Backhoe issue?

[BAP]

I would find a different dealer even though you think they are reputable. Cylinders shouldn’t leak down in short time. If they are telling you that it is normal, then they they have no clue on what they are doing. You either have a cylinder with internal leaking seals, or bad valves. If your machine is still under warranty I would keep hounding to get it fixed even if it means finding a new dealer. Tell your friend the dealer that you know they are talking BS when they tell you that it is normal operation and that you want them to fix it.

 

[TheOldHokie]

I would find a different dealer even though you think they are reputable. Cylinders shouldn’t leak down in short time. If they are telling you that it is normal, then they they have no clue on what they are doing. You either have a cylinder with internal leaking seals, or bad valves. If your machine is still under warranty I would keep hounding to get it fixed even if it means finding a new dealer. Tell your friend the dealer that you know they are talking BS when they tell you that it is normal operation and that you want them to fix it.

It would be nice to have actual.measurements of the leak down rate. Right now all we have is a rather subjective and imprecise descriptuon. How short is short?

Park it and measure cylinder movement over a 5 minute period. Direction and distance moved will allow for a less subjective evaluation. I assume that is the data the dealer is using as a basis for their evaluation.

Dan

 

[fried1765]

The word normal leave a bit to be desired. Is it "normal" for an engine to burn oil? According to Ford, Gm and all the rest - sure! If not faster than "X" per "x" k miles.

Is it normal for an outrigger to ease down when NOT IN USE? sure ......... but IN USE? NO not normal at all.

Is it normal for the backhoe to swing, or dipper stick fall a bit over time - sure - but the RATE of time you are describing does NOT sound normal. You may need a couple of cylinders rebuilt or seals repaired

Yup!

 

[GSD-Keegan]

Same tractor and back hoe. I don’t experience a leak down that fast.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Yup!

Really?

1. ALL spool valves leak. Thats a fact.
2. Manufacturers publish spool leakage data and a typical leakage rate for a commercial grade directional control valve valve would be 5-10 cc/minute @1500 PSI. Thats a fact
3. At 5/cc per minute a loaded 2" cylinder will retract 1.5" in a 5 minute period. Extension (sag) will be roughly twice that. Thats simple arithmetic.

If your application cannot tolerate that level of creep you typically resort to a double pilot operated check valve that is essentially leak free.

Dan

 

[Henro]

...You either have a cylinder with internal leaking seals, or bad valves...

I get the bad valve(s) point, but could you explain how a system with good valves (absolutely leak free spools for discussion purposes) would experience a cylinder retracting IF internal seals were leaking? With the valves centered of course.

My understanding is this cannot happen to any significant degree. I do like to learn new things though and readjust my thinking...

 

[top gnome]

I traded up to a B2601 with FEL and BH70 backhoe a little over a year ago and overall have been very happy with the tractor. The question I have is with the hydraulics in the backhoe. I find myself having to constantly reset the outriggers while I'm digging. Also, I find that if I turn around and use the FEL to move or get rid of the spoils, it's an absolute necessity to install the retainer pin to keep the boom in place. Otherwise, it leaks down in a very short amount of time and the bucket will even bottom out if at the base of a steep incline. I realize it's a single pump, small hydraulic system. But definitely seems like it bleeds off extremely quickly. If I park it and don't use the pin overnight, the hoe will certainly be resting on the ground in the morning. Is this normal? I've had it in for warranty repair at a very reputable (friend owned) dealer twice. They've told me it is operating correctly. Am I expecting too much? Any feedback on would be very much appreciated.

I have a new b2301 ( Jan 2022) and without the pin the bucket will be on the ground overnight. I think it is normal. the stabilizers do not lower at all even over several days in fact with the back hoe off all winter last year they never moved.

 

[fried1765]

I have a new b2301 ( Jan 2022) and without the pin the bucket will be on the ground overnight. I think it is normal. the stabilizers do not lower at all even over several days in fact with the back hoe off all winter last year they never moved.

I never pin my dipper/bucket up.
When stored, or on the trailer, my BH bucket is always in the completely relaxed position.
My stabilizers will leak down over several weeks.

 

[Quick]

I traded up to a B2601 with FEL and BH70 backhoe a little over a year ago and overall have been very happy with the tractor. The question I have is with the hydraulics in the backhoe. I find myself having to constantly reset the outriggers while I'm digging. Also, I find that if I turn around and use the FEL to move or get rid of the spoils, it's an absolute necessity to install the retainer pin to keep the boom in place. Otherwise, it leaks down in a very short amount of time and the bucket will even bottom out if at the base of a steep incline. I realize it's a single pump, small hydraulic system. But definitely seems like it bleeds off extremely quickly. If I park it and don't use the pin overnight, the hoe will certainly be resting on the ground in the morning. Is this normal? I've had it in for warranty repair at a very reputable (friend owned) dealer twice. They've told me it is operating correctly. Am I expecting too much? Any feedback on would be very much appreciated.

What you've described is not normal. I have the same tractor, FEL, and BH. Can run the tractor with boom pin out for hours without an issue. No outrigger leakage either.

Bad dealer advise.

 

[Quick]

I never pin my bucket up.

I don't think anyone does. (-;

 

[fried1765]

I don't think anyone does. (-;

I do not pin the dipper..... (with bucket attached)!

 

[MapleLeafFarmer]

long time BH and excavator operator here.... as I read through this thread 2 things come to my mind:

1. how many hours use are on the machine. Experience tells me higher use machines tend to leak down quicker. {{ie: I leak constantly}}

2. the OP says he experiences "... constant bouncing from digging ". Don't want to sound rude but to me this is equipment abuse. BH use should be a smooth operation. Constant bouncing is very problematic to both the equipment and the operator.

Constant bouncing that the OP says he does can cause significant shock loads on all sorts of parts on equipment. It breaks stuff. When I was young I would have been fired for bouncing / abusing equipment. Now that I am old with much old equipment and I have to pay the bills myself I would never bounce my equipment. Bad things happen quickly when bouncing happens.

<<un-mounts high horse and goes for lunch>>
cheers