Mower Deck Bogs Down

us027274

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Equipment
BX2370
Mar 21, 2023
17
5
3
Florida
BAP - On the filter: Changed at every 200 hour service. Coming up on 1000 here shortly. On the screen, same thing. I haven't seen anything that suggests 10 hours. Easy check, can't hurt.

Greenville: No Ford action errors here. I'm a Jeep guy!
 

BAP

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2012 Kubota 2920, 60MMM, FEL, BH65 48" Bush Hog, 60"Backblade, B2782B Snowblower
Dec 31, 2012
2,742
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New Hampshire
BAP - On the filter: Changed at every 200 hour service. Coming up on 1000 here shortly. On the screen, same thing. I haven't seen anything that suggests 10 hours. Easy check, can't hurt.

Greenville: No Ford action errors here. I'm a Jeep guy!
I’m not saying that you need to do it every 10 hours, but if you haven’t done it very recently then I would do it. It is the easiest thing that you can do to eliminate a possible cause. Plus, if something is deteriorating inside, you will probably find pieces of it stuck to the screen.
 

us027274

New member

Equipment
BX2370
Mar 21, 2023
17
5
3
Florida
I’m not saying that you need to do it every 10 hours, but if you haven’t done it very recently then I would do it. It is the easiest thing that you can do to eliminate a possible cause. Plus, if something is deteriorating inside, you will probably find pieces of it stuck to the screen.
Excellent points. Thanks!
 

us027274

New member

Equipment
BX2370
Mar 21, 2023
17
5
3
Florida
Update: First, I ordered a test gauge for the main hydraulic pressure, that which runs the front implements. It came with shims, in case an adjustment was needed. Pressure was about 50 pounds below the minimum threshold. Easy fix with shims.

Second, I ordered a gauge that goes up to 300 lbs for the clutch circuit, and stopped by my local Kubota dealer for a hose and an adaptor. Clutch pressure should be between 150 and 180 pounds per the manual. It is at about 45 lbs.

Which leads me to think the PTO clutch relief valve has an issue. Problem is you can't get the thing out without dropping the engine.

Digging around on youtube I found a vid where the guy notched out the frame to get to the valve. It was clogged. He cleaned it and put it back, issue fixed. I'm considering trying that, but thought I'd come back to the group for advice before hand. Thoughts?

One more comment. I mowed two days ago and paid particularly close attention to symptoms. Recapping and adding more:

1) The PTO starts off when it is cold just fine. Engages quickly, no bogging. 5 minutes or so into mowing . . .

2) Slightly heavy grass the blade speed slows down. Reconfirming, the driveshaft is slowing down. the belt is not slipping, the engine maintains speed.

3) Mowing downhill the blade speed slows down.

4) Level ground and uphill, the blade speeds back up, until you hit heavy grass.

5) Re-engagement, if you've disengaged the PTO, moves from a second or two to about 7 seconds.

My guess is the above mentioned valve starts off clean, then gets clogged again. Going downhill for some reason makes it worse. Level ground some of the clog clears out.

I don't know. Grasping at straws. I don't have any interest in dropping the transaxle. Lot, lot of work. Dealer however will slam me if they do it.

Sidebar: I thought I'd price a trade-in just out of curiosity. Wow, you can't get a new one. He said Kubota is not building or delivering right now. I thought they are in the middle of a platform modification.
 

dlsmith

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BX2230, LA211
Nov 15, 2018
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My local dealer here in northern Indiana has a lot full of equipment, I counted 9 BX models when I was there last week.
 

us027274

New member

Equipment
BX2370
Mar 21, 2023
17
5
3
Florida
Update: I notched the frame and removed the PTO clutch relief valve. It did not appear to be clogged. I cleaned it with compressed air and it was flowing nicely. Reinstalled.

Now pressure is even lower, PTO takes even longer to engage and it bogs down under any grass.

I did not replace the o-rings. They looked fine. I always have trouble matching o-rings. Ace is the only place nearby that carries them.

Thoughts?

Updated update: I pulled the PTO clutch valve again, closely inspected o-rings, they look good (doesn't mean they are), cleaned everything up well then coated the o-rings with a little dielectric grease, which was suggested somewhere. Reassembled. This time it engaged in about 4 second. I mowed and for 5 minutes it mowed great, then back to old habits.

This would happen before. After it warms up it acts up. I'd like to pull the PTO clutch pressure relief valve and see if it is maybe stuck open but I can't figure out where it is, and I'm guessing it's hidden behind the frame. Manual doesn't do a very good job of helping me locate it.

So I'm down to replacing the o-rings on the clutch valve as a last step but need to know the size. Anyone have any idea? I can't find it in the manual. Thanks.


AND, UPDATE ON THE UPDATE ON THE UPDATE!

FIXED!!!!!

Took the valve to ACE and picked out replacement 0-rings. Mowed for an hour without incident. Heavy grass and downhill. Did everything I could think of to stall it. Couldn't make it stall.

Wow! I'd forgotten what it was like to mow and not baby it. It still takes 3-4 seconds to engage, but I can live with that. Taking the win!
 
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Runs With Scissors

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L2501 TLB , Grappel, Brush Hog, Box Blade, Ballast box, Forks, Tiller, PH digger
Jan 25, 2023
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Michigan
Update: I notched the frame and removed the PTO clutch relief valve. It did not appear to be clogged. I cleaned it with compressed air and it was flowing nicely. Reinstalled.

Now pressure is even lower, PTO takes even longer to engage and it bogs down under any grass.

I did not replace the o-rings. They looked fine. I always have trouble matching o-rings. Ace is the only place nearby that carries them.

Thoughts?

Updated update: I pulled the PTO clutch valve again, closely inspected o-rings, they look good (doesn't mean they are), cleaned everything up well then coated the o-rings with a little dielectric grease, which was suggested somewhere. Reassembled. This time it engaged in about 4 second. I mowed and for 5 minutes it mowed great, then back to old habits.

This would happen before. After it warms up it acts up. I'd like to pull the PTO clutch pressure relief valve and see if it is maybe stuck open but I can't figure out where it is, and I'm guessing it's hidden behind the frame. Manual doesn't do a very good job of helping me locate it.

So I'm down to replacing the o-rings on the clutch valve as a last step but need to know the size. Anyone have any idea? I can't find it in the manual. Thanks.


AND, UPDATE ON THE UPDATE ON THE UPDATE!

FIXED!!!!!

Took the valve to ACE and picked out replacement 0-rings. Mowed for an hour without incident. Heavy grass and downhill. Did everything I could think of to stall it. Couldn't make it stall.

Wow! I'd forgotten what it was like to mow and not baby it. It still takes 3-4 seconds to engage, but I can live with that. Taking the win!
Great post!

Thanks for posting results and the "blow by blow" troubleshooting.

Most of it is foreign to me; However, I'm quite sure it will help someone in the future.
 

us027274

New member

Equipment
BX2370
Mar 21, 2023
17
5
3
Florida
And it's not fixed. Mowed this afternoon, back to its old bad habits.

No idea what to do now. Dealer will probably have it 4 plus weeks. I guess I'll limp through the rest of the mowing season then take it to them.
 

GreensvilleJay

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BX23-S,57 A-C D-14,58 A-C D-14, 57 A-C D-14,tiller,cults,Millcreek 25G spreader,
Apr 2, 2019
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Greensville,Ontario,Canada
OK, how about ordering the correct Kubota o-ring ? I tried looking it up ,got 'lost' again in the cdn website version....so I can't SEE a drawing of what you're actually replacing....sigh......
 

us027274

New member

Equipment
BX2370
Mar 21, 2023
17
5
3
Florida
OK, how about ordering the correct Kubota o-ring ? I tried looking it up ,got 'lost' again in the cdn website version....so I can't SEE a drawing of what you're actually replacing....sigh......
I'd do so if I could figure it out. I called one of the Kubota parts guys and they couldn't find it either.

Honestly, I'm pretty much dead on with the o-rings I found at ACE. Something else is going on. If somebody comes up with something brilliant, let me know. Otherwise, when the dealer figures it out, I'll let everyone know what it was.
 

GrizBota

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L3830HST/LA724, B2601/LA435/RCK54-32, RCR1872, CDI 66”grapple, pallet forks
Apr 26, 2023
1,153
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113
Oregon
My local dealer here in northern Indiana has a lot full of equipment, I counted 9 BX models when I was there last week.
I was at my dealer in Oregon about two weeks ago. Lots on new orange equipment for sale.

OP, good luck with sorting out the problem. Not to fire the parts canon too early, but have you considered replacing the clutch valve itself? I suspect the dealer will do at least that and the pressure relief valve. I’ll bet they charge a pretty penny for their labor, to the extent the parts are nearly ancillary in cost.
 

us027274

New member

Equipment
BX2370
Mar 21, 2023
17
5
3
Florida
I was at my dealer in Oregon about two weeks ago. Lots on new orange equipment for sale.

OP, good luck with sorting out the problem. Not to fire the parts canon too early, but have you considered replacing the clutch valve itself? I suspect the dealer will do at least that and the pressure relief valve. I’ll bet they charge a pretty penny for their labor, to the extent the parts are nearly ancillary in cost.
eeeee-Yup! I expect replacing the clutch valve requires dropping the transmission. I'll get slammed by the dealer.

It's still a lot cheaper than a new tractor! At least that's what I keep telling myself.
 

us027274

New member

Equipment
BX2370
Mar 21, 2023
17
5
3
Florida
All: Help needed! Read above. I couldn't fix this so I took it to the dealer. Just got the quote to repair, and they are suggesting a little over $ 6K! Ouch!

Clutch pressure seems to be the confirmed culprit. Clutch pressure is around 20 psi. Should be between 150 and 180. This I already knew. The rest of the quote is they are assuming they will need to completely rebuild the clutch while they are in there. They don't know for certain the clutch is bad, just assuming.

My question: At first I thought there was a separate pump for this circuit, but reading the manual more closely there is not. If there were a problem with the clutch, could that cause the pressure in the circuit to drop so drastically? First thing I'd suspect would be the PTO clutch valve, which I've already pulled and cleaned.

Note also that this same circuit runs the power steering and the 3 point hitch. Both those work fine. Both of those have flow rates in spec per the dealer. So that part of the circuit seems fine. It's just when you open the PTO clutch valve, you are not getting enough flow through that circuit. Seems like something may be blocking that circuit.

Thoughts? I could be way off base. Thanks!
 
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us027274

New member

Equipment
BX2370
Mar 21, 2023
17
5
3
Florida
Update: The dealer swapped out the PTO valve, at my suggestion, no change. Still very low pressure readings on the PTO circuit. Pressure and flow in the steering, bucket and 3 point hitch circuit are perfect, no issue.

Next step, pull the transmission and rebuild the PTO. Cost, pushing $ 8K. Wow!

Their suggestion: this may not be the most cost-effective move. If I have it repaired the PTO may be working again, but tractor has 1000 hours on it and is a 2015. They suspect something else may come up and I'll be pouring money into a sinking ship. They've offered $ 2K in trade.

Not sure I 100% agree, but there is some logic to what they say.

So, repair it? Sell it? Trade it? At this point I plan to pick it back up and use it a bit, resolving this somehow before summer gets here. Both PTO's still work, but they are pretty undependable. I'm wondering if I can sell it to someone who just wants it for bucket and 3-point work (I did exactly that with my first one). Those still work perfectly fine.

Thoughts? Thanks.
 
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us027274

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BX2370
Mar 21, 2023
17
5
3
Florida
Epilogue: In case anyone is interested, issue is fixed. The PTO clutch was smoked. Pretty much no material left on the clutch pads. Even the shaft was out of spec. Bearing would just spin around on the shaft.

It overheated.

Took it to a second dealer for diagnosis and quote and they figured it out right away. $ 4600 instead of nearly $ 8K. Rebuilt and back at home. Works great now!
 
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Runs With Scissors

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L2501 TLB , Grappel, Brush Hog, Box Blade, Ballast box, Forks, Tiller, PH digger
Jan 25, 2023
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113
Michigan
Epilogue: In case anyone is interested, issue is fixed. The PTO clutch was smoked. Pretty much no material left on the clutch pads. Even the shaft was out of spec. Bearing would just spin around on the shaft.

It overheated.

Took it to a second dealer for diagnosis and quote and they figured it out right away. $ 4600 instead of nearly $ 8K. Rebuilt and back at home. Works great now!
Sorry to hear about the bad news, but glad you got it fixed.

( and thanks for posting your results.) (y)
 
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John D 2

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B2601 LA435 loader, 54inch MMM, carry all, boom pole, fertilizer spreader.
Jun 6, 2023
136
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Texas
Thanks for keeping us updated.

Glad to hear it's fixed.