? Since most tractors are not titled, the Certificate of Origin is the only way that I know of that will prove your ownership right quickly and positively. When I purchased my BX23S used, the seller wasn't able to prove to me that he truly owned it outright, but when I called the selling dealer he confirmed that it was paid for in full upon purchase. I asked the dealer for the Certificate of Origin, and he gave it to me in blank and signed by the sales manager of the dealership. Kubota Credit will not give you any information should you ask if the tractor is financed, and will hang up on you the moment you ask the question. I know because I tried going that route first before going to the selling dealer. The only other thing that I could do would be to request if there was a lien registered to the owner of the tractor. Lien recordings are not always easy to find.

 

[GeoHorn]

All you need is a Bill of Sale identifying the tractor by serial and description (make/model/color/equipment) and the sellers’ photo-ID or on dealers letterhead.

A “cert of origin” is usually only for the purposes of obtaining Title in your state,…such as for a trailer….. and as you noted, tractors are not titled.

If you are buying from an individual or auction… you can ask your sheriff to run it on NCIC to make certain it isn’t reported stolen. This also documents with law enforcement that you’ve attempted to verify your ownership (evidence). If accepting a Bill of Sale from an individual… be CERTAIN the Bill of Sale STIPULATES that it is sold free and clear of all encumbrances and that seller will be responsible to take all steps necessary to perfect the sale. (You don’t want to discover two years later there is a mechanics or other lien on the tractor.)

Be aware the sale is likely governed by the state in which the transaction occurs unless otherwise stated on the document. If buying out of state this might require you to travel to that state to contest any issues later discovered. The bill of sale can stipulate where the sale is enforceable.

 

[mikester]

I thought you were asking about this

NAFTA Certificate of Origin

Securing America's Borders

www.cbp.gov

.

Bill of sale proves farm equipment ownership in Ontario

 

[NCL4701]

Have bill of sale. No Certificate of Origin. Courts in NC want bill of sale and, only if that’s questioned, paper trail showing the money listed on the bill of sale actually changed hands. Possession, tax records, maintenance records; all that sort of thing comes into play if there’s a question of ownership.

So far as being stolen, as another poster stated, request law enforcement check NCIC.

Liens you can check UCC, which is likely to pick up bank financing but unlikely to pick up mechanic liens.

If a deal feels sketchy I’d skip it. If the level of assurance provided by practical due diligence on deals with individuals isn’t sufficient for you, stick to auctions and dealers. Problem with dealing with individuals on small deals (under $100k or so) is you’re either going to put down a deposit to hold it while you research and lose your deposit if you don’t like what you find, or it will be gone by the time you get back even if that’s only 30 minutes. Maybe that’s different in other areas.

That and personally I wouldn’t buy from an individual in another state without going through a dealer, auction site, or some sort of broker. Laws from state to state vary tremendously, I’m comfortable with my understanding of pertinent NC law but it ends there, and both criminal and civil stuff gets really messy when it involves interstate commerce.

 

[fried1765]

Have bill of sale. No Certificate of Origin. Courts in NC want bill of sale and, only if that’s questioned, paper trail showing the money listed on the bill of sale actually changed hands. Possession, tax records, maintenance records; all that sort of thing comes into play if there’s a question of ownership.

So far as being stolen, as another poster stated, request law enforcement check NCIC.

Liens you can check UCC, which is likely to pick up bank financing but unlikely to pick up mechanic liens.

If a deal feels sketchy I’d skip it. If the level of assurance provided by practical due diligence on deals with individuals isn’t sufficient for you, stick to auctions and dealers. Problem with dealing with individuals on small deals (under $100k or so) is you’re either going to put down a deposit to hold it while you research and lose your deposit if you don’t like what you find, or it will be gone by the time you get back even if that’s only 30 minutes. Maybe that’s different in other areas.

That and personally I wouldn’t buy from an individual in another state without going through a dealer, auction site, or some sort of broker. Laws from state to state vary tremendously, I’m comfortable with my understanding of pertinent NC law but it ends there, and both criminal and civil stuff gets really messy when it involves interstate commerce.

"I wouldn't buy from an individual in another state without going through a dealer"

In 2019, I bought my 251 hour 2006 L48 TLB from a private party, (350 miles away) in a different state.
Owner/seller bought from a dealer local to him, but I did not feel the need to contact that dealer.
Seller was the original buyer........13 years prior.
Should I be concerned?
I think not!

Seller was afflicted with Parkinson's, and could no longer use the machine.
Was a small, high end, custom home builder.
He gave me a handwritten bill of sale.

I was very comfortable with the purchase, and nearly 5 years later,..... I still am!
IMHO, nearly 70 year old "Mainiacs", are a very safe bet to not steal other folks tractors!

My exceptionally low hour L48 TLB is a WONDERFUL machine!

 

[Hkb82]

I did receive something from kubota when I was finished payments but it wasn’t a certificate of origin I don’t think. I don’t know if this is a thing in Canada or not.

 

[GeoHorn]

I did receive something from kubota when I was finished payments but it wasn’t a certificate of origin I don’t think. I don’t know if this is a thing in Canada or not.

Probably a “release of lien” or a Receipt/Paid in Full. Don’t lose it. (scan and email it to yourself is a good way to keep it forever.)

 

[NCL4701]

"I wouldn't buy from an individual in another state without going through a dealer"

In 2019, I bought my 251 hour 2006 L48 TLB from a private party, (350 miles away) in a different state.
Owner/seller bought from a dealer local to him, but I did not feel the need to contact that dealer.
My seller was the original buyer.
Should I be concerned?
I think not!

Seller was afflicted with Parkinson's, and could no longer use the machine.
Was a small, high end, custom home builder.
He gave me a handwritten bill of sale.

I was very comfortable with the sale, and nearly 5 years later,..... I still am!
IMHO, nearly 70 year old "Mainiacs", are a very safe bet to not steal other folks tractors!

No argument YOU or anyone else shouldn’t do it. The real point is different people have different risk tolerances. My risk tolerance doesn’t cross state lines on equipment purchases without involvement of a reputable dealer or auction house. If your risk tolerance dictates otherwise, good on you and glad it worked out for you.

 

[Daferris]

Michigan, New LX2610 cash sale nothing from the dealer but a bill of sale. No title or MSO in Michigan.

 

[GrizBota]

None for the tractors, but I never asked. I’ve gotten them on ATVs (without asking) when purchased new. Many years ago Oregon would issue a title, like a car, if you wanted to go through the optional process. But not anymore.

 

[hagrid]

"I wouldn't buy from an individual in another state without going through a dealer"

In 2019, I bought my 251 hour 2006 L48 TLB from a private party, (350 miles away) in a different state.
Owner/seller bought from a dealer local to him, but I did not feel the need to contact that dealer.
Seller was the original buyer........13 years prior.
Should I be concerned?
I think not!

Wow... talk about small worlds.

Before I was forced into BX shame I had a 2006 L48 TLB with only 246hrs on it stolen from our small horse farm.

If you see it advertised, give me a holler plz. I'd really like to have my real tractor back instead of the riding mower I have now.

 

[fried1765]

Wow... talk about small worlds.

Before I was forced into BX shame I had a 2006 L48 TLB with only 246hrs on it stolen from our small horse farm.

If you see it advertised, give me a holler plz. I'd really like to have my real tractor back instead of the riding mower I have now.

I feel 4 Ya ....
The L48 TLB is one mighty fine (irreplaceable) machine!

My L48 lives in a locked windowless metal building, (for Winter) with enough other big stuff stored behind it to make theft very difficult.
I recently learned here on OTT, to store both my L48 and Ford 1920, with the PTO engaged.
Likely a thief would not figure that out.

Some of us on here, often forget that an engaged PTO is a very common no start issue.

P.S. I have a SCAG ZTR mower, and absolutely love it.
Long ago..... I gave up (to son) my JD lawn tractor for mowing!

P.P.S. I do often look around on the internet at both L48s, and M62s.
If I stumble upon a 2006 L48, I will definitely contact you.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

hmm..if you have insurance on your tractor, I assume you've sent them the serial numbers to them ?
My BX23S had serial numbers on tractor, loader frame, bucket, BH and BH bucket.

 

[fried1765]

hmm..if you have insurance on your tractor, I assume you've sent them the serial numbers to them ?
My BX23S had serial numbers on tractor, loader frame, bucket, BH and BH bucket.

I carry "replacement value" coverage on everything I own.
It is kinda pricey, but had a major fire loss in 1987, and still estimate that I can pay (ever increasing) premiums until at least 2062 (I'd be 122?) before the insurance company will become the winner.

 

[DustyRusty]

Michigan, New LX2610 cash sale nothing from the dealer but a bill of sale. No title or MSO in Michigan.

You can get a certificate of origin by requesting it from the selling dealer. They don't ever offer it to you, you must make the specific request for one.